Lower Hudson police have received $3.5M in military gear

[Viper 139]

Tuckahoe may not seem like the type of community where cops would need military-grade assault rifles.

But village Police Chief John Costanzo, whose department received five M16 rifles for free last year through a federal program, said one may have thought the same of Aurora, Colorado, Newtown, Connecticut, and many other quiet towns that have seen a "high incidence of active shooters."

"I think we want to equip and arm our police officers sufficiently," Costanzo said. "I think law enforcement in general needs to be prepared for these incidents and ... have the tools in place to protect the public."

FULL ARTICLE: http://www.lohud.com/story/news/crime/2014/08/22/military-surplus-westchester-rockland-putnam/14442073/

[antiquefirelt 994]

I agree with the quote in the article, most of these "issues" are just poor attempts to demonize the law enforcement community as a whole. Those who seek to discredit the police at every opportunity continue to ignore that police officers are our neighbors, friends, family and normal human beings, not some group of robotic storm troopers out to impose Draconian laws on unsuspecting people. Again and again they continue to make excuses for people who commit crimes by deflecting and changing the topic. I'm not ready to vilify or exonerate the Ferguson Officer, but I think he and his department (and the community) deserve a fair shooting investigation and one free of political spectacle as this situation has become.

[ex-commish 490]

_{Let the local police determine the level of protection they need...not the feds or the media.}

[SRS131EMTFF 471]

Let the local voters determine the level of protection they need

[ryguy12fd 33]

Let the local voters determine the level of protection they need

Just like they did in New York City with stop, question, frisk???

Yea. That worked well.....

[firefighter-70 27]

I agree with the quote in the article, most of these "issues" are just poor attempts to demonize the law enforcement community as a whole. Those who seek to discredit the police at every opportunity continue to ignore that police officers are our neighbors, friends, family and normal human beings, not some group of robotic storm troopers out to impose Draconian laws on unsuspecting people. Again and again they continue to make excuses for people who commit crimes by deflecting and changing the topic. I'm not ready to vilify or exonerate the Ferguson Officer, but I think he and his department (and the community) deserve a fair shooting investigation and one free of political spectacle as this situation has become.

I agree with PDs needing the proper weapons for the many given situations they might find themselves in. The problem I have is with any law enforcement agency that uses US Armed Forces combat uniforms for use against civilians. They are not members of the Armed Forces period. They might work great but the fact is police officers are here to protect and serve the public, what people expect to see are professional wearing PD blue or what ever color local LE wears. Not Army or Marine combat uniforms worn in the field. I'll even agree they can wear the ACH (Advanced Combat Helmet) for superior head protection but it should be painted blue.

[Remember585 815]

I look at it this way... Law Enforcement's jobs continue to get more and more difficult because A) society has decreasing respect for them, politicians and government leaders at all levels keep putting them in the spotlight as the enemy, C) the media like to make them look bad and D) people continue to get crazier and want to inflict harm to the innocent. If Law Enforcement is going to be the first responders to these awful occurrences, and - hopefully - interject to prevent horrific incidents from happening - I say give them anything they need! That small town cops don't need all of that stuff no longer means a thing to me after seeing all of the horrible things that happen in this country.

I, for one, fully endorse cops to have the best equipment and training possible to protect us and those we care about.

[50-65 205]

There is no greater tyranny than that which is perpetrated under the shield of the law and in the name of justice.

― Montesquieu, The Spirit of the Laws

[Morningjoe 162]

Just like they did in New York City with stop, question, frisk???

Yea. That worked well.....

Then at what point do we decided that the general public is "too stupid" to determine what's good for them?

"The who give up essential liberty to obtain temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin

[SageVigiles 1,194]

Then at what point do we decided that the general public is "too stupid" to determine what's good for them?

"The who give up essential liberty to obtain temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin

Probably right around the time Al Sharpton became a Constitutional scholar. I'm a small government conservative myself, but lets be honest; neither stop and frisk (which used to just be called the Terry Stop) nor the DoD's surplus acquisition programs, are harming anyone's liberty.

