FDNY's New Ferrara's-How are they holding up?

[TheNewLadder32 49]

I'd just like to know what people think about the new Aerials and Rescues New York just recieved ? I'd also like to know what you think about the problems they are having being engines, body, ladders etc. ? Do you think they should have picked some other manufacturers ?

[ny10570 745]

I'd just like to know what people think about the new Aerials and Rescues New York just received ? I'd also like to know what you think about the problems they are having being engines, body, ladders etc. ? Do you think they should have picked some other manufacturers ?

FDNY does not pick the manufacturer. They establish a list of build specifications and performance requirements that a manufacturer must meet. The cheapest bid that best meets the demands wins the bid. FDNY's ace in the hole against garbage builds is the uniquely long warranty period. The idea is that a substandard product will cost the manufacturer more to repair than to build the rig right the first time. This idea doesn't always work as demonstrated by the previous generation of TL's.

[M' Ave 1,466]

I'd just like to know what people think about the new Aerials and Rescues New York just recieved ? I'd also like to know what you think about the problems they are having being engines, body, ladders etc. ? Do you think they should have picked some other manufacturers ?

The name on the front doesn't so much matter. The materials chosen for the build, as well as the internal components (engine, trans., pumps, ect. ect), are all spec'd by the FDNY. Whomever builds the rig would use these same components.

As for the rest of your question; I don't think anyone here (unless there is a Shops foreman floating around here) is qualified to answer the question of what's been going wrong with the new rigs. No one really knows. All that we know is that only a handful of the new rear-mounts have been placed in service while the rest seem to have been held up. Those are the only facts available. The RUMOR is that there are a few electrical and fine tuning issues that they'd like to work out before they deliver the rest. Seems reasonable to me. Rescue 4 has had a new rig for months and it has been relatively problem free. The rest of the rescues have yet to have the new rig fully in service. Rescue 3's new rig was used by the company at the funeral for Lt. DiBernardo. Clearly it was thought to be functional enough to be driven to that service and back and I'm sure no one would want a silly apparatus issue at an incredibly sad and important day.

The bottom line is: These are new rigs. They're a fresh design from the ground up, being built by a manufactururer with only a little NYC experience. There will be some issues that need to be worked out, but I'm sure everything will turn out fine once the bugs are fixed up. Or maybe they won't.....take a look at the service record of Seagrave TL's delivered during the middle of the last decade....LEMONS!

[everybodygoes 331]

Capt ellson took the rig to the funeral cause that is the only thing that R2 R1 and R5's new rigs are good enough for. All 4 of the new Rescues have such severe handling issues that each one has scared the bejesus out of not only the LCC but the Captain of each company. As for the new rear mounts, 32 truck had theirs for less than 24 hours before a sensor failed to work and the turbo stopped providing boost, then the aerial wouldn't go up, nothing that could have probably been predicted. The biggest issues are found with having a new manufacturer and a new rig, our mechanics can't be that familiar with them so its a learning curve for them as well. The new emissions crap doesn't help either.

[38ff 250]

Can you elaborate on the severe handling issues?

[everybodygoes 331]

Driving down the road sideways, catastrophic failure of suspension components, almost doing a 360, ya know, things you wont want to experience in a million dollar 66,000lb machine.

[M' Ave 1,466]

Capt ellson took the rig to the funeral cause that is the only thing that R2 R1 and R5's new rigs are good enough for. All 4 of the new Rescues have such severe handling issues that each one has scared the bejesus out of not only the LCC but the Captain of each company. As for the new rear mounts, 32 truck had theirs for less than 24 hours before a sensor failed to work and the turbo stopped providing boost, then the aerial wouldn't go up, nothing that could have probably been predicted. The biggest issues are found with having a new manufacturer and a new rig, our mechanics can't be that familiar with them so its a learning curve for them as well. The new emissions crap doesn't help either.

Interesting about the handling. Is it a steering system issue or rear suspension issue? Hopefully that easily corrected. As I've heard, 32 has since been repaired and is functioning properly. Aerial has been used a job or two. That new emissions stuff is a major issue. It takes a lot of room from the officer's seating area and the short trips that we often make don't allow for proper functioning of the new filter systems. Why is it that we can't be an exception to the new emissions rule?

[FireMedic049 597]

Why is it that we can't be an exception to the new emissions rule?

Because that would probably make sense and the tree huggers might be offended.

[Bnechis 3,961]

Why is it that we can't be an exception to the new emissions rule?

Last Year I was at a seminar with all the engine manufacturers. They all made it clear that even if emergency services were exempt, they would not offer an engine without it. The reason is we are only 1% of the total engine sales. They are building for the over the road trucks and we are just an add on. It would be too expensive to custimize for us.

[38ff 250]

Is any of this failure on the Rescues documented online anywhere?

[JBE 328]

The one thing I had heard from guys operationg the new RMA, is that it is slow. Speed wise, and the hydraulics are slow.

[TheNewLadder32 49]

In one of the videos I saw R5 was sitting outside and they said they have had engine trouble when making sharp turns and the roof leaks. I Know that there new rigs and they'll have problems but cant you prevent a roof leak unless the A/C has some problems.

[everybodygoes 331]

Nothing documented other than all the rigs sitting at the rock and no one wanting to accept them.

[M' Ave 1,466]

I know 156 is at The Rock and 42, 29, 38, 8, 11, ect. ect. are sitting at Ferrara's facility in N.J.

[ny10570 745]

What engine was in the old ladders? These are being fitted with the Cummins ISM 400. If the officers are already squeezed it may have been the largest engine they could fit. The dept has been actively avoiding engines requiring DEF systems.

[everybodygoes 331]

How do you know they were avoiding them? All our old rigs had Detroits, very rarely do you have an engine issue, everything else usually goes bad.

[ny10570 745]

It was part of the discussion fire the next round of battalion trucks. If they couldn't get a non-DEF diesel, would they go gasoline? Last I heard there was an RFP being drafted for DEF dispensers in each battalion.

It was a similar issue with the current ambulance order. The problem is getting enough 2011 chassis to finish the order if Wheeled Coach or another vendor gets the remaining about 200 trucks.

[goon16 155]

Like said before the new rear mounts are very slow, the ariel ladder is so much slower than the cutrent rig My companys new rear mount is delayed in getting delivered. There are a bunch of positive and negatives with the rig

[TheNewLadder32 49]

Sucks because there very nice trucks and good design but these problems are just horrible for the price they paid and experience they've had with Ferrara you would expect better outcome. Having engine problems making to sharp of turns, leaking roofs, slow aerials, SLOW TRUCKS really thats outrageous dont u think ?!?!?!?!

[goon16 155]

nice looking trucks dont put out fires or get u there. Like i said before most of the ferrara's that havent been delivered have been brought back to ferraras facility to have something worked out on them, they have this guard on the steering shaft near the pedels that guys have been getting htere foot caught on them when going from the brake to the accelerator and back to the brake with just work duty shoes on. It would be very difficult to drive with bunker pants on. We werent too impressed with the new rig