Any Alarm Assignment Info from yesteday's Yonkers 4 Alarm Fire?

[61MACKBR1 222]

Does anyone have the alarm breakdown from yesterday's Yonkers 4 Alarm Fire?

[R1SmokeEater 359]

First alarm:

E304,E303,E306,E308. L74, TL71, Rescue1, Battalion1

Signal 10-29. 10-30 (W/F, All Hands) Battalion2, L72 Fast truck

2nd Alarm. E307, E309, E312. TL75

3rd Alarm. Sq11, E310, L73

4th Alarm. E313, E314, L70

Additional on AH/multiples. The Deputy Chiefs, Car-2 Car-3. MSU. FIU (car6) Rehab w/Car45, Car1 Commish Sweeney etc.

After the 4th additional engine requested to relay water into Sq11. (Reserve)E317

Mutual aid is called in to man YFD Firehouses:

New Rochelle E22. Eastchester TL17 to YFD Sta1

Mt Vernon E4. Ladder2. To YFD Sta12

Hartsdale E170 to YFD Sta13

Recall Yonkers reserve rigs, E300, 317,319 TL80 bat3 etc......when in place released Mutual Aid.

Edited December 27, 2013 by R1SmokeEater

[R1SmokeEater 359]

http://www.firstonscenephotos.com/Yonkers/122613-South-Broadway-4th-Alar

[PEMO3 523]

Not being to familiar with YFD Ops & alarm assignments I have a few questions.First I noticed that the 1st alarm assignment was a 4 and 2 plus specialty response. Is this standard or was there dispatch info, e.g. multiple calls, confirmation from PD,etc, that dictated a large first alarm assignment? Next, I noticed that YFD pressed a large number of "reserve" units into service. Are these trucks manned by recall personnel? Definitely an advantage to having a large reserve fleet.

[Steve 78]

A local news station reported that the FDNY also responded to this fire.

Is that a true statement?

[v85 212]

Not being to familiar with YFD Ops & alarm assignments I have a few questions.First I noticed that the 1st alarm assignment was a 4 and 2 plus specialty response. Is this standard or was there dispatch info, e.g. multiple calls, confirmation from PD,etc, that dictated a large first alarm assignment? Next, I noticed that YFD pressed a large number of "reserve" units into service. Are these trucks manned by recall personnel? Definitely an advantage to having a large reserve fleet.

I can't say specifically for Yonkers, but when I was dispatching in Maryland, the response to a reported structure fire was

4 engines, 3 special service (ladder or rescue, 1 must be a ladder), 2 ambulances, 1 batallion chief, 1 EMS officer, 1 safety officer

a "task force response" which was intermediate between 1st and 2nd alarms got (I believe)

2 engines, 1 special service, 1 ambulance, 1 bataillion chief and maybe a fire investigator

So there are places out there which send big responses on 1st alarm.

Even my town's volunteer department here in NY sends at minimum on the 1st alarm 2 engines, 1 truck, 1 rescue and 1 tanker. Normally all 3 engines go.

[R1SmokeEater 359]

[R1SmokeEater 359]

Not being to familiar with YFD Ops & alarm assignments I have a few questions.First I noticed that the 1st alarm assignment was a 4 and 2 plus specialty response. Is this standard or was there dispatch info, e.g. multiple calls, confirmation from PD,etc, that dictated a large first alarm assignment? Next, I noticed that YFD pressed a large number of "reserve" units into service. Are these trucks manned by recall personnel? Definitely an advantage to having a large reserve fleet.

Reports of a structure fire gets 4x2xR1 and Battalion standard.

Reserves/spares are manned by recalled personnel. YFD tries not to hold the M/A companies longer than needed.

FDNY did not respond to the job nor relocate to the Firehouses.

Edited December 28, 2013 by R1SmokeEater

[bronxfireradio 45]

Heard a few unusual units on the air other than the reserve companies - Yonkers Guide Car, and Car 7XX.

