What Does The Future Hold For The Westchester Fire Service?

[x635 4,066]

Beside hopes, dreams, and ideas, what does the future hold realastically for the Westchester Fire Service?

[Dinosaur 844]

Good question. If we don't start dealing with our issues they're going to get dealt with for us, by the very same people who are closing ladder companies in New Rochelle and laying off firefighters all over the place.

Now is the right time to start improving things for the entire fire service in Westchester. 150 years of tradition, 1 step forward today, 1 step forward tomorrow.

Edited November 20, 2011 by Dinosaur

[99subi 121]

Sadly, IMHO i don't see any changes happening. Atleast not in this decade.

[firepunk 3]

It's sad to say that change will not come. There are to many egos in the way. You have department heads and officials who do not and will not fight for the men or the job. That saying do more with less will rule for a long time. I feel for the firefighters who are losing their jobs.

The irony of it all is that gov cuomo created the tax cap to keep people in their homes but the back lash is that people now cannot stay in their jobs. So they lose their jobs then they lose their house. Now that people cannot pay the mortgage the taxes do not get paid on the property which equals more lost tax dollars for the city or town. Way to go cuomo

[efdcapt115 1,511]

The jobs are going to get squeezed. Stress levels, already high to begin with, are going to go up. There will be more frustration on the part of the regular foot soldiers out there doing the jobs, and finger pointing at the bosses, and boards of commission who apparently cannot keep up with the times, and the changes in operation that are required. This tax cap law is going to give many districts and departments an easy out to lay people off; instead of focusing their energies toward the efforts of consolidation that are required.

I must say in hindsight, the arguments and discussions that have been taking place on this board for a number of years appear to have been ahead of the times. We've kicked it all around, dissected where the jobs need to be looking, but the decision makers apparently haven't been reading enough of this material. Now they'll be scrambling to play catch-up in the few years ahead, but the damage is already occurring; witness the six layoffs at NRFD. I read a piece about Eastchester, they're letting go 3 of the 4 civilian employees of the PD, and a number of laborers from the highway department.

I really hate to even think this but, we're going to see more of this in the near future.

[firecapt32 282]

I see it a little differently--although your right about egos and things that might get in the way and I do agree with most of that.

I see many progresive firefighters coming through the ranks--firefighters with training--certified training. Not that there is any thing wrong with in house stuff. You have to think globely and not all the time localy.

There are many Departments that are taking aggresive steps to mandate training for their firefighters.From FIREFIGHTER ONE--SURVIVIAL--FAST-- OSHA--BBP -- HAZ MAT-- OFFICER TRAINING. you get the idea. The world is changing and we have to change with it or be left behind. That holds true for the fire service. The axium "lead--follow--or get out of the way" means as much today as it ever did.

How many times have we stated the We "are held to a higher standard" We have to keep that in the back of our minds as we move foward to protect the citizens of out community.

We have to blend the traditions of the past with a vision to the future. We also have to be honest with the community--we have to take a hard look at manpower/response times/training with one thing in mind--TO PROTECT THE CITIZENS OF OUR COMMUNITY IN THE BEST WAY POSSIBLE

The best fire apparatus--the best equipment-the best intentions are no subsitute for training-dediciation and committment to the Department--to the community--to the fire servive.

just my thoughts

[firepunk 3]

I agree with you firecapt. But one thing we were taught to protect ourselves first then the public we serve. We can only train as much as department heads will allow. It's hard to try a push forward when you maybe next on the chopping block. We all need to keep our heads up high.

[Bnechis 3,961]

I must say in hindsight, the arguments and discussions that have been taking place on this board for a number of years appear to have been ahead of the times.

That was not hindsight. It was studied and found that that trend has been out there for many years in other areas, including outside this country.

Too many people did not and still do not want to hear this, but its been heading this way for decades and its not going to go away anytime soon.

This does not just affect the career service, or just the fire service. Its all encompassing and we can either fight to move it in the right direction or allow the people who have been running our country down to consume this as well.

We've kicked it all around, dissected where the jobs need to be looking, but the decision makers apparently haven't been reading enough of this material. Now they'll be scrambling to play catch-up in the few years ahead, but the damage is already occurring;

It is not just the decision makers. The members were not interested, the unions were not interested, the politicians were not interested, the volunteers were not interested.

In most cases it was ignored, but some direct feedback that I recieved was we will never allow it and they will never cut us.

I really hate to even think this but, we're going to see more of this in the near future.

Yep, next year will be the same. since every year they will have to cut, until there is nothing left.

[efdcapt115 1,511]

Sad but totally true post Cap. However the hindsight I'm referring too is looking back from today at what has been occurring here on EMTBravo. I remember numerous times when this topic was discussed, and you personally had to eat a lot of crap aimed your way by the people you mentioned in your post. (Edit: I also remember supporting the posts of guys who were obviously angry with the subject, but I thought it was at least a start to get them involved in the discussion.)

I felt/feel morally obligated (and having worked my career in the dysfunctional system that is south Westchester firefighting) to support the Study, and the position you've advocated for a very long time.

The silence, the complacency, the utter frustration of trying to deal with a disinterested membership (Edit: not the EMTBravo membership, the career and volunteer firefighting membership) makes me ask Jack to insert the head-banging emoticon here_____.

