What Will Happen As The "Senior Guys" Start To Fade Away...

[x635 4,066]

What is to become of the life lessons passed down to us by the "Senior Guys"........the guys that didn't always have SCBA and other equipment that is now considered standard...going to real fires often......from the "Greatest" generation....the ones who won D-Day, put a man on the moon, invented the computers, etc.

We have a new generation of parents raising their children as "friends" and not children, and that is starting to show. Ask a youth nowdays to do something, they ask why? Ask a "Greatest Generation" guy at the same point in their lives and they will ask nothing and do. They would be afraid of their parents.

And, who will be the new "Senior Guys"?

[newsbuff 286]

What is to become of the life lessons passed down to us by the "Senior Guys"........the guys that didn't always have SCBA and other equipment that is now considered standard...going to real fires often......from the "Greatest" generation....the ones who won D-Day, put a man on the moon, invented the computers, etc.

We have a new generation of parents raising their children as "friends" and not children, and that is starting to show. Ask a youth nowdays to do something, they ask why? Ask a "Greatest Generation" guy at the same point in their lives and they will ask nothing and do. They would be afraid of their parents.

And, who will be the new "Senior Guys"?

The "Senior Guys" will be the ones that were brought up by their parents with a work ethic, and not to question the authority. These will be the guys that make it that long, and the most respected guys on the crew. Among all the garbage, they will stand out.

[CTFF 65]

"New" senior guys will fill the role, provided we don't have large gaps in hiring firefighters. Simply being a senior guy does not mean you'll pass down positive lessons . I've learned how I shouldn't behave from certain "senior" men, these lesson will serve me just as well a lessons from great senior guys as my career goes on.

While we don't see the same amount of fires as some of our current senior men saw over the course of their career, we can still learn from today's fire. We can learn everyday through Youtube and a ton of other firefighting websites. Granted this may not be hands on learning but it is still learning. The issue with a youtube lesson is it a what to do or what not to do lesson?

I also don't think there is anything wrong with today's youth. Why isn't a bad question in the correct context, my parents encouraged me to ask why, I hope that is because they wanted to but were afraid to.

Who's going to be the new senior men? I hope all of us can become "great" senior men when the times comes.

[BIGRED1 71]

The old senior men are gonna pass that knowledge on to the future senior men. The guys who are there to keep the couch warm will not seek these guys out and will just kinda be stagnant. I see nothing wrong with asking why. It is how we learn. Why do we do the 7-9-8 that way? Why should should you feel the door with the back of your hand instead of the finger tips? It is when you get the smart a** guys asking why should I clean the bathroom, the other guys don't. Why should I check the rig, it has not gone out in a week. These guys will be left on the side as the core firefighters press on and carry on the traditions and then teach the new guys when they become senior men.

[nfd2004 750]

I was born in 1949. So let's see, that makes me "32', or is it "62", I'm not quite sure. Terms like "Road Rage" or "Cyber Bullying" did not exist then. In school we got in trouble for chewing gum, not for carrying a gun. As a kid of the 50s I grew up in Bridgeport, Ct which was always a pretty tough place. But nobody locked their doors. Unlike today where many homes have security bars on the windows. Yes, alot has changed over the years. And maybe not for the best.

Growing up during that time was probadly the best time to be a part of the fire service. Radio scanners came out later in the 60s and you could listen to the fire and police calls just as they were happening. Then in the late 60s, and into the 70s and 80s, fires increased to their highest level in history. With portable scanners it became possible to now follow the action.

In 1975, I was able to get on a career dept in Connecticut as a firefighter. Every city was seeing a high activity of fires. There was a huge amount of changes to the fire service during the 70s and 80s also. The use of air packs, handie talkies, and power saws were making the job as a firefighter a lot easier. Many fire depts decided to look into also responding to medical calls. There was talk of females entering the fire service once reserved for males only. Automatic transmissions replaced the need to double clutch when driving a fire truck.