[sfrd18 360]

As "R1SmokeEater" already posted, from my understanding Yonkers send 4 & 2, Rescue, and 1 BC on a Box. On a 10-29(Working Fire)/10-30(All Hands), an additional Truck (used to be an Engine) is sent as the F.A.S.T. along with a BC (if available) for the Safety Officer. The YFD used to send Car 5(Safety Battalion) to jobs but since they were disbanded, a BC operates as the Safety, of a company officer if one is unavailable. Also, YFD Car 6(Fire Investigation Unit) and the Mask Service Unit may get sent on a 10-29/10-30.

Also, Yonkers has a large and impressive Spare and Reserve fleet: I believe around 3-4 Spare Engines(300-Hose Wagon, 305, 315, 316), 2 Spare Ladders(76, 77), 1 Spare Tower Ladder(81), and 3 Reserve Engines(317, 318, 319), 2 Reserve Ladders(78, 79), and 1 Reserve Tower Ladder(80), as well as a Reserve Squad(SQ21) and Rescue(R2) (maybe a YFD guy can correct me on the numbers). The Reserves are fully equipped to run as additional units, staffed by callback personnel, while the Spares operate when a company's frontline rig goes down for maintenance or service repairs.

[ks1980 36]

A local news station reported that the FDNY also responded to this fire.

Is that a true statement?

In relation to this incident I don't know either way on FDNY's response however I know in the past FDNY has gone mutual aid to Yonkers in several larger incidents. I was a one of them a few years back on Bronx River Road. So I am guessing they assisted perhaps someone else can confirm

[TimesUp 148]

Somewhere in the rundown of mutual aid units there is probably a county coordinator too? Also many mutual aid Chiefs self dispatch along with the engine or truck they send.

Sometimes a safety officer as well.

[Dinosaur 844]

Somewhere in the rundown of mutual aid units there is probably a county coordinator too? Also many mutual aid Chiefs self dispatch along with the engine or truck they send.

Sometimes a safety officer as well.

Self-dispatch? Really? That's encouraging. I guess we've learned nothing in the past 13 years about that.

[Dinosaur 844]

Not being to familiar with YFD Ops & alarm assignments I have a few questions.First I noticed that the 1st alarm assignment was a 4 and 2 plus specialty response. Is this standard or was there dispatch info, e.g. multiple calls, confirmation from PD,etc, that dictated a large first alarm assignment? Next, I noticed that YFD pressed a large number of "reserve" units into service. Are these trucks manned by recall personnel? Definitely an advantage to having a large reserve fleet.

Yonkers has an impressive fleet and does their best to minimize the use of mutual aid (imagine that!). They start recalling personnel early and staff reserve apparatus (imagine that!) so the mutual aid can be returned to where it came from.

YFD also has a lot of specialty apparatus. It's an impressive operation.

[Bnechis 3,961]

Its not self dispatch. Most depts. have policies about sending a chief or safety officer anytime a rig is sent M/A. YFD and other depts. are well aware of this. 60 Control does not tone them out, because who goes varies by time of day/day of week.

Actually, 60 Control does not dispatch specific units from any department.

i.e 60 Control to all New Rochelle Stations, respond 1 engine & 1 ladder to Yonkers Station #1, 5 New School Street. Guess what....nobody goes, the DC calls 60 and tells them who may go and 60 re-dispatches the units.

[Bnechis 3,961]

A well known/respected member of YFD posted here what they dispatch and what policy is and additional posters AFTER that post, write "I think" this is how YFD operates. right or wrong, its not needed.

Can we try to read the post 1st, before posting. Thank you.

[Dinosaur 844]

Its not self dispatch. Most depts. have policies about sending a chief or safety officer anytime a rig is sent M/A. YFD and other depts. are well aware of this. 60 Control does not tone them out, because who goes varies by time of day/day of week.

Actually, 60 Control does not dispatch specific units from any department.

i.e 60 Control to all New Rochelle Stations, respond 1 engine & 1 ladder to Yonkers Station #1, 5 New School Street. Guess what....nobody goes, the DC calls 60 and tells them who may go and 60 re-dispatches the units.

