Firefighter Elevators. Should they be required ??

[Guest]

Sounds like a good idea to me =D> =D> but, who pays ??

April 20, 2005 

Panel May Recommend 

Firefighter Elevators

By ALEX FRANGOS 

Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL 

April 20, 2005; Page B6

Most countries require skyscrapers to have a set of special fire-resistant elevators so rescue workers can reach upper floors quickly during emergencies, and so disabled occupants can get out. The U.S. doesn't. 

Why the country that invented the skyscraper doesn't mimic the rest of the world in this respect will be heavily debated in the building community soon. The government agency investigating the World Trade Center collapse is preparing its final recommendations on changes to building safety in June, and requiring firefighter elevators might be on the list.

In a preliminary report this month, the agency, the National Institute of Standards and Technology, an arm of the U.S. Commerce Department, listed firefighter lifts as a possible recommendation on how to make tall buildings safer. 

Building codes in Europe and most of Asia require firefighter lifts, though specific requirements differ. In both places, firefighter elevators are located near fire stairs, in a part of the building where the air is pressurized to keep smoke out. The shafts are water resistant to prevent damage from sprinklers and fire hoses. The elevators' mechanical and electrical systems are rated to work in wet conditions. The doors have to be fire-rated. 

European codes require a small dedicated elevator for use only during emergencies. They're large enough to carry three firefighters with equipment. In most Asian countries, including China, the elevators tend to be larger and can also be used during normal operation for freight. 

At least one building in the U.S. will have something akin to a firefighter lift, though the building's architect, Skidmore Owings & Merrill, is not calling it that. The Freedom Tower, the skyscraper that is planned to rise next to where the Twin Towers fell, will use a system similar to the Asian model, where a set of service elevators would be placed in a pressurized fire-protected lobby near the fire stairs. 

The final NIST study, which also examines why the towers collapsed, is expected to focus on improving how firefighters get into buildings, and how occupants, especially disabled ones, get out. Of the 212 elevators in the Twin Towers, only two worked after the planes hijacked by terrorists hit the New York skyscrapers on Sept. 11, 2001. It took firefighters more than an hour to climb to around the 30th floor of the North Tower. 

Rescue workers on Sept. 11 found 40 to 60 disabled occupants grouped on the 12th floor of the North Tower. "These impaired individuals had been placed on this floor in an attempt to clear the stairways," according to the institute's presentation. It is unclear how many from that group perished.

[Guest WolfEMT]

That's a really good idea and should be implemented in all new construction. The only sticking point is how will the existing structures be retro-fitted?

[tbendick 27]

The Freedom Tower, the skyscraper that is planned to rise next to where the Twin Towers fell, will use a system similar to the Asian model, where a set of service elevators would be placed in a pressurized fire-protected lobby near the fire stairs.

Funny thing is that FDNY doesn't allow the use of service elevators during Fires. I am sure in a case like this they would have to look at the books again.

[Dr. Zuki 1]

Great idea but big money developers will get this concept defeated. Everytime there is a tragedy in NYC, they talk about upgrading the fire codes and never follow through like the time the firefighters died in that Queens hardware warehouse and remember all the talk after Sept 11 about making building owner's pay for repeaters? It all fades into the wind, big money always seems to get it's way unfortunately....

[Guest WolfEMT]

And that's sad, because no amount of money, no matter how big or small, should ever take presidence over the safety of a human life.

[WAS967 97]

Tell that to the money grubbing politicos that nit pick over the cost of an EMS system that probably is only a few 100k a year and has more direct impact over human life than most other town services combined.

[ny10570 745]

sadly, everythign has a value...including human life. I'd actually be pretty curious to see the dollar figure placed on a FF's life when they figure this s#!t out.