When the Senior Guys fade away, I have confidence that the newer younger firefighters will continue to carry the torch and run with it. They will continue to fight fires and save lives just as the firefighters of the 70s and 80s did. I base that on what I see today. The younger firefighters of today, at least the ones that I know, are a "credit to their generation". Many are parents themselves now and doing a very good job at raising their families. And I must admit, I think that's a much tougher job to do today. Today, I am on the outside looking in. And I see todays firefighters as one of the groups that hold this country together. I certainly respect them for what they do.

[ny10570 745]

Every new generation has had it too good, been too lazy, and will be the end of society as we know it. The greatest generation was great because they were faced with the greatest challenge ever to face a generation. If you have any doubts about todays kids (and I really do mean kids) being able to step up to the plate, just take a look at our military. At the start of the wars in Afghanistan and later Iraq our enlisted men and women entered the military at a time when recruitment standards were low and the military was, at least in my world a fall back. These kids, 18 to 24 years old stepped up and accomplished feats that were nothing short of amazing. Forget the success of the mission, the war, the occupation, whatever was the plan operationally. The day to day accomplishments these men and women achieved is nothing short of amazing. I have always been a firm believer that people perform to the level required of them. Put down a big enough gauntlet and people will rise to the challenge. We had our square rooters then and we will have them tomorrow, nothing will change that. But we also have our every day average people that will always do what must be done.

[nfd2004 750]

Every new generation has had it too good, been too lazy, and will be the end of society as we know it. The greatest generation was great because they were faced with the greatest challenge ever to face a generation. If you have any doubts about todays kids (and I really do mean kids) being able to step up to the plate, just take a look at our military. At the start of the wars in Afghanistan and later Iraq our enlisted men and women entered the military at a time when recruitment standards were low and the military was, at least in my world a fall back. These kids, 18 to 24 years old stepped up and accomplished feats that were nothing short of amazing. Forget the success of the mission, the war, the occupation, whatever was the plan operationally. The day to day accomplishments these men and women achieved is nothing short of amazing. I have always been a firm believer that people perform to the level required of them. Put down a big enough gauntlet and people will rise to the challenge. We had our square rooters then and we will have them tomorrow, nothing will change that. But we also have our every day average people that will always do what must be done.

Thanks there NY10570. That is a True Statement. And everyday there are young people out there such as Our Great Military, Police Officers, Nurses, 911 Dispatchers, and EMS workers saving lives across the Country. I recently had a visit to a local Emergency Room and Hospital stay. I could not get over the very young, both male and female nurses, dedicated to saving lives. They did a Great job. And this goes on everyday of the year behind those hospital walls. They have picked up the ball and ran with it. And now its their turn to score the points.

But I do have to say, what was referred to as the "Greatest Generation" truly was the Greatest. They grew up in the Great Depression, fought WWII, and came back to build America. I often refer to the FDNY members that fought the historically high number of fires in NYC, during their so called "War Yeas", as the "Greatest Generation of Firefighters". Many were Vietnam Vets that returned to fight the highest number of fires in FDNY history. I feel, that they certainly were a breed in itself.

Edited March 8, 2012 by nfd2004

[FFPCogs 863]

What will happen when the "senior guys" fade away? They'll be replaced by new "senior guys" just as they always have been. I think alot of concern comes from notion that the new guys of today aren't up to the challenge of becoming the senior ones tomorrow. Now I share that concern to an extent, in fact it was the topic of a rather lengthy discussion the other night around "the firehouse table". But I think every generation for at least the last 50 years has shared that concern and been proven wrong in having it. Society is different in many ways than from when I joined, just as it was for the senior guys of my early days and low and behold us "new guys" stepped up to fill the void...and so they will as we fade away. But that brings us to the heart of the matter..at least in by book. Maybe instead of asking what will happen when we fade away, we should be asking what example are we setting, or in other words what shoes are we leaving behind for our guys to fill?

In the end new guys will always become senior ones but it is the foundation we set that will determine what will happen once we've faded away.

Cogs

Edited March 8, 2012 by FFPCogs

[OLDGUY19 6]

Today in the world of the warm and fuzzy and everybody gets a trophy.The fire services is different.We are for most part type A personality.I think as a senior guy which I am,it is good to ask questions but with respect. To understand that your mother does not live in your firehouse.With 100 years for tradition we must learn from it not to make the same mistakes.Also have thick skin for at sometime you will screw up.

