Why Open Cabs?

[x635 4,066]

I've always wondered when looking at antique apparatus. Why were there so many open cabs with no roofs? You'd think that the fire apparatus would be responding in all weather, and they would want some protection. This trend lasted from when motorized fire apparatus was invented, until about the 1970's.

Was there some sort of practical reason for not having a roog?

[AFS1970 504]

I have been told that it was to give a better view of the situation you were approaching to aid in size up. However I only barely remember our open cab and when I was there it usually had this ugly after market vinyl top on it. So I can not verify that theory.

I think it may just be that cabs on the horse drawn rigs were open, that continued to the first motorized rigs and then onto some of the first "modern" rigs. A neighboring department did not use doors on their cabs until the 1970's. Roofs have been available on some models since at least the 1940's but open cabs were being made into the mid 1960's at least.

[SECTMB 612]

When I first started the 1948 Mack I responded on was truly open cab. No doors, No roof. I also responded on a 700 Series LaFrance, No roof. Nice for driving training in the Summer, not so nice in rain and snow. Both rigs were retired in the early 70's. I always considered it as tradition in that the first rigs were horse drawn, all open, then they became motorized but the emphasis was still on the function of the apparatus, not the personnel. We used to ride the open jump seats and rear step. Creature comforts and personnel safety were not part of the mix then. Think pre-OSHA.

[PCFD ENG58 1,085]

All wrong, the fact is it was easy to see our smiling faces.

[dave0820 50]

I always heard, the FDNY had open cabs to be able to look up to find the fire in tall buildings and most other departments in lower NY state just followed suit.

[kinkchaser 352]

Open cabs were pretty funny if you thought about it, windshield with windshield wipers on both outside and inside, controls, radios getting soaked and in bad weather trying to look up information on maps and binders was impossible. Closed cabs put old timers in a snit when they had difficulty using mirrors Guys on the truck felt the enclosed cabs hindered their ability to quickly spot the aerial to position on the fire building. But if you had a lengthy job during a snow, you had to shovel out the cab to go back home. ( unless someone had the idea to cover with a tarp) Of course this design started to be phased out in the 60's when folks went totally nuts

[pump305 53]

In Los Angeles, LAFD ran open cabs until 1990. At this time NFPA required all open cabs to be covered and also at the same time they began using MDT radios that could not be wet.Now keep in mind the open cabs where mostly reserve companys but.. a few where still in front line. When i was a explorer with LAFD the Captains did say they liked them for size ups as they arrived on scene. Plus it was tradition.

[mfc2257 464]

Those were semi open cabs... They had doors.

A true open cab had no doors.

The typical 1980's closed driver/officer with open jump seat is a canopy cab.

Today's rigs are enclosed cab.

[JackEMT 77]

I always assumed it was a carry over from the vintage automobile, which initially didn't have a roof. It may have been a "luxury" to have an enclosed riding area (remember the tumbler seats on some of the old Fords) and cost, why spend the extra money on a roof for fire apparatus? How many incidents were they responding to back then, hardly like today when a single company responds to multiple alarms a day. Plus, if the weather was bad, they had turnout gear.

[WPFD37retired 5]

The belief was that you could not size up a fire properly when rolling in. It gave the officers a view that they couldnt have with a coovered rig. I liked tillering but it was rough in the bad weather with old WPFD rigs. Also was not pleasent in the snow with a open cab.

[10512 214]

By the end of the 1920's, almost all cars and trucks had covered roofs, so I do not think it was a carry over.

Open cab apparatus were being designed as "open cab" even after the other vehicles made by the same manufacturer, and other manufacturers, were being made with roofs.

Edited August 9, 2014 by 10512

[pump305 53]

MFC257.... That may of been how you or a dept back east may have called them. But here out west, they are open cabs even with doors. The no door's on rigs was not a huge hit out here as most if not all dept's had doors. Yes, a rig with a covered cab but open jump seats are semi enclosed. It's amazing how Fire trucks have grown. I mean now, you have fully enclosed bodys with the pump panel behind a door.

[Bnechis 3,961]

Both as horse drawn and as early motorized weight was a major consideration as they did not have the power to overcome the additional weight, but then something happened they most have missed here, in the 1930's we started building enclosed cabs.

During the 2nd world war, most depts. could not purchase anything as most metal was being directed toward the war effort. and immediately after the war there were still delays in the recovery. We found some depts. started buying them and then they disappeared until cities needed to cover the members for protection.

[BFD389RET 112]

firemen are traditionalists , the fresh air, "seeing the job from 3 blocks away" were all arguments Pro, The horse crap getting spattered Back at you, rain and snow.. were against along with stories Like This one from New Haven Ct. Fd

New Haven, CT Hose Wagon Accident, Nov 1899

Funeral Was Held From St. Patrick's Church This Morning.

JEREMIAH F. REGAN, the fireman, who met a tragic death on Monday when he was thrown from the seat of a hose wagon, No. 8, was buried this morning after services at St. Patrick's church. There was a large attendance at the services which included members of the fire board, representatives of the various organizations to which the late fireman belonged, members of the fire department and from the state organization of the firemen. From the State Firemen's Association there were present at the services, President George Pitt of Middletown, Secretary John B. Jones of Westport, and Edward Davis, of Hartford, member of the executive board of the state association. From the late residence of the deceased, 877 State street, the body was escorted to St. Patrick's church by a detail of 20 firemen under Captain Charles H. O'Neill. A solemn requiem high mass was celebrated by the Rev. Father O'Connell spoke of the sudden death of the fireman while in the performance of his duty and of his faithfulness as a member of the department.

During the mass James S. Gettings, a fireman attached to Company No.4, sang a solo. There were a number of floral pieces, one from the Firemen's Benevolent Association, being a pillow, and cross with initials of the association upon it. The firemen of Company No. 8 sent a pillow with "Companion, Company No.8," upon it. Besides these there were other floral tributes sent by other organizations.

The flower bearers were: Henry J. Donnelly of the detective bureau; Francis McCabe, William Moakley, James J. Guncheon, Andrew Flannagen and Mr. Regan. The Pallbearers, all firemen, were Lieut. Lindsey, Lieut. Barrows, Philip Reilly, William Lutz, James Redmond, William Foote, and Irving Hamilton. The interment was in St. Lawrence cemetery.

Today the following resolutions were adopted by the Firemen's Benevolent association:

Whereas, Jeremiah Regan was a faithful and conscientious fireman in all the duties assigned to him; whatever he done he prided himself in doing well.

Resolved. That a copy of these resolutions be sent to the family of [ineligible] late associate, and that these resolutions be spread upon the records of our association.

New Haven Evening Register, New Haven, CT 22 Nov 1899 Makes you wonder if They said SHeet Happens like we do .. ? ...

[gamewell45 258]

I think we are all aging ourselves!