Mount Vernon mayor and firefighter unions at odds over size of force

[x635 4,066]

Mount Vernon's firefighter unions are clashing with the mayor's office over allegations of understaffing, but the mayor argues that the problem amounts to sick time abuse.

http://westchester.news12.com/news/mount-vernon-mayor-and-firefighter-unions-at-odds-over-size-of-force-1.8842162

[Bnechis 3,961]

But the Mayor fails to acknowledge that the majority of members who are out sick are out on service connected injuries or illness due to exposure from documented contamination in the fire stations.

Understaffing is the leading cause of service connected injuries.

[M' Ave 1,466]

Ernie Davis is a crook. He's, perhaps not-so-shockingly, held that position for far too long.....too bad, that city should flourish, but it doesn't.

[frost025 94]

Maybe the way that neighboring departments could help is stop running on mutual aid.I believe that Yonkers does not go in anymore.I think the mayor and council doesn't address the manpower shortage is they know if their is a job other municipalities will come into m.v.to back city firefighters so why spend money to add staffing.

[Bnechis 3,961]

Maybe the way that neighboring departments could help is stop running on mutual aid.I believe that Yonkers does not go in anymore.I think the mayor and council doesn't address the manpower shortage is they know if their is a job other municipalities will come into m.v.to back city firefighters so why spend money to add staffing.

What makes you think the Mayor would change? If the next major fire no one shows up mutual aid, do you think he will go out and hire?

[10512 214]

A Mutual Aid question, I never thought about this.

Does the "requested" department need a "valid" reason not to respond, such as they are busy with their own call, or something of that nature.

Or, can the "requested" Department just say no, we are not going to that department/city/town anymore.

I am asking if an outside Depatment can refuse to respond due to disagreeing with the way the requesting department is being run.

Did Yonkers give a reason why they will no longer respond into Mt. Vernon?

I am sure the answer is probably not that simple.

Edited July 20, 2014 by 10512

[Bnechis 3,961]

1) Does the "requested" department need a "valid" reason not to respond, such as they are busy with their own call, or something of that nature.

2) Or, can the "requested" Department just say no, we are not going to that department/city/town anymore.

3) I am asking if an outside Depatment can refuse to respond due to disagreeing with the way the requesting department is being run.

4) Did Yonkers give a reason why they will no longer respond into Mt. Vernon?

1) The "plan" says you are suppose to respond if you can. But you are not required to give a reason if you can not.

2) The system does not document that. Their is no place to put "no" into what you are going to do.

3) Each Fire Chief fills out who he wants and for what and in what order. If everytime you are asked to respond you are "unavailable" for what ever the reason, the chief will change his request list, because its not helping him.

Everyone keeps assuming that YFD will not respond to MVFD, but if they are not called, they clearly never will (btw I know YFD was in MV on MA within the past 2 months).

4) YFD has in the past said they will respond to fires or station coverage when asked, but they expect the dept to make an effort to recall to restaff the dept. and they will not cover a station indefinitely

[frost025 94]

It's like I said if m.v is relying on mutual aid for every fire they get and departments go in on mutual aid why even discuss adding manpower to their own department ,why spend the money.If nobody goes in on mutual aid who are they gonna use to back up the already short handed on duty crews,the p.d. or the highway workers.They are gonna eventually have to do the right thing.

[demps121 39]

Read up this is the Westchester Mutual Aid Plan

http://emergencyservices.westchestergov.com/images/stories/pdfs/FireMutualAidPlanAdopted12%2019%202012FINAL.pdf

[Bnechis 3,961]

It's like I said if m.v is relying on mutual aid for every fire they get and departments go in on mutual aid why even discuss adding manpower to their own department ,why spend the money.If nobody goes in on mutual aid who are they gonna use to back up the already short handed on duty crews,the p.d. or the highway workers.They are gonna eventually have to do the right thing.

How is this different than 99% of the depts. in Westchester? Which departments do not call for mutual aid when they have a fire?

About 6 months back their was a dept that requester about 8 depts. mutual aid to handle a room and content fire.

If no one comes to assist them, the mayor will claim, they cant afford it and the loss is because the mutual aid companies refuse to help. Nothing will change. Meanwhile, the brothers on the line will take a beating, while everyone sits back and claims they are helping them by not coming to their aid.

[somebuffyguy 190]

From the WC mutual aid agreement :

Mutual Aid is intended to be reserved for extreme circumstances. It is not intended to be routine, nor should it become abusive or an unreasonable burden to the Fire Agencies providing assistance

Besides Yonkers and New Rochelle, name one department in the county that follows this. I'm also curious, has anyone ever filed a complaint regarding Mount Vernon's use of mutual aid as is stated in the agreement ?

[M' Ave 1,466]

I see all this talk about not responding to a request for mutual Aid.....stick it to City Hall and what not...

Trouble is, City Hall and the mayor aren't requesting Mutual Aid. The incident commander is making the request and he's doing so because the brothers on the line, or the floor above (or wherever) need help. So....who are we hurting first and foremost.

Personally, I feel a dept. should be able to handle a bread and butter room and contents fire alone. If you don't have the manpower to stretch/operate at least the first line AND simultaneously vent and perform a primary search, you're ineffective. I can handle a FAST unit request, that's understandable.

[SageVigiles 1,194]

I see all this talk about not responding to a request for mutual Aid.....stick it to City Hall and what not...

Trouble is, City Hall and the mayor aren't requesting Mutual Aid. The incident commander is making the request and he's doing so because the brothers on the line, or the floor above (or wherever) need help. So....who are we hurting first and foremost.

Personally, I feel a dept. should be able to handle a bread and butter room and contents fire alone. If you don't have the manpower to stretch/operate at least the first line AND simultaneously vent and perform a primary search, you're ineffective. I can handle a FAST unit request, that's understandable.

Exactly, its not the Mayor or the City Council whose going to be hurt when something goes wrong at a fire, it'll be fellow Firefighters or innocent civilians.