[gamewell45 258]

What will happen when the "senior guys" fade away? They'll be replaced by new "senior guys" just as they always have been. I think alot of concern comes from notion that the new guys of today aren't up to the challenge of becoming the senior ones tomorrow. Now I share that concern to an extent, in fact it was the topic of a rather lengthy discussion the other night around "the firehouse table". But I think every generation for at least the last 50 years has shared that concern and been proven wrong in having it. Society is different in many ways than from when I joined, just as it was for the senior guys of my early days and low and behold us "new guys" stepped up to fill the void...and so they will as we fade away. But that brings us to the heart of the matter..at least in by book. Maybe instead of asking what will happen when we fade away, we should be asking what example are we setting, or in other words what shoes are we leaving behind for our guys to fill?

In the end new guys will always become senior ones but it is the foundation we set that will determine what will happen once we've faded away.

Cogs

You are correct; its all cyclical.

[antiquefirelt 994]

While I agree the "senior guys" will be replaced by new ones, it appears that in most cases we will still see a decline in experience. Due to the decline in actual fires, the newer senior men will not have the operational experience that some of our old and crusty's did. As of now, the senior men on our three tours have less than 15 years each, and the last 15 years saw far less fire than the 15 before that!

[FFPCogs 863]

While I agree the "senior guys" will be replaced by new ones, it appears that in most cases we will still see a decline in experience. Due to the decline in actual fires, the newer senior men will not have the operational experience that some of our old and crusty's did. As of now, the senior men on our three tours have less than 15 years each, and the last 15 years saw far less fire than the 15 before that!

Yes this is very true indeed, but while true it is also a factor that in large part is out of our control. I think many will agree that our success in prevention programs, construction/housing regulations and public education overall have been a double edged sword of sorts. These successes have gone far in decreasing the number of fires and fatalities nationwide but they have also had the unavoidable effect of decreasing the potential for experience our FFs gain during their careers. Progress always creates unintended consequences and in this case while I'm of the opinion that our loss has been the public's gain overall it is also one we must address by our actions. With that I will return to that which I stated above. What the new "senior guys" will be once our time in the sun has passed is in large part dictated by what we give them now to pass along to their "new" guys in the future. We in the fire service are all products of our environment or culture and by and large learn by example. So while tools and tactics may change, the core values of what it means to be a fireman don't..or shouldn't. Service above self, honor, valor and a dedicated commitment to learning this trade will always be the strong foundation on which our service depends, but it can only be a strong one for the up and comers when it is lived by those who are the "senior guys" now. For me that means we have the obligation and responsibility to not only give voice to those core values but to in fact live them and set the example. The future may belong to the young, but it is the actions "old timers" of today that will chart the course that future takes.

Cogs.

Edited March 8, 2012 by FFPCogs

[Guest alsfirefighter]

What is to become of the life lessons passed down to us by the "Senior Guys"........the guys that didn't always have SCBA and other equipment that is now considered standard...going to real fires often......from the "Greatest" generation....the ones who won D-Day, put a man on the moon, invented the computers, etc.

We have a new generation of parents raising their children as "friends" and not children, and that is starting to show. Ask a youth nowdays to do something, they ask why? Ask a "Greatest Generation" guy at the same point in their lives and they will ask nothing and do. They would be afraid of their parents.

And, who will be the new "Senior Guys"?

I have a very simple saying to new students...(you heard this sitting in my classroom at the academy) and any new hires. The fire service was here before you...it will live long after you...what are you going to do for it while your here. Funny thing...but there are always senior guys...I for one...after looking at the seniority list after a while of not doing so...realized...I am a "senior" guy. As with everything else...time rolls on and so does life. If they ask why...I've learned its not a personal attack...I explain. Same thing with training curriculums..we teach the why with the do now. If they know why....they tend to do it with more oomph. If they think its stupid...tough..do it anyway.

[HFD209 4]

The Fire service has changed.... It use to be asses and elbows.. stay low and let it blow.... now its just flip flops and laptops...