What Defines Alarm Levels in Westchester?

[x635 4,066]

I'm curious, what defines alarm levels in Westchester? For example, what constitutes an 2nd Alarm? Is it a definitive, county wide protocol yet, or subjectively determined by each department (run cards)?

[FFEMT150 214]

The chiefs request for additional resources.

[dave0820 50]

In Westchester, are fire levels pre programmed? If an incident commander requests a first alarm or a second alarm, does dispatch automatically know what and who to dispatch or does the IC ask for the apparatus and crews individually? Like if a IC requests a second alarm on the south side of Peekskill, does dispatch automatically send Buchanan, Montrose, Verplank to the scene, and have Continental village and Mohegan cover the city or does the Chief have to figure out what he wants?

[Chkpoint 131]

I asked that question recently to a chief after a big fire. Answer I got was if confirmed fire 60 knows from pre plans what I want went I confirm its a fire and what I want when I say 2nd, 3rd alarm and so on unless special instructions. I asked what is a 2nd alarm and what does it bring he said for them it's what first alarm brings. So 2 or 3 engines and 1 ladder addition would make it a 2nd alarm. I know in a big city like NY it's different.

[CFI609D 119]

Here in Westchester, home rule prevails so it is up to the AHJ as to what they want in their alarm assignments. Most departments (including I believe all of the career departments) have developed response and alarm assignments based upon the Alarm Level. In my Battalion most of the FDs have automatic responses in the CAD system at 60 Control, which makes mutual aid responses much more efficient and make life easier for the IC. There are some jurisdictions, however where the Chief prefers to request specific mutual aid responses on the fly.

[Bnechis 3,961]

It is clearly different from one dept to another and even when the depts have the "same" i.e. 2 engines + 1 ladder = 1st alarm the staffing can be 3 or 13 for that same alarm. It really should not be that.

30 years ago we would send 2 engines + 1 ladder + 1 chief to a fire and that would get you 13-15 ff's.

Now we send 2 engines + 2 ladder + 1 chief and you get 14ff's. Plus once its a worker, you get 2 more engines (1 for water & 1 FAST).

The ISO standards require a minimum of 2 engines + 1 ladder (or rescue) + 1 chief and a minimum of 13 on duty members or 37 on call members

NFPA 1710 require a minimum of 2 engines + 1 ladder (or rescue) + 1 chief but a minimum of 16 or 17 (the extra 2 over ISO are for 2 out and for a search team), if its a worker they require you add 2 more to the 2 out to make it a FAST and add a safety officer.

Historically each alarm duplicated whatever the 1st alarm sent and as far as I am concerned that how it sould be. Just because your dept does not have enough rigs to make the next alarm level with what you have should not mean you run short.

Now whats really interesting is why:

Before phones and radios we had street boxes and everyone knew if there was a fire you ran to the closest box and pulled the lever AND waited for the FD to arrive so you could direct them to the call. When you pulled the lever the # on the box would be transmitted via telegraph to all the fire stations in the dept and either a bell would sound the number (VFD's had the horns sound the #) &/or a tape would be cut with the number of holes.

So if the box was #236 the tape would look like this: << <<< <<<<<<. The man on watch would look up on a big wall chart and find out what intersection #236 was at (VFD's had a little pocket manual) and what the pattern was. Then if the pattern included that rig they went. The standard was a minimum of 2 engines (an engine was a steamer and hose wagon) and a ladder or city service unit).

If they got there and the chief want more help, he would have someone run to the next pull box (say #237) and "Pull or strike the 2nd Alarm" or if they had a telegraph key in the box he could go back to the original box and "tap out or strike a 2nd alarm"

When that # came in the house watch would look at the chart, see that the 1st alarm units were not available and additional units would go to the new box (not knowing if they were going to the same job or a different one nearby).

If this was still not enough, go to the third box and "Pull or strike the 3rd Alarm"

[v85 212]

When I was in the DC Area I believe they combined the 1st alarm and working fire dispatches, as we would send

4 engines, 3 special services (at least 1 ladder/tower, the rest were either ladders/towers or rescues), 2 Transport units (ambulances) 1 Batt. Chief, 1 Safety Officer, 1 EMS officer

The next level was a task force, which brought I believe 2 engines, 1 special service, 1 transport unit.

[Spartan052 43]

In Westchester, are fire levels pre programmed? If an incident commander requests a first alarm or a second alarm, does dispatch automatically know what and who to dispatch or does the IC ask for the apparatus and crews individually? Like if a IC requests a second alarm on the south side of Peekskill, does dispatch automatically send Buchanan, Montrose, Verplank to the scene, and have Continental village and Mohegan cover the city or does the Chief have to figure out what he wants?

it depends on the situation because buchanan with thier cascade is more commonly on the 1st alarm with mohegan as the fast team and others on s/b within the city

[Dinosaur 844]

In Westchester, are fire levels pre programmed? If an incident commander requests a first alarm or a second alarm, does dispatch automatically know what and who to dispatch or does the IC ask for the apparatus and crews individually? Like if a IC requests a second alarm on the south side of Peekskill, does dispatch automatically send Buchanan, Montrose, Verplank to the scene, and have Continental village and Mohegan cover the city or does the Chief have to figure out what he wants?

I'm curious, what defines alarm levels in Westchester? For example, what constitutes an 2nd Alarm? Is it a definitive, county wide protocol yet, or subjectively determined by each department (run cards)?

Every Tom, Dick, and Harry defines alarm levels and it can change every time the chief changes in some departments.

It ought to be standard so everyone knows the severity of the incident but if you compare a 3rd alarm in X to a 3rd alarm in Z they could be completely different.

As was said, first alarm: 3 engines, 2 ladders, rescue, chief.

Second alarm, 2 engines, 1 ladder, mask service, chief.

Third and subsquent, 2 engines, 1 ladder...

If you need something special, ask for it. That's why they say "special call".