Irvington Volunteer Ambulance Corps in trouble?

[Westchester 49]

As a rivertown resident it's upsetting for me to see the Irvington Volunteer Ambulance Corps slowly go down the tube. In a recent Irvington Work Section on WEDNESDAY, JULY 10, 2013 - 7:00 P.M. On the village website http://www.irvingtonny.gov/ Captain Ellen Lewit spoke to Village Mayor, Trusees and said the Ambulance Corps is in big trouble. Now lets go back in time where IVAC had 60 or +/-members and about 30 +/- EMTs, and there was a time when they talked about always covering Dobbs Ferry when they could'nt bet a rig out. Well the shoe is on the other foot now Dobbs Ferry is covering Irvington. The Captain even says it during the meeting and if anything happened to her the Ambulance would never get out. It concerns me that the Captain is spilling her guts to the Village which has nothing to do with the Ambulance Corps. except for the contract to provide service to Irvington and the retirement plan. It's time for a paid service in Irvington. Why wait until someone dies because they ca't get a rig out and what does the Dept of Emergency Services say that IVAC is not following the Mutual Aide Agreement correctly. In the video of the work session, Captain Lewit metions that she has been in contact with Dobbs for coverage. Has she informed 60 Control of this? This problem within IVAC has been growing for sometime now. I think it's time for Greenburgh or the County to investigate this serios problem. And the kick in the butt is that they still have CME training and EMT classes and no old or new members for IVAC are in it. I know all Volunteer organizations have some problems recruting or getting rigs out in a fast time. But this happened to IVAC very fast and very bad. Lately it's been the talk of the villages.The only idea that might help is that the Rivertowns is to merge in some way or go all paid. It's time to clean house in IVAC and help it before it falls. THEY NEED VOLUNTEERS NOW.

Edited July 18, 2013 by Westchester

[Goose 188]

This is simply not just an Irvington problem. It's a county-wide problem. Bottom line is those (politicians and governing bodies) with the power to push / demand / enforce real change just don't care. As far as people dyeing or suffering needlessly, we passed that threshold a long time ago. Fitch & Associates did the study in 2008 and no one did a god damned thing about it.

http://www.westchesterlegislators.com/pdf/2008_EMS_Study_Final_Report.pdf

There it is, in black and white.

[shfirefighter 19]

This happens alot more than you think theres other villages out there that this happened to another rivertowns VAC just came out of a problem like that.

[99subi 121]

paid staff. problem solved.

[Bnechis 3,961]

paid staff. problem solved.

We have too many agencies, with too many UNDER Paid staff (mostly perdiems) and this just hurts everyone. Most agencies do not have thecall volume to justify paying people to sleep.

Just treats the symptoms.

[Westchester 49]

If Volunteer Ambulance Corps get together and go to the county, maybe a merge of services could be done. As more and more residents move or village employees can't leave to volunteer the villages have a big problem. If IVAC gets a paid crew for day times Captain Lewit said they have $200,000 saved up + they get third party billing from insurance companies.Does it make sense for them to pay 2 people to sit around and do maybe 4 calls a week. If Irvington, Dobbs, and Tarrytown merge it's possible to have a paid crew. They could do what Greenburgh Police do have a paramedic at Dobbs headquarters and respond to area calls. It's just sad to see this problem happen all over, but IVAC has been hit hard and fast. I don't know if it is a internal problem with the Officers or the membership. I heard they lost alot of members in a short time, and very good members. The Village of Irvington sholud look at this problem very fast and try to aide or guide IVAC so they can respond in a more timely manner. I'm getting old know with more and more health problems and I wonder what would happen to me if I called 911. How long would it take for IVAC to repond and how many crew members would show up to carry me down my stairs. I'm posting this because I'm scared!

