Larchmont FD Goes Out Of Service To Cover Yonkers

[LineCapt 134]

Larchmont TL-7 was sent to cover a Yonkers station during last night's 4th alarm.

They sent all their career staff, and put the Town Of Mamaroneck FD on standby to cover Larchmont for 9 hours.

Larchmont strips down it's department by sending 1 truck M/A, and by doing so to the point they need another department to cover for the most basic of alarms, taking from that department's coverage as well. What's wrong with this picture?

[Flashpoint 94]

Larchmont had 3 members in quarters. But volunteers cannot drive so their apparatus was useless. They did a callback of career staff but that didn't place an engine into service until 5AM, several hours after the TL left with all the career staff on duty to go to Yonkers to standb

[somebuffyguy 190]

It's hardly fair to bring up one detail of an incident and just say "well that was dumb of them". I haven't heard many of the details of this fire so I'd be interested. What mutual aid units were sent? Was anyone requested and not able to respond? Where there any other incidents in the county at that time causing departments to not be able to send mutual aid?

A 4 alarm fire is a massive incident, even if the entire county were merged into one department I'd imagine that during a 4-alarm incident some areas would be lower on staffing than usual.

[Newburgher 241]

Larchmont TL-7 was sent to cover a Yonkers station during last night's 4th alarm.

They sent all their career staff, and put the Town Of Mamaroneck FD on standby to cover Larchmont for 9 hours.

Larchmont strips down it's department by sending 1 truck M/A, and by doing so to the point they need another department to cover for the most basic of alarms, taking from that department's coverage as well. What's wrong with this picture?

That happens in Orange County daily, for small calls. Cascading mutual aid. Department one can't get enough people out to handle the emergency (Fire, AFA, MVA, cat in the tree, etc.) so they call for an engine on automatic response from Dept. 2, a ladder from Dept.3, and a FAST team from Dept.4. All of those departments, if they can get out the door, each call the next department for standby, and it goes on and on. Volunteer departments don't want to acknowledge that they have a man power problem, commissioners don't want to recognize there is a problem, and the county doesn't want to enforce the mutual aid agreement preventing cascading mutual aid, because then they would be admitting there is a problem. I'm sure most counties are like this.

[joey01 10]

They should have initiated a Notification Call to all the Larchmont residence to advise them that they are on Fire Watch for the evening. LOL

Very poor judgment by the LFD IMO.

[410 31]

Larchmont TL-7 was sent to cover a Yonkers station during last night's 4th alarm.

They sent all their career staff, and put the Town Of Mamaroneck FD on standby to cover Larchmont for 9 hours.

How many career staff were on the assignment. 3? 4? If that's all that's on duty at the station on any given shift, isn't Larchmont playing a shell game to begin with?

[Steve 78]

They initially asked for a truck from Scarsdale to relocate into Yonkers.

However, Scarsdale did not respond.

Could be due to manpower issues.

[letsgo1547 50]

Isn't Scarsdale a career department

[letsgo1547 50]

So a department made up of career and volunteers couldn't respond,wow

[CLM92982 26]

They initially asked for a truck from Scarsdale to relocate into Yonkers.

However, Scarsdale did not respond.

Could be due to manpower issues.

The mutual aid request to relocate was declined because their spare truck was out of service.

[Viper 139]

If Larchmont is a combination department, why didn't they fill out the engine with a career firefighter driving and a volunteer crew, leaving the remainder of the career guys to keep Larchmont apparatus in service?

[BIGRED1 71]

If Larchmont is a combination department, why didn't they fill out the engine with a career firefighter driving and a volunteer crew, leaving the remainder of the career guys to keep Larchmont apparatus in service?

Sending Vols to a all career department is a no-no. To Yonker, A very big no-no. Don;t know if the vols can drive in Larchmont, but i know some departments send some of the on duty crew and then back fill with career guys.

[SOUSGT 357]

Sending Vols to a all career department is a no-no. To Yonker, A very big no-no. Don;t know if the vols can drive in Larchmont, but i know some departments send some of the on duty crew and then back fill with career guys.

The Volunteers in Larchmont are not permitted to drive other than thier rescue.

[letsgo1547 50]

So one department couldn't respond because their rig was broken, another department sends 3 career guys on a truck leaving their department understaffed because the vols can only drive the rescue, what a joke

[61MACKBR1 222]

SIMPLE AND SOUND ANSWER TO ALL OF THIS - CREATE AND ESTABLISH A "COUNTY RUN FIRE DEPARTMENT" THAT IS MANNED BY CAREER (AND STATE CERTIFIED TRAINED) FIREFIGHTERS. THIS WAY, IF YOU HAVE A MAJOR FIRE, BE IT IN YONKERS, MOUNT VERNON, NEW ROCHELLE, WHITE PLAINS, LARCHMONT, DOBBS FERRY, ARDSLEY, NORTH SALEM, YORKTOWN, OR PEEKSKILL, YOU WOULD ALWAYS HAVE A CAREER 'COUNTY' FIRE COMPANY WHO COULD/WOULD FILL IN. THERE WOULD BE NO SUCH THING AS 'MUTUAL AID' AS WITH THE COUNTY RUNNING THE ENTIRE FIRE SERVICES, THEY WOULD BE REQUIRED TO GO AND HELP

[letsgo1547 50]

I agree

[SOUSGT 357]

They should have initiated a Notification Call to all the Larchmont residence to advise them that they are on Fire Watch for the evening. LOL

Very poor judgment by the LFD IMO.