Policies? Wow, if only more departments actually wrote those pesky things. I figured there was a policy to send someone with mutual aid and knew it wasn't "self-dispatching". Calling it self-dispatching was a very poor choice of words. Unless there is a policy or discussion with the requesting agency, sending more or less than is asked for undermines the entire operation. Time that nonsense stopped!

A well known/respected member of YFD posted here what they dispatch and what policy is and additional posters AFTER that post, write "I think" this is how YFD operates. right or wrong, its not needed.

Can we try to read the post 1st, before posting. Thank you.

If people actually stopped commenting when someone answered the question properly on this site, there'd be half as many posts. But hey, we know what a department in Maryland does and what someone in Stamford thinks. Why listen to the YFD guy?

[Dinosaur 844]

A local news station reported that the FDNY also responded to this fire.

Is that a true statement?

I was visiting a buddy at one of the departments that went mutual aid to this job and listened all the way up to the 4th. Never heard any mention of FDNY but of course that was Westchester radio.

[61MACKBR1 222]

R1Smokeeater said it exactly as the current dispatching of a Major Alarm Fire in the City of Yonkers is handled. In the case of Thursday's event. all front line YFD apparatus was dispatched to the scene, as part of the 4 alarms. In addition, New Rochelle sent 1 engine (apparently that was the only apparatus that NRFD could send on M/A) and Eastchester sent TL17. Also, Mount Vernon sent 1/1 (Ladder 2 and a Engine Company) and I believe Greenville sent an Engine Company. As R1Smokeeater indicated, based on YFD protocol, in these multi-alarm fires, they (YFD) calls in off duty personnel to man "Reserve Rigs" to take over covering YFD Stations and to allow Mutual Aid Companies to be released from the City. I don't believe that any other city in Westchester County has such a program, where "Reserve Rigs" are available to be manned by Off Duty Personnel. YFD has, as part of their continual upgrading of Front Line Apparatus, has been able to place these former front line rigs into Reserve Status or Spare Status. Yonkers FD having the ability to have 10 Front Line Engine Companies (303, 304, 306, 307, 308, 309, 310, 312, 313, 314), 1 Squad Company (11), 4 Ladder Companies (70, 72, 73, 74), 2 Tower Ladders (71, 75) and a Rescue Company (R1), along with 3 Spare Engine Companies (300, 305, 317), 2 Spare Ladder Companies (76, 78), 1 Spare Tower Ladder (80), 1 Spare Squad (21), and 1 Spare Rescue (R2), ALONG with 3 Reserve Engine Companies (316, 318, 319), 2 Reserve Ladder Compannies (77, 79), and 1 Reserve Tower Ladder (81). YFD also has a various assortment of Special Operations Apparatus/Equipment, that are available dependent upon the needs and requirements of the department.

Many have said that YFD's Reserve and Spare Apparatus Fleet is better than some other cities in Westchester County's Front Line Apparatus.

As it relates to what departments are requested to come to Yonkers to cover as part of Mutual Aid is based upon the list provided to 60 Control and the County. "Recent History" has indicated that New Rochelle, Eastchester, Mount Vernon and Fairview are the first to be called into Yonkers (This is based upon agreements made with those cities fire departments). There has only been a handful of incidents in recent history that other outside departments have come into Yonkers to either cover stations or assist in battling fires. The Bronx River Road job was one that FDNY was asked to come in and assist with (I don't see FDNY manning stations, but I could see FDNY being asked to assist with fighting a fire). White Plains FD, I believe has been asked on a rare occasion to come in and help as part of Mutual Aid.

I believe that Yonkers is on the list to go into New Rochelle to help as part of Mutual Aid. I don't believe (and I maybe incorect) that Yonkers is on the list to go into Mount Vernon as part of Mutual Aid.

Maybe others (people from within YFD) can ellaborate on this more

Edited December 28, 2013 by 61MACKBR1

[TimesUp 148]

When somebody shows up at a fire in some sort of official capacity in another city or town without being dispatched i don't know what else to call it but "self dispatched" In some cases they're not there because they have personal on scene either.

