Fire Commissioners want to get rid of Greenville FD (Orange Co) Rescue Truck

[RWC130 594]

Fire Commissioners want to get rid of Greenville FD (Orange Co)

Rescue Truck because it's too heavy for the roads.

GREENVILLE - An Orange County fire department has been told that its best firetruck shouldn't be driven on the streets because it is too heavy for the roads.

Greenville Fire Chief Robert Bello says firetruck Rescue 702 is the single most important truck the department has, and it runs 90 percent of the fire calls in the town.

Bello says the town's fire commissioners want to get rid of the 2009 truck and temporarily replace it with a 23-year-old truck.

Credit: http://hudsonvalley.news12.com/news/firetruck-rescue-702-to-come-off-greenville-streets-due-to-weight-1.8106610

WOW!

[EMT111 149]

Why is this coming up now, after 5 years? My guess, the commissioners got turned down on their $1 million ladder truck last year, and they thought they'd try for a new rig again.

[mfc2257 464]

So 702, a single axle rescue wagon, weighs more than 701, a tandem axle pumper tanker with 3000 gallons of water (25,000lb) on board????

I've got a title for a handsome old bridge that connects lower Manhatten to the Long Island that could be yours for......

[M' Ave 1,466]

Overweight or not.....this isn't a city bus or oil delivery truck, ect, that's riding up and down the roads all day everyday. It's an emergency vehicle and it can't possibly be out often enough to do regular and permanent damage. This seems like a silly fight....

Although.....maybe they'd get under the weight limit if they shaved off a few air horns.......

[houlidsa 76]

Those aren't just any plain silly airhorns, those are train horns!

[SECTMB 612]

I hope that the media and public continue to exert pressure on the commissioners to provide a truthful answer to their decision to take out of service a first line apparatus and replace it with a spare or reserve. Obviously from the comments of the Chief and the assurances of the manufacturer and DOT and the information regarding their other apparatus, negate the stated reason for de-commissioning the apparatus. So with that excuse gone, what is their rationale now?

Too bad the commissioner who would speak was not more forthcoming regarding the closed door discussions, if there were any, prior to a vote regarding this issue. Perhaps its time for some new commissioners and the members of the department and their extended families should be active in finding and supporting new candidates for commissioner next time positions are available.

This appears to be a microcosm example of what is wrong with our 'public officials' right down to the most local of levels. Individual wants/needs/desires are put before those of the general population for which these 'public officials' are in office to serve.

[SRS131EMTFF 471]

This appears to be a microcosm example of what is wrong with our 'public officials' right down to the most local of levels. Individual wants/needs/desires are put before those of the general population for which these 'public officials' are in office to serve.

Or, it could be the FD that bought a unnecessarily large and expensive vehicle and now the fire commission is disagreeing with that purchase. (Note I am not saying this is the case, only potentially the fire commissions point of view.)

Its all a matter of prospective.

[EMT111 149]

From what I understand now, the reason it is too heavy is because they are using it on steep terrain. Supposedly this all stemmed from an incident where the rig was coming down Greenville Mountain, and burned it's breaks before it got to the bottom. Supposedly they've now taken the water off the truck and are using it as a rescue only and it's within the weight limit.

[pump305 53]

If the brakes did get hot enough to loose stopping power, then maybe.. the dept should look into engineer training again on steep hills. I would assume it's equipt with a Jake brake and being all wheel drive over size brakes. Unless it was spec wrong it's not the trucks fault the brakes got hot.

[SECTMB 612]

Or, it could be the FD that bought a unnecessarily large and expensive vehicle and now the fire commission is disagreeing with that purchase. (Note I am not saying this is the case, only potentially the fire commissions point of view.)

Its all a matter of prospective.

According to the information provided, this vehicle responds to the vast majority of their calls and other apparatus in the department has a greater GVW than this truck. All I am asking is for them to provide the real reason they

want to dispose of this truck rather than the lame reason they put forth.

[M' Ave 1,466]

If the brakes did get hot enough to loose stopping power, then maybe.. the dept should look into engineer training again on steep hills. I would assume it's equipt with a Jake brake and being all wheel drive over size brakes. Unless it was spec wrong it's not the trucks fault the brakes got hot.

I'm with this one.......if the brakes got too hot, then they need bigger brakes.

[x635 4,066]

Why not just remove the 1500GPM pump and 650 gallon booster tank? I'm sure that adds a lot of weight to the Rescue.