Edited July 18, 2013 by Westchester

[Jybehofd 85]

simple the county won't step in that is half the problem with the home rule state. It takes for over to set up policy that affect every department on the ems side. look at the policy on EMDing that the county ems council came out with... they were trying to get the number of 911 answers sites down, now if its a stubbed toe and its not EMD a medic goes.

[Jybehofd 85]

The county has no EMS how would they go to the county?

[10512 214]

It is the system that is broken.

Trying to fix each individual VAC is like swimming upstream. It is not going to work very well nor will it work for very long, and when you are done you will have the same problem next door. The ambulance response solution may be something akin to a County service, or regional merges and/or paid staff.

These issues have been happening for years. For most, the individual VAC's have been able to put off the issues, but as the issues gets worse, it can no longer be put off.

Many local Volunteer FD's are not far behind in facing the same manning problems.

Edited July 18, 2013 by 10512

[Westchester 49]

I agree with all of your posts I live in Irvington and work in Manhattan. I have tried to work on problems with the 911 system for years. Where in Manhattan as you know FDNY Ambulances are situated in different areas on streets or in Hospitals. But if local volunteer agencies make there problems known to Village Goverment, Town or County Goverment maybe we can have a solution for this ongoing problem. I understand to have paid EMS or paid Firedepartments in our Villages or Towns will be a very costly problem to the tax payers who are barely making ends meat+ salaries for EMS or Fire are low. But when I see my Village Ambulance Corps wating on the apron for a driver or EMT or hear the Captain od IVAC to say " If anything happens to me, the ambulance will not roll, I on 7 days a week" it scares me. And I see other villages and towns with the same problem. But it's happening to much with lives of our loved ones at stake. Yeah Volunteer Fire Service is seeing a slow down in new membership, but when a structure fire in confirmed all Rigs roll and everybody shows up. When it comes to EMS( like Irvington) they have a schedule of members in time slots. If the Captain is showing the Village of Irvington during the work section empty slots thats real real bad. If a Cardic Arrest call comes in it will take of course longer to get EMS there. I personally have been trying to figure a solution to this area problem, and I have found only one solution. To merge Villages or Towns and have central stations in certain areas to provide EMS care. I hope that Captain Lewit of IVAC follows this all the way!

[Westchester 49]

It is the system that is broken.

Trying to fix each individual VAC is like swimming upstream. It is not going to work very well nor will it work for very long, and when you are done you will have the same problem next door. The ambulance response solution may be something akin to a County service, or regional merges and/or paid staff.

These issues have been happening for years. For most, the individual VAC's have been able to put off the issues, but as the issues gets worse, it can no longer be put off.

Many local Volunteer FD's are not far behind in facing the same manning problems.

Maybe the problem is internal. Every office has a different mind set and members are volunteers and don't like to be talked down too.

[Westchester 49]

The county has no EMS how would they go to the county?

REMSCO and the Department of Emergency Services all work within the County guidelines, If they see Ambulances or Fire Trucks not getting out the door and other agiences filling in for them, a chain affect will happen and a patient or home will be left without coverage. The County has to address this situation, if enough VAC's of FD's stand together and say we have a problem

[Westchester 49]

paid staff. problem solved.

Or Officers are bad and Members are giving up. Look what happened in Tarrytown with alligations against a member and some bailing out to join Sleepy Hollow. Is that right. Fix the problem in TVAC and the Members will stay

[Westchester 49]

This happens alot more than you think theres other villages out there that this happened to another rivertowns VAC just came out of a problem like that.

I give Sleepy Hollow Vac credit. You saw the problem and addressed the problem as soon as they can. But for a while Tarrytown Vac was covering Sleepy Hollow. Irvington was covering Tarrytown. Dobbs was covering Irvington. Poor Ardsley not only takes care of Saw Mill and Thruway but has Avalon Retirement Development and still does mutual aide. Hastings is part of the FD and they cover Ardsley and so on.If someone doen't see the problem then Empress or Westchester EMS will take over

[pjgold14 3]

We have too many agencies, with too many UNDER Paid staff (mostly perdiems) and this just hurts everyone. Most agencies do not have thecall volume to justify paying people to sleep.

