Hazards with "Hoarders"

[hudson144 150]

With the recent show Hoarders and some recent fires locally it wouldn't be a bad idea to discuss the hazards you might encounter when you are called to the structures packed with years of items. Collyers mansion in a nut shell is about a home in nyc occupied by 2 brothers who hoarded anything and everything. Conditions that were so bad that firefighters had to tunnel their way through the home. Lets use this as a training thread and bring out some points to ponder!

[x635 4,066]

I can't believe these people let themselves be televised! You would think they would be ashamed in some form.

I remember a fire in Rye a few years ago. They could not get to the victims due to the extensive floor to ceiling, wall to wall, and the entire yard filled with trash. Despite recieving citations for City Code violations, they did nothing about it.

Often, I don't think it is safe for firefighters to go inside these kinds of structures. The IC has to decide risk vs. benefit, even if there are people trapped.

[cbfire25 9]

I just recently responded to a basement fire in a one story residential at a pack rat house, hopefully I can learn from this thread as much as I did from the fire.

We were fortunate to have been met by the homeowner and knew where the access to the basement (it was a blind basement with the only access being interior) was so the strech was much easier than it could have been. However, the line was covered/kinked several times due to the junk and made the push into the basement a little dicey. In order to monitor the floor conditions I tried to use both a TIC and sounding with a bar, but the junk on the floor made sounding difficult. It was also difficult to maintain orientation due to the fact that the walls were unreachable and with the piles of junk falling any landmark that you might have had to begin with was sure not to last. However, we knew this was a packrat house before we entered so I strictly kept everyone on the line (we were very fortunate that everyone was confirmed out) which helped. It was very hard to judge what the extra loading on the floor may have been doing to the integrity floor joyce which were involved with fire in the basement, so I kept my engine crew in the bottom stairwell and hit it from there (not ideal for a basement fire, I know, but this was as much a place of refuge as I could find). And of course, the normal basement fire concerns came into play. Has anyone had a similar experience? How should I have dealt with not being able to get a good sound on the floor?

[wraftery 1,275]

After 34 years OTJ, I can tell you there are many, many more Collyers Mansion places out there than you would tend to think. The ones on the TV show are mild cases compared to what you might respond to.

My first was as a FF. It was an ordinary multiple dwelling, six floors, open stairs, fire reported on about floor 3. We forced the door at the lock side, but it refused to swing. One FF reached around the door to feel for a possible victim and felt furniture. We went to the hinge side and when that side was free the door still stood there. We managed to get the door out into the hall and my partner started passing furniture to me so the hose line could advance. Things were getting a little touchy at this point since the fire was growing fast and we had no way to control the doorway.

After we removed maybe a room and a half of furniture, my partner and I started a search and the hose line went to the fire. I remember not being able to crawl because the floor was COVERED with booze bottles that rolled as you tried to crawl across the floor. I felt what appeared to be a doorjamb. I felt clothes up at about 3 ft off the floor and shoes on the floor beneath the clothes. OK, it's a closet. I'll move forward til I hit the other door jamb. Next thing I know iI was feeling a couch and coffee table. What happened to what I thought was a closet? I completely lost my bearings.

The hose team bumped into the victim as they advanced, also sliding on the bottles. They passed the victim to us and we were 1...2...3... yanking her toward the door as the bottles piled up into a mound. The more we moved the higher the mound got. I finally took my flashlight, look at her signs of life from about 2 inches away because that's the visibility allowed. I pronounced her dead, pulled my mask out from my chin so I could be heard, and announced her death to the Chief who was outside the door. The answer back was to "get on the fire."

The cleanup after the fire found she had over 500 bottles in a 1-bedroom apartment. Not only was she a hoarder, but a recluse and alcoholic. Sadly, there was a picture on a table that was charred pretty badly, but you could make out the form of a Firefighter.

So, back to business. What can you expect when you discover you've got a Collyer's Mansion? Anything.

[JohnnyOV 2]

Knowing what signs to look for on the exterior of the structure upon arrival are also very useful. Some consistent things I've noticed on the exterior of hoarders houses are, uncut lawns of a known occupied house, a plethora of odd trinkets and other lawn ornaments, moss and algae growing on the siding of the home, every window's shades are closed, pools are not cleaned or the winter covers on during the summer, garages that are packed to the brim and overflowing with stuff, neighbors stating that they are never allowed inside or that they are never seen outside or with anybody. If their cars are in the driveway too, look at the cleanliness of both the interior and exterior of the car. If there is crap stuffed throughout the back seats of the car, generally the house looks like that too. These are just personal observations I've made over a few years in my district.

Does anyone else have any key signs to look for on the exterior?

Also, I found that as you're doing your search, specifically in places that have "pathways" of papers, magazines, trash and other crap that goes completely to the ceiling, you need to be extremely careful to not bump into the walls of trash as it might collapse around you blocking your escape path, or becoming wedged under a door.

[67R93 5]

Knowing what signs to look for on the exterior of the structure upon arrival are also very useful. Some consistent things I've noticed on the exterior of hoarders houses are, uncut lawns of a known occupied house, a plethora of odd trinkets and other lawn ornaments, moss and algae growing on the siding of the home, every window's shades are closed, pools are not cleaned or the winter covers on during the summer, garages that are packed to the brim and overflowing with stuff, neighbors stating that they are never allowed inside or that they are never seen outside or with anybody. If their cars are in the driveway too, look at the cleanliness of both the interior and exterior of the car. If there is crap stuffed throughout the back seats of the car, generally the house looks like that too. These are just personal observations I've made over a few years in my district.

Does anyone else have any key signs to look for on the exterior?

Also, I found that as you're doing your search, specifically in places that have "pathways" of papers, magazines, trash and other crap that goes completely to the ceiling, you need to be extremely careful to not bump into the walls of trash as it might collapse around you blocking your escape path, or becoming wedged under a door.

We have a house in district, and this is exactly the case. We've been there a few times for EMS calls, and oh my god. The last time we were their, I am happy that our Car 1 showed up, because this gave him a first hand look of the inside. Never mind the fact that a Type II ambulance barely fits up the long driveway because its not wide enough.

Pre-plan these known occupancies, as stated in a prior post, Risk vs. Benefit.

Edited October 6, 2011 by 67R93

[x129K 1,393]

ANYTIME I find out about a Collier's Mansion condition in Poughkeepsie, be it info from the cops or the firemen, I enter a housewatch/alert in our CAD.

[JM15 386]

Our CAD system has a section for alerts for this type of situation.. Members are asked to report any hazardous situations to dispatch or an officer. EMS calls are great for pre-planning houses and noticing hazards.