YFD Union Creates New Website (Yonkers CFR-D Program)

[helicopper 1,050]

If I may direct a question to Chief Flynn:

I am curious as why YFD managment has, in my perception anyhow, been so silent on this issue? It seems the Union is carrying the torch, but the folks who run the YFD have not been visible in the media on this issue. I have not seen a statement or release from the YFD on this issue. I do NOT go to Council or budget hearings etc. I have been around long enough to know that the media can only fit so much in a small windown of information, so what I see is for sure NOT the whole picture. But it would seem to me that if Pt care is being threatened, the City Of Yonkers' Fire Department would be there defending it. It is great that the labor organization representing ther YFD members is visible. But again, my own opinion, the public has a so-so view of organized labor unions. I myself OPPOSED Empress becoming Union for that reason. I was an EMS purist and felt opposed to what I felt was the "taint" of a Union. Of course here I am now the Chief Shop steward. Go Figure!

Would not the First Responder program be better defended by the actual Yonkers Fire Department, rather than the Union, who the public MAY perceive as being more interested in self preservation rather than service preservation? I know there is a new Chief there, and he is known for the success of his soft approach, so maybe the silence is deliberate?

The FD Commissioner is appointed by the mayor and can't be an outspoken critic, at least not for very long.

The FD administration may be working behind the scenes at City Hall to remedy this with the Mayor's Office but they won't publicize much of that.

The union on the other hand has no such restrictions and is able to lobby the media and the court of public opinion to help move the issue.

This is not unique to Yonkers; this happens in many agencies with politically appointed agency heads and unions.

[sympathomedic 383]

I hear ya Chris. While I cannot recall a specific incident, I swear I have heard PD chiefs say that cutting back officers will lead to crime increases, longer response times, etc.

It is kind of a sad commentary on our society that when a labor Union speaks against cuts, folks don't believe them and think they are only looking to save themselves. When managment says the cuts won't effect service, folks don't believe them either. Reputations suffer on both sides because they both under estimate the public's ability to see the real deal.

[rayrider 94]

What really is mind boggling about some of these posts is how people can perceive the yfd of going after empress when in fact it is empress who is trying to take all control over the 1st responder program which would result in the possibility of the yfd losing several fire companies. Can someone explain to me what empress would lose (not gain) if the system would remain the same? Thanks!

[americanpolice 24]

What really is mind boggling about some of these posts is how people can perceive the yfd of going after empress when in fact it is empress who is trying to take all control over the 1st responder program which would result in the possibility of the yfd losing several fire companies. Can someone explain to me what empress would lose (not gain) if the system would remain the same? Thanks!

if YFD is going to lose several fire companies bc Empress expands the 1st responder program, then I think there is a bigger problem. I'm pretty sure the fire companies exist for fire reasons and not medical reasons.

[JFLYNN 681]

If I may direct a question to Chief Flynn:

I am curious as why YFD managment has, in my perception anyhow, been so silent on this issue? It seems the Union is carrying the torch, but the folks who run the YFD have not been visible in the media on this issue. I have not seen a statement or release from the YFD on this issue. I do NOT go to Council or budget hearings etc. I have been around long enough to know that the media can only fit so much in a small windown of information, so what I see is for sure NOT the whole picture. But it would seem to me that if Pt care is being threatened, the City Of Yonkers' Fire Department would be there defending it. It is great that the labor organization representing ther YFD members is visible. But again, my own opinion, the public has a so-so view of organized labor unions. I myself OPPOSED Empress becoming Union for that reason. I was an EMS purist and felt opposed to what I felt was the "taint" of a Union. Of course here I am now the Chief Shop steward. Go Figure!

Would not the First Responder program be better defended by the actual Yonkers Fire Department, rather than the Union, who the public MAY perceive as being more interested in self preservation rather than service preservation? I know there is a new Chief there, and he is known for the success of his soft approach, so maybe the silence is deliberate?