Once again, can't fight the uninformed ignorance that exists!!!! It's NOT about call volume! Do your research!!!

[FFEMT84 2]

It's a growing problem throughout the county yes some agencies can't justify the cost because of the call volume

[Goose 188]

paid staff. problem solved.

Problem not solved, and more problems created. Again, this is lifted directly from the Fitch study that the county government commissioned in 2008.

More than a dozen EMS services in Westchester County have already begun to attempt to address the reduction of volunteerism and, at the same time, provide paramedic-level care. Several Corps that the Consultants interviewed used paid paramedic staff during the day or 24-hours per day. Volunteers on staffed shifts or responding from home rounded out the ambulance crew. This blend of paid personnel with volunteer staff, especially during the harder to serve business day, is not uncommon.

There are three concerns with the model of using a paid paramedic supplemented by volun- teers. The following is a description of each concern.

First, in many of the Corps we spoke with, the paid position was not a Full Time Equiva- lent (FTE). This meant that paramedics had to work at other jobs to make a living wage. Often that other job was another Corps or commercial ambulance service in the County. This results in multiple organizations drawing from the same available workforce pool, which reduces staffing capacity if a jurisdiction has a major event.

The second concern is safety. EMS services that employ full-time staff traditionally has policies in place to restrict or regulate hours worked above the base. These restrictions set limits on the amount of consecutive hours an employee may work or how many hours in a week are appropriate and also how much recovery time is required between shifts. By doing so, the employer is able to ensure the safety of their staff and custom- ers by limiting the risk of fatigued personnel. This is not possible in the current practices Countywide.

Third, if “paid” personnel are not full-time, it restricts their earning potential unless they are willing to work significant hours due to the loss of overtime opportunities. It also may mean that personnel are on their own when it comes to basic benefits like health coverage. This either adds additional expense to the employee or they simply go unco- vered. Finally, it may result in no access to retirement plans or employer sponsored 401(k) plans.

In addition to all volunteer and combination paid/volunteer Corps, there are organizations (e.g., Greenburgh, Harrison, Port Chester, etc.) that are traditional employers that have full-time paid employees as well as part-time personnel. The personnel have the job securi- ties, benefits, and earning reliability of a traditional workplace. Some of the employees of these organizations are also volunteers or may be paid staff working part-time as the paid personal at a Corps, which can pose some of the same concerns described above.

Westchester County, New York Page 40 © Fitch & Associates, LLC Emergency Medical Services System Evaluation December 8, 2008

Anyone who works in a flycar paramedic system knows that EMD in this county does nothing to appropriately manage resources. I work in three agencies that all receive direct dispatching and EMD from 60 control. The first issue is that 60 control is inadequately staffed to provide consistent EMD - anyone that gets the ipage notification on their phone knows this ( the "no EMD due to call volume / staffing" note at the end of the text), the second issue is that many of the primary PSAPs (local PDs) don't properly transfer the 911 caller to a 60 dispatcher. If that weren't bad enough, a medic gets sent on every job because the paramedic is the only resource in this county that is GUARANTEED TO SHOW UP.

I know i'm not the only one who has been stuck on scene for an hour waiting for a bus or has had to RMA patients that require ALS care because they know they can get to the hospital faster than waiting for the ambulance. All any media outlet would have to do is FOIL 60 control response time records (i'm assuming they keep some sort of log) and boy would they have a field day.

I guess the point i'm trying to make is that the problems are numerous and have metastasized across the county. I look at Putnam & Dutchess (both counties i have previously worked in) and wonder how in the hell did they get everyone on board with centralized dispatching, at least for fire and EMS.

Edited July 18, 2013 by Goose

[Westchester 49]

Problem not solved, and more problems created. Again, this is lifted directly from the Fitch study that the county government commissioned in 2008.

