White Plains Fire Department Volunteer Division

[v85 212]

I was always under the impression that White Plains was an all career department, but when I went to the WCVFA parade on Sunday I saw an Engine and what looked to be a POV labeled "White Plains Fire Department Volunteer Division". I checked on the White Plains website and didn't see any information, so I was just wondering if anyone here knew anything about them.

Do they have operational responsibilities? Are they solely a PR/Parade type function?

[sfrd18 360]

I believe the volunteer division runs out of the former WPFD Station 5 on Robertson Ave. in the Battle Hill section of the city, and have a former '70's WPFD Maxim pumper, designated as county Engine 210 for parade purposes. I don't think they have any firefighting duties, but not 100% on that.

[sfrd18 360]

Here's a picture of WPFD Vol. Div. Engine 210:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/72131699@N00/4689720650/

[JM15 386]

What does being a parade unit mean?

[v85 212]

That they don't respond to any calls. They are solely for parades.

[Bnechis 3,961]

They have not responded to a single fire in over 30 years, but every year they got 2% funds because at some point prior to the 1980's they did.

A few years ago they were changed to a CERT team. but I guess they kept the parade function for fun.

[99subi 121]

so taxpayers pay for this!??!!? what an outrage!

[SteveOFD 176]

so taxpayers pay for this!??!!? what an outrage!

Not looking to defend or support this, but the 2% funds are a surcharge on fire insurance policies written by foreign (i.e. out of state) insurance companies. No tax money is involved.

An interesting interpretation from the NYS Insurance Department can be found here http://www.dfs.ny.gov/insurance/ogco2007/rg070522.htm .

[TimesUp 148]

They shouldn't get any 2% money since they don't provide fire protection. The members of the White Plains fire department are losing out on money for the last 30 years.

[Jybehofd 85]

Sounds like theft to me. But hey, Parades are good for communities right guys? Whata joke!

yes its one form... and there are many many forms of it in the northern end if you look

[dwcfireman 656]

Is there anyone out there that can answer the orignial question? I'm a bit interested myself.

[FF1 172]

Sounds like theft to me. But hey, Parades are good for communities right guys? Whata joke!

they would respond to fires if they could. they are essentially forced out of firefighting duties by the powers that be. the only theft involved would be forcing them out so 2% funds would go entirely to the career staff

[FF1 172]

FORCED OUT? Let me guess...no training, no fit tests, no physicals, no clue. Dude it aint about responding but about operating safely. What are these Wallys going to do once they respond if they have no training?

correction. they didn't leave on their own. the city chose to go fully career (which I have no opinion on) I'm all for more jobs. I mean to say that they had no choice in the matter. WP disbanded the volunteers, so its not as if they refuse to train and only come to parades

[Avon Rob 40]

At one time, the vollies served a purpose in White Plains and other cities. Times are changing. But no need to knock anyone who still wants to participate in any manner. Parades are good for any community. White Plains hosted the NYS convention some years ago. Large crowds lined the streets to watch & cheer on the marchers. As to the 2% issue, didn't Mt. Vernon have the same issue some years ago? If I remember, there was a split in the funding. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong. As to working together, get over it. It is a necessity in today's work place.

[v85 212]

I didn't even realize that paid departments got 2% monies. My understanding of 2% was that it was money the fire district paid back to the fire companies in a volunteer system for good and welfare of members

[mfc2257 464]

I didn't even realize that paid departments got 2% monies. My understanding of 2% was that it was money the fire district paid back to the fire companies in a volunteer system for good and welfare of members

I'm not the person to do it, but I'm sure that someone here can give us a lecture on old 2% money and new 2% money and the differences in how they are distributed and can be used.... I'll try to do some research but it'll be a while before I get to it.

[mfc2257 464]

I'm not the person to do it, but I'm sure that someone here can give us a lecture on old 2% money and new 2% money and the differences in how they are distributed and can be used.... I'll try to do some research but it'll be a while before I get to it.

Look here on page 9.... in a letter to Mr. Brown of Port Chester from attorney Edward Regan on behalf of State Comptroller Kenneth Hartman... http://www.fasny.com/pdfs/redhandbook.pdf ...

