Gas Meters

[38ff 250]

What are peoples recomendations for 4 gas meters?

[SageVigiles 1,194]

Personally, I would recommend just about anything from RAE Systems. Our HAZMAT team uses a bunch of their meters and we're very happy with them.

http://www.raesystems.com/industry/fire-and-hazmat

They actually have a 4 gas meter with a Photo-Ionization Detector (PID) built in, which is pretty handy if your guys know how to use them. Knowing Marlboro the way I do, I'd imagine you probably don't do that much major HAZMAT stuff, but the RAE Systems meters can be networked to a central computer if you have a major incident so you can oversee what multiple units in the field are sampling in real time. With a few mouse clicks any mutual aid companies or HAZMAT teams that use the RAE technology can be added to your computer. Maybe that's useful to you, maybe not, but its something to at least look at.

I'd suggest you reach out to the sales reps and have them come in to talk to you and show you what they have. Everybody can make a 4 gas meter but some of the manufacturers can offer some pretty interesting features.

Also I'd recommend talking to your local HAZMAT team and see what they're using. Chances are they've probably done a lot of research and played with things that do/don't work. Most HAZMAT teams usually have 1 or 2 big meter geeks that can talk your ear off with the pros/cons of each manufacturer.

The absolute best advice I can provide is to make sure you find a good service company for your metering package. Meters are going to break and are going to need service above what your guys can do in station. Making sure you get good customer service on the maintenance side is going to alleviate >90% of your problems, so take care of that on the front side and you'll probably end up okay. A meter does you no good if its out for service for weeks at a time and you can't get ahold of the guy whose supposed to be fixing it.

Good luck.

Edited August 15, 2012 by SageVigiles

[38ff 250]

No we dont do major HAZMAT. Just the typical CO, Ammonia, Sewer Gas, Propane and O2 level type stuff. Anything else, and County HAZMAT will be the first call we make. I will check out the RAE stuff. Thanks!

[Bnechis 3,961]

Personally, I would recommend just about anything from RAE Systems. Our HAZMAT team uses a bunch of their meters and we're very happy with them.

They actually have a 4 gas meter with a Photo-Ionization Detector (PID) built in, which is pretty handy if your guys know how to use them. Knowing Marlboro the way I do, I'd imagine you probably don't do that much major HAZMAT stuff, but the RAE Systems meters can be networked to a central computer if you have a major incident so you can oversee what multiple units in the field are sampling in real time. With a few mouse clicks any mutual aid companies or HAZMAT teams that use the RAE technology can be added to your computer. Maybe that's useful to you, maybe not, but its something to at least look at.

Sage your advise would be very good if this was for a Hazmat Team, but for most FD's this is way to much. We have AreaRAE's and MultiRAE's with PID and transmitting capability and many of our members shy away from them and below HM Tech few understand PID's. We also have Scott Scouts (they are great, but were just discontinued), have had Orions, and other MSA, AIM, IS and a few other detectors.

I'd suggest you reach out to the sales reps and have them come in to talk to you and show you what they have. Everybody can make a 4 gas meter but some of the manufacturers can offer some pretty interesting features.

The features that we have set in our meters that are used by non Hazmat Techs are 4 gas (O2, CO, H2S & LEL), PEAK Findings (nice when the member returns from investigating and says the alarm when off and he got out and forgot what the reading was) and LEL sniffer

(great when looking for which gas meter is leaking in a meter room of a commercial or MD and when there is an odor in the hall of a MD to find which apt.). Nice to have a built in pump also nice to be able to easy to turn it off.

Thats it. All the other bells and whistles are for techs.

Also I'd recommend talking to your local HAZMAT team and see what they're using. Chances are they've probably done a lot of research and played with things that do/don't work. Most HAZMAT teams usually have 1 or 2 big meter geeks that can talk your ear off with the pros/cons of each manufacturer.

You can get lots of good info from those meter geeks, but most of them do not understand that most FF's do not get it and they will steer you to the sports car when you need a scooter.

The absolute best advice I can provide is to make sure you find a good service company for your metering package. Meters are going to break and are going to need service above what your guys can do in station. Making sure you get good customer service on the maintenance side is going to alleviate >90% of your problems, so take care of that on the front side and you'll probably end up okay. A meter does you no good if its out for service for weeks at a time and you can't get ahold of the guy whose supposed to be fixing it.

Very much agree. Critical Issues:

1) You need to be able to calibrate the detector inhouse. I find some detectors are much harder than others to do this. This needs to be done every 30-90 days (or less). I know depts. that send it out and its gone for a week. It takes 3 minutes to do it and it must be done or the meter is useless.

2) You should be able to change sensors inhouse. A good detector can be done in under 5 minutes. If you can do #1 & #2.... 95% of your servicing needs are covered.

3) Make sure the service company can provide you with loaners or make sure you have your own spare.

[38ff 250]

Good points, Captain...

[SageVigiles 1,194]

Haha, he's right, I end up thinking like a tech instead of a firefighter sometimes...

[38ff 250]

Does anyone have any experiece with the Scott 4 gas Protoge meter?

[wraftery 1,275]

Even Canaries have to be recharged daily or they don't work.

[Remember585 815]

Send in Youth Corp members... we put them in blue helmets for a reason...

[JM15 386]

Have you checked out the DHS Saver program information?

[grumpyff 1,159]

Send in Youth Corp members... we put them in blue helmets for a reason...

Hey I thought that was PD's job, blue canaries.

[NHFD21255 141]

We had a demo the other day with a Ventis and I really like how easy it was to use, 2 buttons control everything. At work I have 2 MSA Altair's and I am by no means impressed with them at all. Less than 1 year old and 1 has a bad O2 sensor already and there is always problems re-calibrating them. We were told the Scott detectors other than the Mini SA’s are not that good either but I haven’t seen those yet.

[38ff 250]

I am very unimpressed with our MSA multi gas Altair, and it now needs repairs that make it uneconomical to keep fixing. (it's less than 2 years old with several bad sensors and has been well cared for/calibrated/ect as per the manual)

I am looking at a Scott Protoge. All thoughts welcomed!

[16fire5 693]

I am going to stand up for the Altair. I think it works well for a 4 gas meter for operations level firefighters. I hear your complaints about O2 sensors but in my experience every meter that gets used will require O2 sensor replacement. I'm sure the new demo looks interesting but it two will probably need some work after 2 years.

[38ff 250]

I agree that no matter what you buy, it will require maintenance, which will require dollars to be spent. All brands have their ups and downs, and everyone has their own opinions about what is best. Im looking for other people's experiences with multi gas meters for the "basic" firefighter, not one for a HazMat team.