[Bnechis 3,961]

Yes, if their rigs are not there, & they go to the scene you could call it "self dispatched", but when we go to cover the house and even to the scene with our companies their is a reason for it and its part of our dispatch protocol,

[retiredff914 0]

R1Smokeeater said it exactly as the current dispatching of a Major Alarm Fire in the City of Yonkers is handled. In the case of Thursday's event. all front line YFD apparatus was dispatched to the scene, as part of the 4 alarms. In addition, New Rochelle sent 1 engine (apparently that was the only apparatus that NRFD could send on M/A) and Eastchester sent TL17. Also, Mount Vernon sent 1/1 (Ladder 2 and a Engine Company) and I believe Greenville sent an Engine Company. As R1Smokeeater indicated, based on YFD protocol, in these multi-alarm fires, they (YFD) calls in off duty personnel to man "Reserve Rigs" to take over covering YFD Stations and to allow Mutual Aid Companies to be released from the City. I don't believe that any other city in Westchester County has such a program, where "Reserve Rigs" are available to be manned by Off Duty Personnel. YFD has, as part of their continual upgrading of Front Line Apparatus, has been able to place these former front line rigs into Reserve Status or Spare Status. Yonkers FD having the ability to have 10 Front Line Engine Companies (303, 304, 306, 307, 308, 309, 310, 312, 313, 314), 1 Squad Company (11), 4 Ladder Companies (70, 72, 73, 74), 2 Tower Ladders (71, 75) and a Rescue Company (R1), along with 3 Spare Engine Companies (300, 305, 317), 2 Spare Ladder Companies (76, 78), 1 Spare Tower Ladder (80), 1 Spare Squad (21), and 1 Spare Rescue (R2), ALONG with 3 Reserve Engine Companies (316, 318, 319), 2 Reserve Ladder Compannies (77, 79), and 1 Reserve Tower Ladder (81). YFD also has a various assortment of Special Operations Apparatus/Equipment, that are available dependent upon the needs and requirements of the department.

Many have said that YFD's Reserve and Spare Apparatus Fleet is better than some other cities in Westchester County's Front Line Apparatus.

As it relates to what departments are requested to come to Yonkers to cover as part of Mutual Aid is based upon the list provided to 60 Control and the County. "Recent History" has indicated that New Rochelle, Eastchester, Mount Vernon and Fairview are the first to be called into Yonkers (This is based upon agreements made with those cities fire departments). There has only been a handful of incidents in recent history that other outside departments have come into Yonkers to either cover stations or assist in battling fires. The Bronx River Road job was one that FDNY was asked to come in and assist with (I don't see FDNY manning stations, but I could see FDNY being asked to assist with fighting a fire). White Plains FD, I believe has been asked on a rare occasion to come in and help as part of Mutual Aid.

I believe that Yonkers is on the list to go into New Rochelle to help as part of Mutual Aid. I don't believe (and I maybe incorect) that Yonkers is on the list to go into Mount Vernon as part of Mutual Aid.

Maybe others (people from within YFD) can ellaborate on this more

Mutual aid companies are actually New Rochelle, Eastchester, Mount Vernon, and Greenville. In the particular case of the South Broadway fire Greenville was down an engine so could not send one so the next on the list was Hartsdale. Fairview is further down the list after Greenville and Hartsdale. The first mutual aid company released was Hartsdale at approximately 2300hrs when E-319 arrived to release them from Station 13.

Yonkers is on both Greenville and Hartsdale's mutual aid list as part of 2nd alarm assignments I believe.

[everybodygoes 331]

The last time we went to Yonkers was probably that 6th alarm in that H type, daily we go to respond north on BRP for car accidents, thats usually always 63 39 or 38 and 51 or 52's.