If there was a fire who were they going to call-Ghostbusters?

So one department couldn't respond because their rig was broken, another department sends 3 career guys on a truck leaving their department understaffed because the vols can only drive the rescue, what a joke

Larchmont was not understaffed, it was closed for the night as no one was left behind to cover the district. If volunteers responded to HQ, there would have been no one to operate the equipment as the 3 Career FF on duty took off, asking the Town of Mamaroneck to standby in the TMFD quarters with 1 and 1.

Edited October 26, 2015 by SOUSGT

[WHarley3 23]

Larchmont also did the same thing a couple of weeks ago when they went to the fire in Greenville.

[Flashpoint 94]

I think Larchmont just has the mentality "The Town Of Mamaroneck will cover us". What if they have their own calls to cover? I can't imagine the Town is OK with this.

What happens if somebody is trapped in a fire in Larchmont? How will they justify sending all their career firefighters, the only ones who can drive Larchmont apparatus, to cover a firehouse in Yonkers? In effect, they took the entire department out of service to go mutual aid to standby for another department that's not even nearby. How will they explain that to the residents? I hope Larchmont comes up with a better plan for next time.

[RANDY45 11]

Does yonkers stand by in other jurisdictions when asked or do they only go mutual aid when responding to the scene?

[frost025 94]

Doesn't make any logical sense at all. How do you leave your village unprotected by your fire dept.and put the coverage on a neighboring yown,just to say hey look at us we went mutual aid to Yonkers.That's what it is all about and don't tell me different.The village mayor and board should be aware of this and stop the nonsense. If you had the manpower in the village to cover the manpower going to Yonkers it's a different story. But it doesn't sound like this went down.

[velcroMedic1987 330]

When are we going to acknowledge that the system is broken? Fire and EMS in Westchester is a collection of varying agencies but we have no system. The Yorktown fire station construction 1500 feet from an existing fire station in another district and this situation with the mutual aid effectively shutting down a department highlights just how screwed up we are.

And EMS is no better off. The patchwork of different agencies all doing different things at different levels with varying success shows that we really haven't changed all that much since the 80's when the Journal News published their "where you live could cost your life" series of articles.

[16fire5 693]

Isn't LFD obligated to respond as a signatory of the mutual aid plan? If there was a county wide paid or combination department and there was a large 4th alarm going on there would be empty stations throughout the county (hopefully done in a systematic way). I'm not saying consolidation would not be good it would but anyone who thinks a consolidated department would staff all the apparatus or stations that exist at this point to the current levels is fooling themselves.

[Quickness 7]

Does TMFD assume the liability from LFD when this situation happens?

[FFPCogs 863]

I don't get why volunteers can't drive any pieces of apparatus except for the rescue. Why?

My question exactly. Although to be fair I have no idea what kind of numbers they have for volly's in Larchmont. But I must say this, if they are able to cobble together a crew it is absolutely irresponsible to me that they don't let volly's drive the apparatus IMHO. And keep your "they're not trained to do it" nonsense. No offense to all you stellar drivers out there, but a monkey can be trained to operate a rig, so there's no excuse why firefighters...yes even volly firefighters...aren't.

Edited October 27, 2015 by FFPCogs

[Viper 139]

Sending Vols to a all career department is a no-no. To Yonker, A very big no-no. Don;t know if the vols can drive in Larchmont, but i know some departments send some of the on duty crew and then back fill with career guys.

They won't send volunteers to an all career department, but they will go to an all-career department and then have the volunteers cover for career staff? That's hypocrisy.

[ex-commish 490]

My question exactly. Although to be fair I have no idea what kind of numbers they have for volly's in Larchmont. But I must say this, if they are able to cobble together a crew it is absolutely irresponsible to me that they don't let volly's drive the apparatus IMHO. And keep your "they're not trained to do it" nonsense. No offense to all you stellar drivers out there, but a monkey can be trained to operate a rig, so there's no excuse why firefighters...yes even volly firefighters...aren't.

Perhaps it is in the firefighters union contract that they can drive?

[FFPCogs 863]

Perhaps it is in the firefighters union contract that they can drive?

Not trying to debate or accuse, I'm just an outsider looking in, but if that's the case who's putting self interest before public safety?

[Dinosaur 844]

Does TMFD assume the liability from LFD when this situation happens?

What liability?

[Dinosaur 844]

Does yonkers stand by in other jurisdictions when asked or do they only go mutual aid when responding to the scene?

They will stand by for other jurisdicitions if the jurisdicition is making an effort to recall it's own personnel to backfill. If they don't make an effort to recall off-duty/additional FF, then Yonkers will take up and return to the city after a reasonable amount of time.