Ambulance - Diesel vs Gasoline

[huzzie59 75]

Please provide the pros and cons of diesel engines vs. gasoline engines in ambulances.

[E112 12]

Diesel Pro's

More torque (You're going to need it with all of that weight)

More efficient than gas

Runs cooler than gas (Helpful because they spend a lot of time idling)

Diesel engines last longer than gas engines

Diesel Cons's

Takes longer to warm up, but usually isn't a problem because most ambulances are stored inside.

Diesel is the way to go.

[NWFDMedic 58]

The last time I checked, only diesel ambulances can be used in the U.S.

[texastom791 31]

The last time I checked, only diesel ambulances can be used in the U.S.

The rescue squad I vollie with in my dad's town in vermont just recently purchased a gasoline ambulance.

Edited September 17, 2011 by texastom791

[firedude 985]

The last time I checked, only diesel ambulances can be used in the U.S.

They are not illegal but are sort of frowned upon in the US. Gas ambulances are cheaper but do not perform like a diesel ambulance. Overall, Diesel is the way to go, IMO.

Edited September 17, 2011 by firedude

[x635 4,066]

From what I can think of:

Gasoline, for remote areas that don't have diesel pumps nearby.

Gasoline burns more intensly then diesel, which factors in in an MVA

Here's an interesting article about Ford Gasoline ambulance fires:

http://www.autosafety.org/ford-ambulancevan-fuel-fed-fires

The last time I checked, only diesel ambulances can be used in the U.S.

Here are the "standards" set by the US GSA. As we all know already, Washington DC is very up to date on EMS regulation and funding to meet their own standards.

http://www.deltaveh.com/f.pdf

[MoFire390 118]

gotta go with diesel on this one. while the gasoline ones run quieter u never know they r running. give me a diesel atleast i know its running and wont try to start it.

[voltage1256 42]

What engine is in the ford ambulance diesel? I have the 6.0 in my ford truck and can hear the turbo spool... but i never hear that in the local diesel ambulances... am I just not paying attention? Diesel is the way to go. Lasts longer, on both ends, it will last longer then a gas engine and it burns less. And of course the power is there too! I have an example on the fuel efficiency:

I can drive my diesel (picked it up in april) (6.0 Powerstroke) around 400 miles without having to refuel

The same truck which is (5.4 Triton) gas engine I was filling up every 170 miles if I was lucky.

[NWFDMedic 58]

They are not illegal but are sort of frowned upon in the US. Gas ambulances are cheaper but do not perform like a diesel ambulance. Overall, Diesel is the way to go, IMO.

I just went through the KKK standard and it specifically said that the OEM will supply a diesel. It is, however, just a guideline, so I guess it's not illegal. If I recall correctly, and those a bit more "experienced" than me can probably fill in the blanks, the concern about gasoline engines was the high idle temperatures. I think a couple of them burnt up in the ER parking lots.

[Bnechis 3,961]

The last time I checked, only diesel ambulances can be used in the U.S.

Maybe this will clarify your statement.

I had a 1989 Ford E-250 van and there was a factory sticker on the door post that said converting it to an ambulance would void all Ford warrenties. Starting in 1989, it was very hard to find gasoline units.

[BHFD702 3]

With the weight factor from the ambulance body itself plus equipment, crew, etc... the diesel will give you more power and torque with less stress. diesel is the way to go plain and simple

[JackEMT 77]

Back in the day with carbs and points/distributors, diesels were probably a lot more reliable and less expensive per/mile to run. Now days with ECU's and electronic ignition, it would be interesting to see those numbers again.

But diesels have always been know for higher torque at lower RPM's. Now with turbos, there is high HP with the diesels. Putting a turbo on a gasoline engine probably requires higher pressure gas lines and a higher volume gas pump.

I was also told idle time can be a factor, diesels do better with heat than gasoline engines. I don't know but it sounds reasonable.

Depending on the department, if the dept has easy access to diesels (DPW, FD, local stations, etc) diesels is a good way to go. In some rural areas gasoline maybe more readily available and might be a factor in switching to a gasoline chassis, especially since modern day gasoline engines can put out quite a bit of HP and torque.

[NHFD21255 141]

I agree that the Diesel engines last longer than the gas engines but with the exception of the paid service who keeps their ambulances long enough for it to matter. Today’s gas engines will last at least 100k and in my opinion cost less to maintain. The oil changes are half the cost and there’s one thing you don’t have to worry about, if you have a Ford which most are, the turbo’s are a nightmare anymore and they aren’t cheap to replace.

