Resident: Fire Siren Justifies Firefighters Need For Egotistical Existence

[CordellOrange 10]

He's not holding back and is a bit out of line. I can see his frustration though.

LETTER: http://www.delmarvanow.com/story/opinion/2015/11/30/letter-conley/76581374/

Edited December 3, 2015 by CordellOrange

[Critic 0]

It is kind of an obsolete and unnecessary technology nowadays.

[somebuffyguy 190]

Is it really obsolete and useless? I know here in Westchester there are areas that pagers and cell phones don't get any reception. I don't know anything about this area of Delaware, but I imagine if one of the wealthiest counties in the country has areas lacking service, other areas have similar problems.

[BFD1054 1,552]

I'm on the fence with this one. As mentioned, reception for pagers and cell phones can be limited to say the least. There are times when I receive a fire call text late or not at all. So there have been instances where the house siren has alerted me that there is a call.

I can remember while dispatching for a fire district, I failed to sound the house siren for whatever reason. I had a member key up the department Nextel to ask me why I hadnt set off the siren. When I asked him how he knew there was a call, he replied "because my pager went off" lol.

I know many agencies have certain rules/guidelines regarding house siren use (type of alarm, time of day, etc). I can certainly agree with that.

I for one don't see the need for 6, 7, 8 rounds of a house siren. Perhaps 3 would be suffice?

[SRS131EMTFF 471]

Is it really obsolete and useless? I know here in Westchester there are areas that pagers and cell phones don't get any reception. I don't know anything about this area of Delaware, but I imagine if one of the wealthiest counties in the country has areas lacking service, other areas have similar problems.

Where exactly in the county is there both no cell or pager service?

[fire patrol nyc 153]

sounds like someone who buys a house next to the airport then wants the planes to go away because it's too loud...if i had to guess i would say he was new to Delmar..by the way,been to Delmar many times...love the crab house,my 2 cents....

[dwcfireman 656]

Where exactly in the county is there both no cell or pager service?

I know some areas in North Castle are definitely dead spots. And I can actually stand on the Verizon tower at the airport with my phone in hand and have NO service!

[somebuffyguy 190]

Where exactly in the county is there both no cell or pager service?

I've only kept my pager at my house so I can't give exact locations but I've heard complaints from members of different agencies all over Northern Westchester and there do seem to be several pockets with spotty reception. As far as cell reception goes I've experienced lack of service in parts of Northern Westchester from the Hudson to the Connecticut border. As other members have pointed out there certainly are some areas that don't get reception.

[AFS1970 504]

A few years ago in Stamford we did a test where we sent members all over town with pagers and not only did tests from Dispatch but also from the backup tone encoders in the various stations. We did identify some areas where pagers were unreliable. That was just one city, I can imagine that there would have to be a proportionately larger number of areas in a county. Now weather these areas match up with the areas that have bad cell coverage, I do not know. Cell companies are always looking for new tower sites because they want to be competitive, so these areas change regularly.

When I was in Belltown, we had largely abandoned using the horn, except in a few rare circumstances. I personally used to use it on reported structure fires, as an additional alert method to the pagers. I know of a few calls where we picked up a few members who were in the area and for whatever reason did not have their pagers with them. So the horn was helpful.

I also know that we bought a paging program to send text messages to members phones. We mostly used this to get all the administrative messages off of the radio. However it did have some use for incident pages. We did get members responding that were out of radio coverage but close enough to respond. The reason that you can't depend on it is that you do now own and maintain the infrastructure. Back in the early 1990's there was an outage on a satellite, that was apparently used by many paging companies. They did not know about the outage, until people were able to get in touch with others by phone and ask why they had not returned pages. So in a fire setting, do you want to be the person who has a house on fire and you find out the pagers are not working because nobody showed up?

The horn/siren has a distance limitation, but in a small community where most members live or work nearby this is not an issue. I do not know anything about Delmar.

I agree that this is probably someone who moved into the area and then wants the area to change to his liking.

[FFPCogs 863]

A few years ago in Stamford we did a test where we sent members all over town with pagers and not only did tests from Dispatch but also from the backup tone encoders in the various stations. We did identify some areas where pagers were unreliable. That was just one city, I can imagine that there would have to be a proportionately larger number of areas in a county. Now weather these areas match up with the areas that have bad cell coverage, I do not know. Cell companies are always looking for new tower sites because they want to be competitive, so these areas change regularly.

When I was in Belltown, we had largely abandoned using the horn, except in a few rare circumstances. I personally used to use it on reported structure fires, as an additional alert method to the pagers. I know of a few calls where we picked up a few members who were in the area and for whatever reason did not have their pagers with them. So the horn was helpful.

I also know that we bought a paging program to send text messages to members phones. We mostly used this to get all the administrative messages off of the radio. However it did have some use for incident pages. We did get members responding that were out of radio coverage but close enough to respond. The reason that you can't depend on it is that you do now own and maintain the infrastructure. Back in the early 1990's there was an outage on a satellite, that was apparently used by many paging companies. They did not know about the outage, until people were able to get in touch with others by phone and ask why they had not returned pages. So in a fire setting, do you want to be the person who has a house on fire and you find out the pagers are not working because nobody showed up?

The horn/siren has a distance limitation, but in a small community where most members live or work nearby this is not an issue. I do not know anything about Delmar.

I agree that this is probably someone who moved into the area and then wants the area to change to his liking.

