Scene security

[cas2383 22]

Today's events in Mt. Vernon raise a good question. What does your Dept. do to keep the scene safe? Being that someone stole a firetruck and could have easily killed one of a number of people if they weren't trained to operate that equipment, not to mention the effect it has on the fire outcome, it does seem pretty important to consider scene security. Granted Mt. Vernon isnt the only place its happend some places I've read about even have had their rigs stolen from the firehouse. Just wonder again what everyone does for scene security as well as maybe perhaps security at the station, maybe someone out there can offer up some good tips on the situation from personal experience...?

Edited February 18, 2006 by cas2383

[x242Steve 1]

I know in many municipalities it is standard for the police to be stationed right in front of the nearest hydrant...

Sorry to our friends in blue!! I know many of you were thinking the same!

But seriously, it is always good to notify the PD of any major fire activity... you never know what kind of maniacs either...

1) Live in the fire building

2) Are trying to get into the fire building

3) Set the fire building ON fire

etc...

Every city has certain neighborhoods/buildings where PD response to a fire scene are more or less appropriate... That's not to say that they aren't needed at a mansion fire in horse country, but that should be part of size-up by the OIC, is to determine what sort of PD response is warranted.

Edited February 18, 2006 by 242steve

[bob803 1]

Does MVFD keep the driver with the rig or could manpower be at issue.

[cas2383 22]

I know in PC and Fairfield we try to keep an operator with the rig as much as possible, which in reality is suprisingly good, i'd say 99 % of the time. As for the fire stations, we keep them locked with a key at all times in PC; and FFld is accesible through a punch-in code lock. All though the locks are very innefective in thwarting vandalism and theives if the bay doors are open... lol. I guess there are trade offs.

As for fire scenes: I say Police presences can never be enough. Whether it is slowing down that speeding motorist going by an accident to a fire alarm with a door open to a working fire. Immediate PD presence obviously stops theives if not on the spot a block away as we saw in Mt Vernon today. That is much better than finding your apparatus wrecked down the road or finding out theres tools missing or even worse: it was used to commit other crimes.

Edited February 18, 2006 by cas2383

[ONLOCATION 24]

Some Deparments around don't even recieve PD response to incidents, well the majority do but I have been to some scenes and not seen there presence. Fortunatly in the Town I'm in the FD really gets respected by the Community. have had Bay Doors open in the "not so good" areas for peroids of time when hanging out and for alarms and its fine. Never had a problem.

As far as Scenes are concerned Apparatus Operators are not to leave truck unattended at any time, unless replaced by another Qualified operator. Also scene is Secured by Fire Police Personnel.

[IzzyEng4 427]

Up here is just like what Cas said, we have an operator with the truck. Very rarely do we leave ther truck unless it is right up at the scene and there are other members around to watch it if all the crew has to go into a building. Like I said this is very very rare. We are very fortunate to have a very good fire-police unit securing the scene and the police department also responds with at least one or two officers when it is a working call.

[hudson144 150]

THE CHAUFFER WILL STAY WITH THE RIG IF THE STICK IS GOING TO BE UTILIZED,HE IS ASSIGNED FIREGROUND TASKS AND TOOLS AND GENERALLY DOES NOT GO BACK TO THE RIG UNTIL HE IS TOLD TO GO AND PREPARE TO PUT IT UP. IN THIS CASE THE MEMBERS OF L-3 WERE INSIDE ATTEMPTING TO FIGHT THE FIRE,SCENE SECURITY IS AN ISSUE HERE,HE SHOULD NOT HAVE THE CHANCE TO DO WHAT HE DID!

[PCFD-2393 0]

Unfortunately,this is not the first case of this happening in West Chester...

In the past, ambulances,Fire vehicles,& PD vehicles have been taken in my town.

ALL recovered right a way..But you never know. Could every city/town handle an incident where a piece of front-line apparatus is lost???At the scene??

This should be a reminder to everyone to watch your backs,never know what "Nut"

is around....

Scene security is of upmost importance at "EVERY" scene.

In this day ,scene security is a must...ALL the time,everone must be on the look-out..

The PD's role is traffic,crowd control,scene safety,documentation of any entry into an unoccupied premise and any other assistance that they can render.

It must be remembered,that at anytime or place, a driver whether drunk or otherwise may drive right into the scene..This has happened in many places,striking members,apparatus or running over hoselines,which can severly hamper your operation,and endanger us even more....

WATCH YOU BACK!! & EACHOTHER'S ALWAYS !!!

Every Dept.Must have a good working relationship with the PD,and establish a SOP to address everyones concerns..If this is not in place,have your Chief's set it up...If everyone knows whats up,than the job will get taken care much smoothly..Get everyone on the same page,it helps...

We all know that the first few moments at any scene can be hectic,so don't expect everything to go smoothly,but if the PD knows what is needed it usually gets done...

Thankfully,this "Firetruck" stealing is not something that happens everyday,but this is a good reminder of how vulnerable we are...

BE SAFE>..............

[firemoose827 324]

Today's events in Mt. Vernon raise a good question.  What does your Dept. do to keep the scene safe?  Being that someone stole a firetruck and could have easily killed one of a number of people if they weren't trained to operate that equipment, not to mention the effect it has on the fire outcome, it does seem pretty important to consider scene security.  Granted Mt. Vernon isnt the only place its happend some places I've read about even have had their rigs stolen from the firehouse.  Just wonder again what everyone does for scene security as well as maybe perhaps security at the station, maybe someone out there can offer up some good tips on the situation from personal experience...?

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Good post cas2383, I live in an area where we dont have to think about it. Usually the scenes I am on are cluttered with people bringing coffee and refreshments to us or the homeowners and we never in our wildest dreams have to worry if they will climb in a truck and take it?! But we do have the village police respond with us to every scene and either released by our officers or they stick around and do traffic controll or watch us do our jobs, you know? But man, that has got to be a tough thing to deal with. Our pump ops do stay with the rig at all times also. Its in our protocols.

Good Luck everyone. If it gets too bad you could always move up here to Cobleskill. and fight the fires next to the cows!!!

Peace.

Jonesy

[BedfordFire 7]

BUT REMEMBER....your vehicles can be taken even when they're not at a scene; i believe it was a few months ago that an idle rig outside of a station up in Continental Village was about to go on a call got stolen. Aparently anything can happen....