"It has been judicially determined that, in a fire department consisting of both paid and volunteer firemen,

both the paid and volunteer firemen are entitled to share in the distribution of foreign fire insurance tax

monies (Cary v Oneida, 158 App Div 773, 144 NYS 57; Eisenger v Stein, 57 Misc 2d 16, 290 NYS2d

979"

[mfc2257 464]

it would also appear that 2% monies are to be distributed in a pro rata share to multiple companies (paid or volunteer) within the same district according to the size of their rosters. Thus it logic dictates that the City of White Plains career firefighters should receive a greater share of 2% monies than the volunteer division which I'm assuming has a limited roster these days.

http://www.fasny.com/pdfs/redhandbook.pdf

Page 19

"...in the absence of an express legislative enactment precluding the paid firemen of a particular city from sharing in the

insurance premium tax, all firemen in the locality were entitled to share ratably in the funds collected

pursuant to the Insurance Law” (51 NY2d at 195, 196, 433 NYS2d at 74)."

[gamewell45 258]

Yeah and I bet they were all NYS-OFPC FF1 and FF2 certified...gimme a break! WP is run by cheap bastids who wouldn't hesitate to use free labor if they could

I've been told by a member from White Plains VFD (so your getting this second hand) that the labor contracts prohibit volunteers from doing any firefighting operations and it's been that way for many years. The only thing they do now as volunteers is CERT; they are all that's left of the volunteer fire department aside from the exempt and associate members.

[TimesUp 148]

http://www.dfs.ny.gov/insurance/faqs/faqs_ft_fft.htm

This could help

[TimesUp 148]

"Fire department affording fire protection" Not just having a certain number of members on a roster

[mfc2257 464]

"Fire department affording fire protection" Not just having a certain number of members on a roster

Page 17

"INSURANCE LAW, §~ 9104,9105: Where foreign fire insurance tax monies are distributed in accordance with Insurance Law, §~ 9104 and 9105, the monies must be allocated between or among the volunteer fire companies of a multi-company fire department in proportion to the active membership of each company. 1979 Opns St Comp No. 79-102 p 19 superseded to the extent inconsistent."

[TimesUp 148]

http://www.dfs.ny.gov/insurance/ogco2008/rg080410.htm

Active membership, those active in providing fire protection

[TimesUp 148]

Hence, an “active member” of a fire company is a member who participates in firefighting and is subject to call for whatever duties may be assigned to him under the rules and regulations of the fire department or company of which he is a member.

[Bnechis 3,961]

I didn't even realize that paid departments got 2% monies. My understanding of 2% was that it was money the fire district paid back to the fire companies in a volunteer system for good and welfare of members

Paid depts do not get 2% monies. 2% monies go to the MEMBERSHIP of the FD. For many years in many municipalities the manger and/or mayors has tried to get their hands on those funds and the state keeps telling then no.

And it must be used for the good and welfare of all members (career or volunteer) and it includes retired members.

Most career members get some form of insurance coverage (dental, glasses, life, Rx. etc.) that the job does not provide.

[Bnechis 3,961]

they would respond to fires if they could. they are essentially forced out of firefighting duties by the powers that be. the only theft involved would be forcing them out so 2% funds would go entirely to the career staff

In thelate 1980's and early 1990's The mayor and most if not all members of the common council were volunteers. they also were the ones who agreed to the contracts and in effect were "the powers that be"

It was rumored that many parties were held with those funds. It always sounded like those parties were really political events.

[FF1 172]

In thelate 1980's and early 1990's The mayor and most if not all members of the common council were volunteers. they also were the ones who agreed to the contracts and in effect were "the powers that be"

It was rumored that many parties were held with those funds. It always sounded like those parties were really political events.

thanks for the info Capt. I was not aware of who these members were. That seems very interesting to me. Makes not sense to complain if they, themselves were the ones that voted on this, yet not complain about it.

[pjm1733 22]

please delete my post

Edited September 27, 2013 by pjm1733

[x635 4,066]

From what I heard, The Volunteers helped Provided 40 residents of a Homicide/Suicide/Arson With clothing, shelter , food , facilities , medicine and services, with help from the police, red cross, and dept of recreation..but nobody will ever hear about that !

We just did. You told us. And if they really did and they're worried that people don't know they are still out there, then they really need someone to do better proactive public relations.

[pjm1733 22]

Edited September 27, 2013 by pjm1733