And don't forget that there are times when we can go days or more without power during / after a storm. Or God forbid if cell /radio networks get damaged or attacked. What happens when members can't charge their cell phones and pagers or get service for days? It's easy to say "ah that will never happen", but in our modern world if there's one thing we all should have learned by now it's that yes it can. Just because a technology is old doesn't mean it doesn't work. And I'm sorry but if an FD has been using a horn/siren for as long as you've been alive (whether you lived in town or not) you'll just have to suck it up snowflake and deal with it.

Horns /sirens (and pull boxes too, remember them?) - Antiquated? yes, obsolete or useless? no

Edited December 5, 2015 by FFPCogs

[FireMedic049 597]

And don't forget that there are times when we can go days or more without power during / after a storm. Or God forbid if cell /radio networks get damaged or attacked. What happens when members can't charge their cell phones and pagers or get service for days? It's easy to say "ah that will never happen", but in our modern world if there's one thing we all should have learned by now it's that yes it can. Just because a technology is old doesn't mean it doesn't work. And I'm sorry but if an FD has been using a horn/siren for as long as you've been alive (whether you lived in town or not) you'll just have to suck it up snowflake and deal with it.

Horns /sirens (and pull boxes too, remember them?) - Antiquated? yes, obsolete or useless? no

I can see maintaining the siren to use in a civil defense fashion or as a backup for times like you mention where power is out for an extended time period, but using it on a daily basis for all calls just isn't necessary.

Additionally, if your means of notification goes down, you staff your station to ensure a response.

The fact that some companies don't use sirens and some companies only blow the siren during certain hours shows that the siren simply isn't essential for member notification or for the public for that matter.

If they were, every station would have them and use them every time there was a call.

[GreatPlains588 131]

So here is my 2 cents worth,

We have Open Houses, Volunteer Drives, a community holiday Party for the Kids and a Santa's wagon etc. every year.

Most of the communities in Westchester believe they are protected by carreer or paid fire houses.

One of the differences, "the Sirens".

If they hear the siren, The community knows their volunteer fire department is responding to some emergency!

[SECTMB 612]

So here is my 2 cents worth,

We have Open Houses, Volunteer Drives, a community holiday Party for the Kids and a Santa's wagon etc. every year.

Most of the communities in Westchester believe they are protected by carreer or paid fire houses.

One of the differences, "the Sirens".

If they hear the siren, The community knows their volunteer fire department is responding to some emergency!

i think one of the reasons volunteer departments have a recruitment issue is that, yes, many residents who have moved into the northern communities came from areas protected by paid departments and they are oblivious to their local department's make up. The more wealthy the northern communities have become, the less likely their residents will have the time or inclination to join. I actually had a resident give me the "i pay your salary" speech one day.

In the 'old days' we only had the siren or a plectron in the house. If you were in your car you were out of luck, in the yard you might hear a firehouse or remote siren. Pagers significantly changes all that but we still used the sirens.

But now that every single call warrants a response, some departments are still blowing the house siren for every 'bullshit' call, and you know the kind of calls I'm referring to. If you have a confirmed working fire, knock yourself out, but if you have an automatic alarm come in at 4:00 am do you really need to blow the house siren? Who is that siren going to reach at 4:00 am that the pager won't?

[Dinosaur 844]

I know some areas in North Castle are definitely dead spots. And I can actually stand on the Verizon tower at the airport with my phone in hand and have NO service!

So if you're standing on the Verizon tower at the airport you'll miss the call in Armonk.

How many residential/business districts have no cell or radio coverage these days?

[Dinosaur 844]

So here is my 2 cents worth,

We have Open Houses, Volunteer Drives, a community holiday Party for the Kids and a Santa's wagon etc. every year.

Most of the communities in Westchester believe they are protected by carreer or paid fire houses.

One of the differences, "the Sirens".

If they hear the siren, The community knows their volunteer fire department is responding to some emergency!

I respectfully disagree. Most people only know that the loud noise means that there's an emergency somewhere. You'd be shocked to learn how many people have no idea (and don't give a damn either) whether or not theirs is a volunteer or paid department.

[GreatPlains588 131]

I respectfully disagree. Most people only know that the loud noise means that there's an emergency somewhere. You'd be shocked to learn how many people have no idea (and don't give a damn either) whether or not theirs is a volunteer or paid department.

You are right!!! But when they ask or complain, you can explain why it's going off and let them know were always looking for new bodies.

Be Safe.

[dwcfireman 656]

So if you're standing on the Verizon tower at the airport you'll miss the call in Armonk.

How many residential/business districts have no cell or radio coverage these days?

My statement about the Verizon tower is kind of a sideways joke about how advanced technology isn't ALWAYS 100% reliable. Where I live in relation to my fire house (which is not Armonk, btw) I cannot hear the siren most days, so I'm indifferent as to whether my department continues to operate the siren. There are, however, members in my department that reside in dead spots where the pager will beep, but no audible voices, just static. These few people thus rely on the siren to indicate that this is not a test or announcement. Then again, if it's at 2AM it's probably not a test or an announcement.

We can banter back and forth all day of whether the siren should stay or not, but my honest opinion is that we cannot solely rely on a single technology to notify volunteers of an alarm. There needs to be some redundancy in getting the word out to everyone. I'm not saying that the siren has to be one of them, but we do need more than one way of alerting volunteers of an emergency. I know we have pagers, tex messaging, responder software, etc, but some departments may still require the siren as their secondary means of notification.