Helicopper pretty much summed this up. Many people don't realize that 1st Amendment rights (freedom of speech) don't apply to speech, on or off duty, made pursuant to official duties- that is, it owes its existence to the member's or employee's professional duties and responsibilities. Therefore department members may be disciplined for speaking out against department policies in certain situations. Certainly, a Fire Commissioner, who serves at the pleasure of the Mayor and has no contract or union protection, cannot reasonably be expected to openly disagree with the city administration.

There may be very many statements which have been made in the press that many members of senior management disagree with very strongly, but to openly criticize the policies of the department would possibly subject that individual to discipline. Union Officials, however, have very broad latitude in what they are able to say, which is why serious criticisms of policies, etc. generally come from union leaders, and not the rank and file, or senior leadership. Silence should not be taken as approval however.

I would like to emphasize that in this post and in any post I make on EMTBravo, or elsewhere, I am expressing myself as a private citizen, in a non-official capacity. The content of my posts is not being disclosed in my official capacity and such content represents solely my opinions and does not necessarily represent the official position of the City of Yonkers or the Yonkers Fire Department.

[JFLYNN 681]

if YFD is going to lose several fire companies bc Empress expands the 1st responder program, then I think there is a bigger problem. I'm pretty sure the fire companies exist for fire reasons and not medical reasons.

All of the 18 Fire Companies with the current manning are necessary for fire and emergency protection, regardless of the existence of a First Responder Program. There is no certainly as far as I can tell that "several" companies would be eliminated if the First Responder Program were eliminated. In my educated opinion YFD manning levels are not excessive in relation to similar sized Northeast Departments.

It should be noted that many who post on here, including occasionally YFD members, engage in speculation and do not necessarily have an adequate understanding of the "big picture".

I would like to emphasize that in this post as well as in any post I make on EMTBravo, or elsewhere, I am expressing myself as a private citizen, in a non-official capacity. The content of my posts is not being disclosed in my official capacity and such content represents solely my opinions and does not necessarily represent the official position of the city of Yonkers or the Yonkers Fire Department.

And yes, I realize it would be safer to express myself anonymously, but that is not my style and never will be.

[Oswegowind 17]

Although I appreciate the fact that I am thought of now and again, I have to pass on commenting about this. I still show up to work and do my job as well as I ever did and don't plan to change that, I have stayed away from EMTBravo for a long time and don't feel like entertaining a political debate. I ask that those involved fight their own battle and remember that the dispatchers are people with families, lives, and homes too.

Respectfully,

Kris Mason

Public Safety Dispatcher, Yonkers NY

[Bull McCaffrey 162]

Although I appreciate the fact that I am thought of now and again, I have to pass on commenting about this. I still show up to work and do my job as well as I ever did and don't plan to change that, I have stayed away from EMTBravo for a long time and don't feel like entertaining a political debate. I ask that those involved fight their own battle and remember that the dispatchers are people with families, lives, and homes too.

Respectfully,

Kris Mason

Public Safety Dispatcher, Yonkers NY

Hopefully you guys get to keep your jobs. I hear YFD is making a push to get rid of all of the civilian dispatchers and replace them with light duty FFs. Good luck and sorry that you guys are caught in the middle of all of this.

[x129K 1,393]

Hopefully you guys get to keep your jobs. I hear YFD is making a push to get rid of all of the civilian dispatchers and replace them with light duty FFs. Good luck and sorry that you guys are caught in the middle of all of this.

I hope that is not true.

[JFLYNN 681]

Hopefully you guys get to keep your jobs. I hear YFD is making a push to get rid of all of the civilian dispatchers and replace them with light duty FFs.

I rarely comment on this guys posts because they are usually so incredibly off base, incorrect, disrespectful, and inflamatory when it comes to YFD. However, I can assure all that this has never been discussed at any time during the last 7 years that I have been a member of senior management and to be absolutely clear, it is not being discussed now, and I do not anticipate it will be discussed or considered at any time in the foreseeable future.