[FirNaTine 370]

Absolutely ltrob I have also witnessed this so called "self dispatching" policy aka "Buffing" by high ranking Officers. What I don't understand is many times they're from Depts who themselves constantly beat the drum about a lack of manpower; layoffs; closing of Stations and Companies; etc.. etc... Another thing that perplexes me is how can a Dept. who complains to no avail about these ever so important and justified life and death issues can even think about sending their already understaffed Dept. on M/A, especially to a Dept. who refuses to do the same for them. What a f****** Joke the Fire Service in Westchester has become!

[tommyguy 104]

Interesting thread. Given the volume of fire YFD had to contend with, and the density of that downtown block, they appear to have done a tremendous job in knocking down the fire. It could've easily extended to other buildings and become a real catastrophe. Great job (as usual) by Yonkers.

I have two questions.

1. The Bee-Line bus shown parked within the fire lines. Was that there to give firefighters a warm dry place to take a breather?

2. The alarm assignment shows E170 Hartsdale was MA at Station 13 on Kimball Avenue. Does anyone know if E170 got any jobs while they were there?

[SageVigiles 1,194]

Wait, you mean a department didn't want to send a company into a city that they don't normally operate in without ensuring there was a command level officer present? I for one am both shocked AND appauled at this display of professional responsibility.

I'm sure if Yonkers had an issue with this they'd stop calling these departments for mutual aid...

Edited December 30, 2013 by SageVigiles

[FirNaTine 370]

The issue isn't if YFD had problem with said policy the real issue is a Dept. not wanting to be the "bad guy" and sending their apparatus and skeleton crew(Not complying with NFPA 1710) to a Municipality that does comply with NFPA 1710, who in turn won't reciprocate with M/A. Personally I really don't need a Commanding Officer either to standby in Quarters if the apparatus(s) already have a Line Officer(s) anyway. I can see maybe if they're going to the scene but with YFD that is rare. I don't know why YFD is calling some of these understaffed and equipped Depts. anyway. They should sign a M/A with FDNY but that may upset a lot of individuals who want to go and play in the next towns sandbox.

Edited December 30, 2013 by FirNaTine

[antiquefirelt 994]

Personally I really don't need a Commanding Officer either to standby in Quarters if the apparatus(s) already have a Line Officer(s) anyway. I can see maybe if they're going to the scene but with YFD that is rare.

Isn't the purpose of a covering assignment to take calls that are anticipated? If you're expecting nothing to happen why not question the overall purpose of the assignment (stand by in quarters) ? I know that when we put our personnel into another departments incident we assign a chief officer, this includes covers thereby ensuring a chief is immediately available should a significant incident come in. While most line officers are very used to (and capable) being the first in IC, when you take them outside their own coverage area you introduce many other potential issues (unfamiliar street, hydrant spacing,non-common LE and EMS freqs and policies, etc.), a chief officer as a liaison if nothing else can smooth these and ensure the line companies can just do their job.

Edited December 30, 2013 by antiquefirelt

[Disaster_Guy 96]

1. The Bee-Line bus shown parked within the fire lines. Was that there to give firefighters a warm dry place to take a breather?

From my understanding, the bus was requested in order to provide temporary shelter for the evacuated (later displaced) residents of 371 South Broadway (the 4-story/48-unit apartment building next to the fire building). I don't know whether it was OEM, FD, or PD who made the request. Once the Red Cross with OEM set up a Reception Center at a nearby church, the Bee-Line bus was released after a few hours of service and cleared the scene. I'm sure the bus could also have been used for firefighters, but I only saw it being utilized by a dozen or so civilians.

I could be mistaken, so feel free to correct me if that's the case.

[FirNaTine 370]

Ive responded numerous times to neighboring Depts. and they usually assign a Chief and Line Officer(guide) to assist you. Do I really need a Chief from my own Dept with me as well when he may be more beneficial and of some use staying within his own boundaries? Years ago yes when we were all on different frequencies but now we can all communicate with each other. Besides who knows their municipality better a Chief from a neighboring Dept. or one that's been working there for yrs. If you respond to the scene or a subsequent Job then sure maybe they can respond but like I said that's far and few between. I don't think it's a life and death situation if a Commanding Officer responds on M/A especially to standby in qrts.