Here are some more photos and specs on the fleet from ocnyfire.com:

http://ocnyfire.com/departments/greenville.html

[bad box 371]

Several commissioners were voted out of office and the attorney for the fire district was let go. I've heard that members of a local political party club who also happen to be life long residents from the days before the community was significantly built up and modernized, decided that they didn't want the former commissioners to provide the things that were needed to allow for operation of a properly equipped, well trained, professional volunteer fire company. So they went door to door and ran a campaign of lies. They brought out enough misinformed folks to vote for the candidates that the political club wanted on the board. Now these newly elected folks (who appear to have no fire service knowledge and who have no interest in listening to and abiding by what the fire chief is telling them) are making decisions based solely upon seeking vengeance. Their mission appears to be to undo all of the good that the previous board did. If these commissioners are permitted to continue their misguided mission, at the very least it wouldn't surprise me to see the membership of the department stop volunteering and at the worst people may be placed in danger due to their V.F.D. being improperly equipped. Really a senseless and sad situation. It's terrible when politics are permitted to interfere with the mission of an emergency service.

[mfc2257 464]

I don't honestly buy that this rig is overweight for its braking system. I'll nearly guarantee that it has vented discs at all four corners that have more than double the stopping power of older drum style brakes that were the norm until the '90's and that were spec'd for the weight rating of the axle that they are attached to. If the truck were under spec'd from a braking standpoint, it would most likely by under spec'd from a suspension and axle standpoint as well, and there is no mention of that thus far.

This being said, can modern brake systems be cooked? Absolutely. But whether its a fire truck, big rig, or a race car, it's due to how the operator is driving the vehicle the vast majority of the time not the braking system. I'm unfamiliar with the mountainous road that was referenced before, but I'm willing to bet that it's not the first time this rig or any of the other rigs in the department have descended it. Starting at the top of the hill at a safe speed and utilizing the transmission and engine (Jake) brake along with the braking system should result in a controlled and safe descent. Most apparatus operators today simply leave the transmission selector in "drive" and never utilize the lower gear ratios to control the vehicle. The advent of tougher emissions controls and fuel standards has also brought forth the "free wheeling" concept, where when a rig is in high gear and coasting, that the transmission freewheels and thus the engine is not available to provide compression braking, nor is the engine brake functioning. The only way around this is in many cases is to select a lower gear that will not permit the transmission to freewheel.

Regardless, from the outside looking in, there appears to be more political motivation with this decision than concern for the roads and vehicle safety.

[pump305 53]

Captain, I agree with you. Look at the 3000 gal water tender (Tanker) and i'm sure the weight is closs if not a little more. I can't stress enough how dangerous free wheeling is. And again you are correct as most operators do leave it in drive and never use the gears as intended. Paper pushers have all the answers. Politicaly incorrect!

[v85 212]

I guess that gets back to whether or not fire apparatus drivers should have to have a CDL or not

[idlewildvfd 88]

State: Greenville Fire's reserve fund overfunded

By Gittel Evangelist

Times Herald-Record

Published: 2:00 AM - 06/03/14

GREENVILLE — A state audit found that the Greenville Fire District's capital reserve fund has been consistently overfunded since 2010, with a balance of nearly $900,000 at the end of 2012 — or roughly nine times the budgeted maximum for the fund.

The New York State Comptroller's Office conducted an audit for the period of Jan. 1, 2012, to Sept. 30, 2013, and reviewed the district's fund balances from fiscal years 2010 to 2012.

The audit found that "the district accumulated over $1.2 million in five separate reserve funds as of Dec. 31, 2012. The capital reserve fund accounted for almost 70 percent of the total reserve funds held by the district," with a balance of $889,327, the report states.

The capital reserve fund was established in 1982, with "an estimated $100,000 maximum funding level," the auditors said.

The district's budgeted expenditures were $557,465 for 2012 and $569,444 for 2013, according to the audit.

The district had been squirreling away the extra money for the anticipated purchase of a nearly $1 million, 75-foot ladder truck — a resolution the board of commissioners withdrew a year ago in the face of public opposition, followed shortly after by an upheaval on the five-member board.

"The majority of the new board would like to purchase a new rescue truck and new tanker truck for a total of approximately $750,000," the audit said.

If the new equipment is not purchased, the audit recommends that district officials use the money for one-time expenses and return the surplus to taxpayers by reducing property taxes in the future.

Allen Bobb Jr., chairman of the board of commissioners, issued a response, which was included in the state report, essentially agreeing with the audit's findings.

Bobb said the commissioners, at their April 8 meeting, voted to accept two proposals from a consultant called Emergency Vehicle Response to study the district's apparatus and fleet, as well as review the specifications for a custom rescue/pumper truck. The consultants are to begin their study in September, Bobb said.

The commissioners planned to pass a resolution to take one rescue truck out of service and to buy a new tanker/pumper truck, paid for with money from the capital reserve fund, Bobb said in the report.

Bobb could not be reached for comment Monday afternoon. Greenville Supervisor George Hossann Jr. also could not be reached Monday.

Edited June 3, 2014 by idlewildvfd