PASS Alarms Obsolete?

[x635 4,066]

PASS alarms.

First, we didn't turn them on when we were supposed to. We didn't change the batteries, or the batteries ran out unoticed. Or we left them on when not needed.

So, they intergrated them into the airpacks.

Now, they go off so frequently, it's like car alarms....no one pays attention anymore in most cases. Heck, you can hardly hear on a fire scene because they go off so much.

What have departments done to combat this "compliance", and have any departments found technological or logistical solutions around a PASS alarm?

[Bnechis 3,961]

have any departments found technological or logistical solutions around a PASS alarm?

While it does not solve the problem of pass alarms going off to much or at the wrong time, Scotts SIMS II transmits the status (On, air left, pre-alert and alert) back to a laptop screen at the CP. Motorola is currently working with Scott to add this to the radio accountability system (I expect ours next week). The plan is for the next upgrade to merge the SIMS II info into the radio program. This will allow the CP to see the SIMS II info (above) plus who transmited what message, battery life, PAR accountabiltity, emergency evacuation and emergency call button.

[FireMedic049 597]

PASS alarms.

First, we didn't turn them on when we were supposed to. We didn't change the batteries, or the batteries ran out unoticed. Or we left them on when not needed.

So, they intergrated them into the airpacks.

Now, they go off so frequently, it's like car alarms....no one pays attention anymore in most cases. Heck, you can hardly hear on a fire scene because they go off so much.

What have departments done to combat this "compliance", and have any departments found technological or logistical solutions around a PASS alarm?

I think you are actually talking about two different issues - upkeep and usage.

I really don't think there exists any "technological or logistical solutions" out there to fully address either of these issues.

For the most part, the primary "usage" issue was solved with the integration of the PASS device into the SCBA, however that was not foolproof since we still work on the fireground before turning on the air at times. I'm sure there's a few ways to address the dead battery aspect (upkeep) as far as setting up reminders to check and replace the batteries, but it still requires somebody to actually do it which could prove to be the "weak link" for that part.

Now, the "tricky" problem is the false activations. Not sure if there's a way to prevent those sort of activations short of everybody being more attentive to shutting them off when you put the pack down or moving when the pre-alert sounds.

The fire scenes I'm at aren't too bad regarding false activations. Maybe it'll be like you stated once we fully transition to integrated PASS SCBAs?

[Remember585 815]

All too often you can hear PASS alarms going off at fire scenes. And way too often, people ignore them.

I know that I always make a point to locate a PASS alarm and ensure it's not a distress. This also applies to the guys on our FAST. We've been to plenty of Mutual Aid jobs where PASS alarms are sounding because air packs were dropped outside and not reset, or due to a pack malfunction. In one case, a new firefighter had an activated PASS while he was pulling ceiling and went about his work. We send three guys inside and told him, and he looked around slightly confused. His brothers tried to reset it, only to find it was malfunctioning. They took the pack outside, down the street and shoved it in a rig compartment to try and silence it.

Upkeep is an important issue. In our department, all SCBA issues are relayed to our SCBA Maintenance Officer who maintains all of our air packs. If he can't fix it, it's pulled out of service and sent in for repairs.

Everyone should be in the habit of shaking their asses when they hear the pre-alarm, whether it's their pack or not. This will cut down the number of unneeded PASS activations.

[bigrig77 95]

Everyone should be in the habit of shaking their asses when they hear the pre-alarm, whether it's their pack or not. This will cut down the number of unneeded PASS activations.

I totally agree. Should be like a automatic reaction. I find I do it even when I am looking at the guy who is going off.

[robert benz 344]

If Pass alarms are going off on the fireground by accident it is a training issue plain and simple.

[SmokeEatter40 8]

I agree with Robert. There is unlimited unlimted possibilitie out there for various PASS systems. The biggest problem I see is the I hate to say it but practical "ignorance" of some people. These systems are in place to get help to you. If you do not want help when you need it most, perhaps you should not be in a pack in a situation where you can get hurt. You are just putting more people at risk. The packs should be checked before/after every use. Don't get me wrong I do not mean do a full inspection prior to putting a pack on. But if it has been a few weeks/months since the last incident or drill here should be an inspection. And this should be weekly if not monthly.

On another note it was commented before that responders are geting mute to the sound of the accidental activations. Perhaps a differant sound or trigger? You walk to the mall and hear atleast one car alarm going off. Do you stop and see if a car is getting broken in to? Probably not. But if you are on a scene and a PASS is going off, how long before you start looking, activate a FAST Team, or await a MAYDAY.

[JM15 386]

If Pass alarms are going off on the fireground by accident it is a training issue plain and simple.

It does come down to training.. Officers and senior members need to give the "younger" guys some direction when PASS alarms are going off. We should be trained that if we hear a PASS alarm someone is in trouble....

[SmokeEatter40 8]

JM15, you are absolutely right. Every time I hear an alarm (generally when someone standing next to the CP) I give them a little slap and yell to make sure they are paying attention. Same goes for mentoring the newbies. We want to know if we go down someone will have enough sence to some to our help.

[rutola413 5]

As far as the OLD PASS alarms are concerned, myself and a few other members still use them. Only on Brush Fires. There are many times where we have to really hike into the woods just to get to the fire. For whatever reason, I feel a bit better having my PASS alarm clipped onto my belt.

[SageVigiles 1,194]

If Pass alarms are going off on the fireground by accident it is a training issue plain and simple.

YES, post of the month! It all starts from training, FFs should be learning in Fire 1 to keep moving your body when standing around to prevent your PASS from activating. And to COMPLETELY turn your pack OFF when you take it off your back to prevent it from going off when you walk away.

[Dudley 7]

Worcester FF John Davies was discovered missing on December 8 when an outside company officer heard a PASS alarm sounding after the building had collapsed and notified the IC. Therefore I argue PASS alarms are not yet obsolete.

Skip to the 6:37 mark.

[EMTDelta 22]

Its not that they are obsolete, the problem is that the general fire service has become complacent.

[floorabove 13]

Accidental PASS activation during training = 10 push-ups on the spot.

[Guest alsfirefighter]

Bobby hits the nail on the head with his post. I can tell you I have yet had the priviledge to work with another instructor who doesn't reinforce addressing PASS alarm issues in any class...not just Firefighter 1. It is a training and reinforcement issue and applies to even operating, just not training. It also helps and its something I do not generally allow in my courses is when someone else reaches up to reset someone else's PASS in alarm. That's not positive reinforcement for the offender. Bottom line is we all at times are concentrating on something else and it will still happen. There's nothing wrong when someone says "shake." It just needs to be reinforced that if you hear it..shake if you think its you or not. The other issue is removing it and laying it on the ground or storing it and not shutting it off. There are many different approaches to this that I've seen. I often make the person(s) who do this in courses have to carry all cylinders that need to be recharged to the cascade by hand. Negative reinforcement that is not negative in nature.

[dwcfireman 656]

Its not that they are obsolete, the problem is that the general fire service has become complacent.

We have a saying at the airport: "Complacency is Security's Worst Nightmare." The same goes on the fire ground, and I can't agree more with this picture. When we have drills at the airport I shout for everyone to "dance" when I hear a PASS starting to go off. Like everyone has been saying, "Training, training, training!"