Village Of Mamaroneck New Engine Bid

[x635 4,066]

Copy of the bid specs, from the Village Of Mamaroneck website:

SPECS: http://www.village.mamaroneck.ny.us/Pages/MamaroneckNY_Bids/2014-09%20-%20New%20Pumper

Contract 2014-09:
Furnish & Deliver One (1) New or Demonstration Model
1500 GPM Pierce Quantum Pumper/Rescue Apparatus
Or Approved Equal

[PCFD ENG58 1,085]

Can you say only one bidder ? that's not a legal bid, not even close,

Edited November 1, 2014 by PCFD ENG58

[Bnechis 3,961]

That's not a bid according to NYS Law

[STAT213 332]

How does it violate the law? Not trying to be a smart ass, Bnechis, just want to know.

[Chkpoint 131]

How can you put the exact rig, make and model in a request for bid? Need to at least take that out. If that's what you want you need to make the language so only that manufacturer can really only deliver that spec. Couldn't seagrave or KME or whoever fight or take legal action?

[x152 179]

As this is a proprietary component of Oshkosh/Pierce, it will be quite hard for any other vendor to supply this:

"Front Oshkosh TAK-4TM independent suspension shall be provided with a minimum ground rating of 24,000 lb."

Perhaps they should also include:

"All name plates must be oval and include a six letter manufacturers name that begins with a capital "P" and ends with an "e". Also, the vehicle must only be fabricated and assembled within the City of Appleton, Wisconsin."

Edited October 29, 2014 by x152

[Reliance 29]

PXXXXE is six letters not five

[Reliance 29]

It says it the title Pierce Quantam or equivalent

[spin_the_wheel 460]

[frost025 94]

Totally illegal, people should learn how to write a set of specs before putting them out to bid.

[x152 179]

PXXXXE is six letters not five

Yes it is

[Bnechis 3,961]

How does it violate the law? Not trying to be a smart ass, Bnechis, just want to know.

I think others have answered.

But this has been put out as a "Competitive Bid". The moment you put one manufactures name on it, its no longer competitive, since none of the other venders will put the time & $$$ ($10,000 - $20,000 per bid) to put something together. The customer has stated "or equal" and they get to determine after the fact what that is.

NYS law requires competitive bidding for purchases over $500.

Their are exemptions. For example if their is a pierce quantum demo unit they saw and want they can go back to the village board (City council, Board of fire commish. etc.) And if the elected oversight board agrees that a sole source no bid is in the best interest of the tax payer they can authorize it.

These are usually done because of a very good price, immediate delivery date, or as an emergency purchase (a wall fell on the rig & its gone and we cant wait for a replacement to be built.

[SECTMB 612]

By specifying Pierce Quantum you are establishing a 'basis of design'. Adding 'or equal'; 'or equivalent' makes it CYA competitive.

[Bnechis 3,961]

By specifying Pierce Quantum you are establishing a 'basis of design'. Adding 'or equal'; 'or equivalent' makes it CYA competitive.

If you do not quantify what is equal and or list what specific features of the quantum you will/will not accept anything else like its unique fold out steps. then no one else can win the bid.

Of more importance the moment you list a name, all the other vendors back off, because they are not willing to throw money away, when you have made it clear you will be buying a Pierce.

I have seen on a number of these types of bids where the vendor will show up at the bid deadline with 2 sealed bids. If no one else bids, they will at the last minute before bid closing they will put in the higher bid. I have seen this be as much as $60,000 extra.

[dwcfireman 656]

I have seen on a number of these types of bids where the vendor will show up at the bid deadline with 2 sealed bids. If no one else bids, they will at the last minute before bid closing they will put in the higher bid. I have seen this be as much as $60,000 extra.

Highway robbery at it's finest. It's a shame that purchasing agencies are either unaware of this practice or willing to waste tax dollas just because they like a certain manufacturer.

Their are exemptions. For example if their is a pierce quantum demo unit they saw and want they can go back to the village board (City council, Board of fire commish. etc.) And if the elected oversight board agrees that a sole source no bid is in the best interest of the tax payer they can authorize it.

I got experience this first hand, where my department loved the demo, and the commissioners decided to buy said demo unit. Alas, it wasn't the same once the vehicle was retrofitted for NYS emissions. Complete loss of power through the drive train and we could barely make it up a hill with the accelerator floored. Then more money has to be poured into the vehicle to refit it to the needs of the department. It seems like a total waste to me because, in this case anyway, the powers at hand didn't do te proper research. I also know of another department (elsewhere in the countyry) that bought a demo tanker, and it turned out to be too heavy for certain roads and bridges. Turns out that the advertised GVW from the dealer did not include the weight of water in the tank. The tanker thus had to be towed a few times out roads that crumbled beneath it. Another example of not doing the research.