Its the same argument that I make regarding the Second Amendment. Having a gun doesn't make you a bad guy or a tyrant, that comes from the way in which it is used.

[AFS1970 504]

Other than the weapons a lot of focus has been on the uniforms. Now I personally think some of the newer uniforms are bordering on the ridiculous, but that aside, they are often saving money for the taxpayers. CT State Police still uses custom made uniforms.\, I think a pair of pants is priced out somewhere in the $50 to $60 range. A pair of BDU's at any surplus store is in the$20 to $30 range. Should it matter that there are more pockets or drawstrings at the cuffs? If any agency could cut even half of their budget that way, we should be applauding them.

I have read about people complaining about the so called "tactical vests" which have pockets and straps but are also carriers for the body armor. These are generally worn on the outside of the uniform because the pockets would be useless otherwise. However the complaints always about how it looks. Most of the public would never suggest that the police stop wearing body armor, just that they don't want to see it. Seeing armour makes the public lift their heads from the sand and realize that various liberal policies have armed the bad guys more that then good guys.

I noticed something interesting when I was in Canada a couple fo months ago. Considering it is a country that claims to have gotten rid of all those nasty hand guns. Almost every private security officer I saw in my travels was not only wearing body armor, but wearing it on the outside of their uniform. Some in contrasting colors, and some blending in with the uniform. In this country there are security companies that do not allow body armor because they have decided they do not face that kind of threat. However if private security were to do that here, there would be calls to stop the militarization of security.

Just because the military does something does not make it bad. Almost everything on our uniforms has some historical military connection, no matter if the modern use if police, fire or EMS, yet nobody complains about that. This is just a new fad among the pro-crime lobby to try and make it easier to victimize the public.

[BFD1054 1,552]

Let the local voters determine the level of protection they need

I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with you sir. While I can respect the idea that taxpayers (voters) should have a say in their municipal services, police procedure should not be one of those areas.

Let's face it, the majority of people have little to know clue about the services they receive. So you want the civilian layperson to judge what amount of protection their police officers need?

Most people probably have no clue how many police officers even protect their communities.

Same goes for Fire and EMS (as has been beaten to death here). The majority of people have no idea what level (or lack of) fire and Ems services they are getting.

They may know there's a local firehouse or ambulance corps. Other than that, they don't know if there is paid personnel or all volunteers.

I work for a Village DPW. Do you know what the majority of residents are constantly concerned about? Garbage collection.

I have family and friends who are LEOs and I want them to come home after every shift. Therefore I want them to have any and all equipment that may give them an advantage.

Ask the residents of Newtown or Aurora if they want their Police to be as prepared as possible.

20 years ago we didn't have to think like we do today. Unfortunately we live in a different, ever changing world with an unpredictable society. It sucks, but it is reality.

I carry a firearm on an almost daily basis. I know that carrying a firearm is not my only line of defense and may not save my or my loved ones lives. However, I carry because it just may be my only line of defense. I love my life and want to stick around as long as possible.

[Dinosaur 844]

Let the local voters determine the level of protection they need

That would be a bad bad decision. How exactly does an uniformed electorate make a decision like that?

Considering the quality of our elected officials, I'm not sure letting them determine the level of police or fire protection is a sound idea.

[Dinosaur 844]

If rifles weren't included in this program, would they still be complaining?

Don't forget, Michael Frey was executed by a man with a rifle and the responding cops had nothing heavier than handguns to deal with it until Yonkers and NYC showed up.

And that was right next door to Tuckahoe in Eastchester.

[SRS131EMTFF 471]

I have no problems with certain military hardware in LEO hands, however when that hardware is used to turn the streets of Boston, MA or Furgeson, MO into a scene out of Fallujah with MRAPs and POs pointing assault rifles at unarmed demonstrators, as well as the tear gassing of journalists, I have a problem with that...

Edited August 26, 2014 by SRS131EMTFF

[Dinosaur 844]

I have no problems with certain military hardware in LEO hands, however when that hardware is used to turn the streets of Boston, MA or Furgeson, MO into a scene out of Fallujah with MRAPs and POs pointing assault rifles at unarmed demonstrators, as well as the tear gassing of journalists, I have a problem with that...