Edited November 20, 2011 by efdcapt115

[x635 4,066]

Let me take this one step further. What would happen if DES is merged with DPS? Or the budget significantly reduced the amount of training classes offered? (or laid off instructors who teach the classes?) Or made massive cuts in the department, laying off already overworked staff?

Has the Commisioner's position been filled yet, and have they formed a hiring comittee (or appointed John Cullen) and in that case, for a Deputy Commisioner?

All I was able to read was an overview of the County Budget 2012. I wasn't able to get in depth. How will it affect DPS and DES?

And my final question, a theoratical doomsday scenario, what if the County were to shut down DES?

[Remember585 815]

Let me take this one step further. What would happen if DES is merged with DPS? Or the budget significantly reduced the amount of training classes offered? (or laid off instructors who teach the classes?) Or made massive cuts in the department, laying off already overworked staff?

Has the Commisioner's position been filled yet, and have they formed a hiring comittee (or appointed John Cullen) and in that case, for a Deputy Commisioner?

All I was able to read was an overview of the County Budget 2012. I wasn't able to get in depth. How will it affect DPS and DES?

And my final question, a theoratical doomsday scenario, what if the County were to shut down DES?

DES is eliminating 11 various positions. And if I read the new budget proposal right, there's room for one Commissioner and two Deputy Commissioners.

[61MACKBR1 222]

CONSOLIDATION OF ALL FIRE and EMS Services. Tax Payers have enough and get tough on the politicians who then tell the Volunteer Groups, Professional Leaders (Chielfs/Commissioners) and Union Leaders that their constituants have had enough and a unified County Run Fire and EMS Operation emerges. No More Village Fire Department, No More Town EMS, No More City of "Fill In The BlanK" Fire Department. Cutbacks forcing Insurance Ratings going down will no longer go fly.

[Bnechis 3,961]

CONSOLIDATION OF ALL FIRE and EMS Services. Tax Payers have enough and get tough on the politicians who then tell the Volunteer Groups, Professional Leaders (Chielfs/Commissioners) and Union Leaders that their constituants have had enough and a unified County Run Fire and EMS Operation emerges. No More Village Fire Department, No More Town EMS, No More City of "Fill In The BlanK" Fire Department. Cutbacks forcing Insurance Ratings going down will no longer go fly.

I am quite confident that there will not be a unified Westchester County Run Fire and EMS Operation during my career or even my lifetime.

Everyone knows I am convinced that consolidation is needed, but for the county to unify as one the following hurdles (in addition to the ones you listed above) need to be overcome:

1) The politicains at the state level will need to rewrite County Law, City Law, Town Law and Village Law. They have had no interest in even looking at this, even thought many groups have been asking for it.

2) The politicains at the County Level are unwilling to add services that will increase county tax, even if it will reduce the overall tax being paid in Westchester. While consolidation will save some money in the long run, the seed money needed is huge and its not there.

Note: Cutbacks force Insurance Rating to go up not down.

[helicopper 1,050]

Let me take this one step further. What would happen if DES is merged with DPS? Or the budget significantly reduced the amount of training classes offered? (or laid off instructors who teach the classes?) Or made massive cuts in the department, laying off already overworked staff?

Has the Commisioner's position been filled yet, and have they formed a hiring comittee (or appointed John Cullen) and in that case, for a Deputy Commisioner?

All I was able to read was an overview of the County Budget 2012. I wasn't able to get in depth. How will it affect DPS and DES?

And my final question, a theoratical doomsday scenario, what if the County were to shut down DES?

As of today, I believe that Acting Commissioner Cullen is still "acting" Commissioner and the DES/DPS merger is "off the table".

Both DES and DPS are suffering cuts in the 2012 budget and DES (along with a bunch of other departments) face layoffs. DPS was spared actual layoffs but will lose vacant lines and funding in other areas.

The exact implications of these cuts will not be known until next month when a final budget is approved by the Board of Legislators and the exact numbers and dollars/cents are revealed.

As for your doomsday scenario, I think it is highly unlikely that DES could be shut down in its current form.

DES is eliminating 11 various positions. And if I read the new budget proposal right, there's room for one Commissioner and two Deputy Commissioners.

The second DC line hasn't been funded in years despite it showing up on the organizational chart. I don't think they could fill that position even if they wanted too.

[x635 4,066]

DES is eliminating 11 various positions. And if I read the new budget proposal right, there's room for one Commissioner and two Deputy Commissioners.

What positions, and what affect will that have?

I'm thinking there will be an Administrative order to merge DPS and DES next year. We all know the cost and feasability studies underway will reccomend what Astorino want.

And DES was close to shutdown in 1997. The training field was basically condemed. There was only one classrom. Basically, Maryilyn and Gordon were the staff. There were hardly any instructors.

Is there a standard as to what training a County has to offer the Fire Departments?

And how is Westchester MAC funded?

[Remember585 815]

Seth,

The CE's proposal can be found at www.westchestergov.com - I tried linking it but my laptop is being stubborn.

If you go down the list of positions in DES, read across each position and compare the columns of current staff vs. 2012 staff. That will give you a good idea of those being let go.

Not fully related to merging - the county is eliminating A LOT of positions in every department - one member of our FD who has worked for the county 16 years is being let go. It sucks and I hope someone comes in on a white horse with a never-ending checkbook!