Anyone who works in a flycar paramedic system knows that EMD in this county does nothing to appropriately manage resources. I work in three agencies that all receive direct dispatching and EMD from 60 control. The first issue is that 60 control is inadequately staffed to provide consistent EMD - anyone that gets the ipage notification on their phone knows this ( the "no EMD due to call volume / staffing" note at the end of the text), the second issue is that many of the primary PSAPs (local PDs) don't properly transfer the 911 caller to a 60 dispatcher. If that weren't bad enough, a medic gets sent on every job because the paramedic is the only resource in this county that is GUARANTEED TO SHOW UP.

I know i'm not the only one who has been stuck on scene for an hour waiting for a bus or has had to RMA patients that require ALS care because they know they can get to the hospital faster than waiting for the ambulance. All any media outlet would have to do is FOIL 60 control response time records (i'm assuming they keep some sort of log) and boy would they have a field day.

I guess the point i'm trying to make is that the problems are numerous and have metastasized across the county. I look at Putnam & Dutchess (both counties i have previously worked in) and wonder how in the hell did they get everyone on board with centralized dispatching, at least for fire and EMS.

Goose you made a excellent professional observation. Thank You.

[Westchester 49]

As Goose metioned in his posting the information you wrote about is correct.But even though what you said is true we still have no answer for this situation that is destroying EMS or Fire Service. Who cares about health insurance if we can't get patients to the hospital and are organizations like IVAC making a patients chief complaint worse or not getting the imediate attention by a delay in transport. I have worked in the medical and EMS/FD for many years, but I have never seen a situation developing in Irvington in my life. Maybe I should open my tired eyes more and see the whole picture surrounding me and my family. Bottom line is, we went past the bottom line, and we have no way of fixing it.

[99subi 121]

What if the county was to take over all ambulance services in the county(obviously not commercial) and strategically place stations and ambulances throughout? Have a county wide EMD Could it work? Would anyone want it to work? Could the county handle such a task?

Edited July 18, 2013 by 99subi

[10512 214]

The problem is that the system is broken, and everyone is trying to fix individual pieces.

Edited July 18, 2013 by 10512

[Bnechis 3,961]

1) But if local volunteer agencies make there problems known to Village Goverment, Town or County Goverment maybe we can have a solution for this ongoing problem.

2) but when a structure fire in confirmed all Rigs roll and everybody shows up.

3) I personally have been trying to figure a solution to this area problem, and I have found only one solution. To merge Villages or Towns and have central stations in certain areas to provide EMS care.

4) REMSCO and the Department of Emergency Services all work within the County guidelines, If they see Ambulances or Fire Trucks not getting out the door and other agiences filling in for them, a chain affect will happen and a patient or home will be left without coverage. The County has to address this situation, if enough VAC's of FD's stand together and say we have a problem

1) You must 1st admit to oneself that you have a problem. Not a lot of agencies doing that.

2) I do not see a lot of depts that can roll all rigs. I see a lot that like EMS are sitting waiting for any available driver.

3) Bingo

4) The county does not have the legal authority to do it. And many of the VAC;s, FD's (and most of the politicians and administrators) either do not see that there is a problem or are just hoping it will go away on its own.

[wedgeclose 59]

Thankfully, I live in Ossining and for the most part we are well protected in both EMS and FD. Yes, most of the EMS calls are covered by paid EMT"S and Medics but there are still some volunteers riding the night shifts to keep costs down. With two crews on most of the time we can cover our calls and with the additional resource of the Tri-Town flycar we are in good shape in Ossining, Croton and Briarcliff Manor with regard to EMS. This has been a festering problem for many years in Westchester. Call volumes have increased at an unbelievable rate. It was not uncommon just 10 years ago for an entire 12 hour shift that no calls came in to OVAC..now its more likely to have 12 calls in 12 hours with many double headers. Funding has been tough some tax districts have been created but I think that instead of creating a seperate tax for EMS it should be included in either school or property tax lines to perhaps lighten the load. A point made about many EMS professionals doing dual duty to make ends meet is valid. These lifesavers need to be paid a living wage. In many cases they are not. The County gets involved in amusement parks, useless beaches on the Hudson river and other areas that are FAR LESS IMPORTANT than EMS.