When journalists are in between the police and the rioters they're bound to be exposed to some tear gas. With my own interest in the subject and family in law enforcement, I watched a lot of the video from Ferguson and can only offer the following...

We have to protect our employees - and the police are our employees. This means when they're being shot at we have to give them armored vehicles and vests/helmets and support their use of them.

I guess we have to debate at what point a demonstrator becomes a rioter because if someone was walking toward me swinging a Do Not Enter sign like an axe I would point a rifle at him too. If this were a peaceful candlelight vigil I would agree that pointing a rifle at them was extreme but there was no way of knowing who in those violent crowds was armed and we will never know if the presence of those rifles actually prevented more violence or shootings.

Not sure what you mean about Boston either. Was there an incident up there too?

[AFS1970 504]

I have no problems with certain military hardware in LEO hands, however when that hardware is used to turn the streets of Boston, MA or Furgeson, MO into a scene out of Fallujah with MRAPs and POs pointing assault rifles at unarmed demonstrators, as well as the tear gassing of journalists, I have a problem with that...

Boston was a strange situation to say the least. I am not all that happy with ordering people to stay inside during that man hunt, but I do understand the safety sentiments behind it. Given the type of incident and the number of casualties and the fact that the killers had proven they were not only willing to attack the random public but to attack police and other responders in secondary incidents, I can see why the decisions that were made were made, even when I do not entirely agree with them.

However I reject the idea that either the police or the equipment they were using turned the streets of Ferguson into any such thing. If in fact Ferguson resembled a war zone it was because of the criminals who refused to take part in civil discourse and instead felt that lynching a good cop was in order. They terrorized a community, committed multiple acts of larceny, burglary, vandalism and arson as well as intimidation, assault and possibly attempted murder. The police in Ferguson did not start the war.

[Dinosaur 844]

Boston was a strange situation to say the least. I am not all that happy with ordering people to stay inside during that man hunt, but I do understand the safety sentiments behind it. Given the type of incident and the number of casualties and the fact that the killers had proven they were not only willing to attack the random public but to attack police and other responders in secondary incidents, I can see why the decisions that were made were made, even when I do not entirely agree with them.

However I reject the idea that either the police or the equipment they were using turned the streets of Ferguson into any such thing. If in fact Ferguson resembled a war zone it was because of the criminals who refused to take part in civil discourse and instead felt that lynching a good cop was in order. They terrorized a community, committed multiple acts of larceny, burglary, vandalism and arson as well as intimidation, assault and possibly attempted murder. The police in Ferguson did not start the war.

We're talking about the marathon bombing? That's completely different than Ferguson. Boston was an act of terrorism. Ferguson is rioting and looting by criminals. There's no comparison.

[Dinosaur 844]

Boston was a strange situation to say the least. I am not all that happy with ordering people to stay inside during that man hunt, but I do understand the safety sentiments behind it. Given the type of incident and the number of casualties and the fact that the killers had proven they were not only willing to attack the random public but to attack police and other responders in secondary incidents, I can see why the decisions that were made were made, even when I do not entirely agree with them.

However I reject the idea that either the police or the equipment they were using turned the streets of Ferguson into any such thing. If in fact Ferguson resembled a war zone it was because of the criminals who refused to take part in civil discourse and instead felt that lynching a good cop was in order. They terrorized a community, committed multiple acts of larceny, burglary, vandalism and arson as well as intimidation, assault and possibly attempted murder. The police in Ferguson did not start the war.

Just curious, not to hijack the thread but, why aren't you happy with ordering people to shelter in place during the manhunt in Boston?

[SageVigiles 1,194]

There's no such thing as "ordering" people to shelter in place. It's just like a "mandatory evacuation". You won't get arrested for violating it, you're just an idiot.

Also, SRS, that word you're looking for is "rioter" not "protester." That's what you call it when people throw rocks, bottles and Molotov cocktails at Police Officers.

And if reporters are dumb enough to stand in the middle of a riot, they don't get to complain about getting hit with tear gas.

Edited August 26, 2014 by SageVigiles