[LineCapt 134]

In any event, just a reminder to all in this great city who respond to any type of emergency- we all have much more in common than we hold as differences- there are no enemies amongst us. Patient care must come first and foremost. So, please everyone on all sides of this contentious and emotional issue- although we may have strong disagreements in certain areas, let's agree to treat one another with respect at all times (especially in the field), and to be honest in our dealings with each other. All of us have a tough and at times, dangerous job that is worthwile and deserving of respect. Let's not demean ourselves or our professions by engaging in pettiness and mean spirited behavior. We are all much better than that.

Well said.

Over the years the idea of YFD taking over ambulance service had been floated by various political leaders, and neither 628 nor UFOA had ever pursued this work.

If YFD could do a better job at EMS, then why wasn't it ever pursued?

"going after" local 628 and UFOA work

They are not saying they are going after fires. Nor are the telling you how to fight fires. And these guys have much more to lose. An average YFD firefighter makes over $100,000 a year with great pay, benefits, and a pension after 20 years. Empress Paramedics make an average of $40,000 a year, and most have to work a second job and overtime to make ends meet. They have a lot more to lose if they contend with Local 628.

Chief, please know that I "Qtip", and I enjoy reading the insight you bring. Just because I'm discussing it with you, it doesn't mean anything more, like some other responses.

[JFLYNN 681]

If YFD could do a better job at EMS, then why wasn't it ever pursued?

EMS encompasses BLS First Responder, BLS Transport, and ALS response as well as transport - terminology expressed in my non-expert opinion / language. YFD was never going after ALS or transport, or in fact, "going after" anything. Just trying to keep the work it has had for over 22 years.

They are not saying they are going after fires. Nor are the telling you how to fight fires. And these guys have much more to lose. An average YFD firefighter makes over $100,000 a year with great pay, benefits, and a pension after 20 years. Empress Paramedics make an average of $40,000 a year, and most have to work a second job and overtime to make ends meet. They have a lot more to lose if they contend with Local 628.

But nobody from YFD is trying to take a job from anyone at Empress....

[JFLYNN 681]

But nobody from YFD is trying to take a job from anyone at Empress....

An emergency medical SYSTEM encompasses BLS First Responder, and both BLS and ALS transport, as well as ALS Medics in fly cars as support. YFD has never and is not now going after the ALS or transport portions of this SYSTEM. All we want is to keep the work we have had for 22 plus years, which has saved many lives, and cannot be replaced by what I have seen proposes.

These are solely my own opinions and are being shared in a non-official capacity. These comments do not necessarily reflect the official position of the Yonkers Fire Department but are factually true as I understand them.

[LineCapt 134]

All we want is to keep the work we have had for 22 plus years, which has saved many lives, and cannot be replaced by what I have seen proposed.

So why won't the city let you? I can't understand how this relates to staffing, why would minimum staffing be dependent on the first responder program?

[FF402 133]

If YFD is so concerned about EMS in a timely manner, then why since this whole plan was announced, are the YFD dispatchers "forgetting" to call Empress despite complaints from Empress about it?

[JFLYNN 681]

If YFD is so concerned about EMS in a timely manner, then why since this whole plan was announced, are the YFD dispatchers "forgetting" to call Empress despite complaints from Empress about it?

If this in fact is happening please report it through the proper channels. The Public Safety Dispatchers are a dedicated group. They are civilians and they are supervised by the Yonkers Police Department. The YFD administration is unaware of this and frankly, I doubt it is happening, but if you have knowledge of such occurences please report it rather than make allegations on here.

[JFLYNN 681]

So why won't the city let you? I can't understand how this relates to staffing, why would minimum staffing be dependent on the first responder program?

There are contractual issues at play between the unions and the administration. I am unable to elaborate further on a public forum. However, if you PM me I will provide my telephone number and will be happy to explain it to you as I understand it.

[MoFire390 118]

Ok gonna open up. Have been keeping an eye on this topic. For the record by the time a unit gets to the scene its usually about 5min. Unless tied up attempting to clear from a previous call. So keep the negative response times to yourselfs.
Good night!