[PCFD ENG58 1,085]

1960'S Port Chester VAC going good for years covering PC, Town of Rye, [ now Rye Brook ] then City of Rye.Then paid staff day times when it started to get tuff to cover shiffs then again the Volunteers fell off they went fully paid. No problem. Join as many vacs in your area to make it work ! Wake up over there. NEXT !

Edited July 18, 2013 by PCFD ENG58

[Jybehofd 85]

REMSCO and the Department of Emergency Services all work within the County guidelines, If they see Ambulances or Fire Trucks not getting out the door and other agiences filling in for them, a chain affect will happen and a patient or home will be left without coverage. The County has to address this situation, if enough VAC's of FD's stand together and say we have a problem

yes but they don't it all goes back to the home rule state bull.. how does the county have the right to tell a town to run the town....

it would be nice to see a county ems like county police or god forbid county fire.. The fitch report kinda leans a little more that way... too many ambulances and too few paramedics. multiple resources a couple of miles away but all having the same problem no staff. what if we pulled all the staff together?

[61MACKBR1 222]

yes but they don't it all goes back to the home rule state bull.. how does the county have the right to tell a town to run the town....

it would be nice to see a county ems like county police or god forbid county fire.. The fitch report kinda leans a little more that way... too many ambulances and too few paramedics. multiple resources a couple of miles away but all having the same problem no staff. what if we pulled all the staff together?

I second this comment

[Westchester 49]

All forget that the villages I'm talking about are in the the Town od Greenburgh. As we all know village resident pay for ALS service why can"t they pay for a EMS service. Jared from Greenburgh Police has done a great job running his side of ALS/BLS Fly Cars. Why can't Greenburgh run the whole show. Then the Greenburgh Paramedics won't have to do side work for Ossining,Portchester, etc. If Greenburgh sets up area stations in vacant lots or purchase EMS buildings ( like IVAC which owns the building ) they could hire more EMTs/Paramedics. I have researched and done the numbers it could work. My main concern is with the village my family lives in and then the other villages surrounding us.The IVAC board members must go and a cleaning of the house must happen. Afyer talking with some members in IVAC there main problem is within the 4 walls. There seems to be a power struggle there which in turn effects the residents of Irvington

[Bnechis 3,961]

1) Why can't Greenburgh run the whole show.

2) Then the Greenburgh Paramedics won't have to do side work for Ossining,Portchester, etc. If Greenburgh sets up area stations in vacant lots or purchase EMS buildings ( like IVAC which owns the building ) they could hire more EMTs/Paramedics. I have researched and done the numbers it could work.

3) There seems to be a power struggle there which in turn effects the residents of Irvington

1) They can, but only if the VAC's agree to it

2) They will still have to do side work, because they are already doing 40 hours. If they work more than that they get overtime and that may bust the bank. Yes they will have to hire more.

3) Thats the single biggest reason we have not had consolidation in any emergency services.

[Westchester 49]

1) They can, but only if the VAC's agree to it

2) They will still have to do side work, because they are already doing 40 hours. If they work more than that they get overtime and that may bust the bank. Yes they will have to hire more.

3) Thats the single biggest reason we have not had consolidation in any emergency services.

Excellent points. But it can be done.The only way things change is when someone important dies due to poor response time then something gets done.

[Goose 188]

Excellent points. But it can be done.The only way things change is when someone important dies due to poor response time then something gets done.

Personally, i would argue thats probably already happened. It will probably only get spoken of after there is some large scale incident that occurs on a weekday during normal business hours, you know...the one we don't have six month notice for and is not on a weekend. It's all laughable really.