Edited January 8, 2013 by MoFire390

[gss131 212]

" Unless tied up attempting to clear from a previous call. "

Pretty much sums up why to leave as is .

Edited January 8, 2013 by gss131

[JFLYNN 681]

Ok gonna open up. Have been keeping an eye on this topic and must say I'm getting quiet upset over the negative comments being said about a company I work for. In no way have I ever been more upset with YFD then I was yesterday. All they did was stand there and watch as we tried to make a life saving decession. The only thing the officer on this unit could say is "make up your minds. We are outta here." And took him and his manpower and left. At times I enjoy having the fd there to help. If you don't want to help then stay in quarters. Oh and for the record by the time a unit gets to the scene its usually about 5min. Unless tied up attempting to clear from a previous call. So keep the negative response times to yourselfs.

Good night!

A YFD member walked into my office this morning and expressed concern about this post. Allegations such as this need to be investigated and dealt with appropriately. As the first step of my investigation I sent a private message to this poster providing my cell number and asking for elaboration on any problems which were experienced. This poster, who identified himself as Ken stated..."Good morning Chief, One bad encounter is nothing new to me. You guys are awesome! They do an awesome job."......As for the negative comments. I miss (sic) typed. I ment (sic) to have time comments in there. However, as we all know working 28 hours in yonkers can take a toll on your mind. Stay safe, Ken"

I messaged Ken back and asked him to post a clarification but so far he has apparently been away from his computer. I imagine that he will post a clarification soon but I wanted to get this info up asap. The best way to counter the negative effects of rumors / the grapevine is a timely flow of accurate and relevant information.

I left the middle part of Ken's message out because it was just friendly banter. I'm sure that he wouldn't mind me posting parts of his private message based on the content. Thank you Ken, for owning up to your mistake and I hope you can get that clarification posted asap.

Edited January 8, 2013 by JFLYNN

[MoFire390 118]

I have edited my post due to my unprofessional comment. We all have a job to do and tying up a unit that could be fighting a fire and saving someone else is better served as such. If in anyway my comment caused a ruckis I did not intend on it. We all could learn from mistakes, and each other.

stay safe all.

Ken

[ffdude13 5]

In this post anonymity has been used for a reason, as it is in the past, and not to detract from the point of this post.

I noticed on the yonkers tribune this morning, which for those of you who do not know, follows the coy and yfd matter very closely, and noticed that a negative post here on emtbravo regarding yfd was splashed across more than one article on the yonkers tribune in the comment section, with a preface explaining, look at what this person thought of a medical call with yfd. I personally do not see any evidence it was the original poster here on emtbravo himself who posted to that website, however, I would say 90% of members on emtbravo if not more, have or are currently involved in either police, fire, or ems and since you have to be a member to view posts, it is unfortunately probable, that the other person here on emtbravo who has been copying this post is mos. Regardless, this type of behavior and attempt to undermine the yfd is weak, extremely dissapointing, and leaves me shaking my head vigorously.

I do not and have not ever worked for yfd or empress, however as a resident of yonkers I do follow this matter. In a neutral view and my own opinion, it is clear that all backs have been turned against yfd despite attempts to convince me otherwise. I have yet to understand any reason at all why this is the case and why no one will reach out to them, all the while they move forward with dismantling in less than 12 months the cfr program; a cornerstone of public safety in yonkers that has been in place for over 20 years. I can never turn my back with so much left unanswered.

[sympathomedic 383]

I came across this article today. It seems to have some similarities to the Yonkers situation, but is not identical. For those on the thread that suggested a YFD EMS system- here is the story of Philadelphia FD, who does run the EMS system, and how things do not seem to be workking too well.

http://www.emsworld.com/news/10849885/philly-short-on-medics-overloaded-with-firefighters

[jd783 64]

Interesting article in this months Firehouse Mag (hope my link works)

http://www.firehouse.com/article/10835688/ems-what-if-the-fire-service-gets-out-of-ems?