[antiquefirelt 994]

I just went through the KKK standard and it specifically said that the OEM will supply a diesel. It is, however, just a guideline, so I guess it's not illegal. If I recall correctly, and those a bit more "experienced" than me can probably fill in the blanks, the concern about gasoline engines was the high idle temperatures. I think a couple of them burnt up in the ER parking lots.

And who requires you to follow KKK specs? And di you actually follow it to the "T"? The same KKK that requires all ambulances be white and have orange striping? But I guess, like so many other standards, we pick and choose which parts we want to apply to us, and which shouldn't?

Edited September 19, 2011 by antiquefirelt

[antiquefirelt 994]

Coincidentally, we met with the Chief and a B/C from our capital city FD this morning so they could look over a couple of our apparatus. They noted their next ambulances would be gasoline engines, given the sharp cost increase of the newer diesel engines to meet emmission standards. They run E-series buses and their builder reported about a $15k difference. They turn the trucks over quick enough to not worry about high mileage and many years. Given the numerous issues we've had with Ford diesels in the past decade, I wondering why we didn't look into this more. I do know our spec committee found the savings was minimal on the 2011 F-series chassis we're getting this winter.

[Newburgher 241]

2011 Ford E chassis aren't available with a diesel due to the lack of space for the new motors.

[antiquefirelt 994]

2011 Ford E chassis aren't available with a diesel due to the lack of space for the new motors.

Could be why the Chief was talking about the price increase? Either a 2012 expectation or switching to a Chevy or Dodge which both are more money to start with.

[FFFORD 27]

My ambulance company just recently purchased our first chevy duramax ambulance after staying true to ford. I must admit, it is a nice machine, and I am partial to ford. That being said the dang thing was $$$$. Diesel engine requirements are becoming strict and with that, brings bugs to work out. One thing I dont like is that they have to go through a "regeneration" cycle which burns fuel like crazy, so I would like to see how that reduces overall fuel consumption. Just makes no sense to me at all. My buddy's '08 6.4L powerstroke was getting single digit mpg's which put a huge dent in his pocket. He ended up selling it. Pair that up with diesel cost and fuel alone with these new machines, and it could impact the monetary situation of a company. So I could see a consideration to switch to gasoline. But gasoline has its problems as well as others have pointed out.

BUT...If departments or companies trained their drivers about diesel engines, even a little bit, I bet there would be less problems. For example - how many know you need to wait for the "wait to start" light to turn off before you should try to crank? How many allow the unit to cool down before shutting it off? or that you shouldn't stomp on it right after starting it up? many of the problems we have had in the past could have potentially been avoided if people even knew a little bit about basic use of a diesel vehicle. (turbo's, head gaskets, pumps, etc).

specific to ems...but...when I go in for a shift, pick a rig, I fire it up (correctly) and allow it to warm up, get the oils flowing, and do a basic check. indoor or outdoor my rig is warmed and ready to roll properly. Then I see Johnny Q EMT hop in another rig, fire it up, and stomp on it (terrible for the truck), little does he know he can be damaging the truck.

Now of course there are those times when I get a call as soon as I report for duty, but I dont stomp on the machine until its a little bit warm at least. Basic maintenance and proper operation can keep any diesel going for a while.

ohhh and remember - Make sure the spark plugs are good to go too

'00 7.3 powerstroke 160k miles with no issues at all. (knocks on wood) - Mike

[trauma74 111]

I am a huge fan of diesel engines for all emergency & extreme duty vehicles. I know that the new regulations for diesel engines has caused the price to go a lot higher and it has caused a mess for the agencies who were committed to Ford E series chassis. If you shop around, you can find older pre-regulation diesel chassis at some of the larger ambulance & truck manufactorers. A few months ago, I saw Wheeled Coach advertising that they had them in stock and at good prices. They are just like brand new waiting for a box to be built on them.

For the Ford fans, either go with Chevy or Dodge or switch to F series styles trucks. The F series are nice because you can order them with 4 wheel drive from the factory.

A gas engine may make the price cheaper, but you are going to burn a hell of a lot more fuel & it will cost you more money in the long run.

If anyone has the ability to get biodiesel, it is usually cheaper & your engine runs even better with it, just ask the long haul truckers who use it.

[JSchloss84 9]

My organization has the same problem right now while designing our new rig. We have run ford E-Series diesels for over 20+ years and now we are faced with the decision of either going with the Gas powered Ford Chassis or the Duramax Chevy. We have had tons of problems with the Ford Diesels but we have an excellent Ford certified shop that does our repairs. After making phone calls at least here in the lower Hudson valley very few dealerships will service the medium duty Chevy's for any warranty work. So that adds a whole other wrench into the situation. I would love to go Ford F-Series but they will not fit in our current bays length wise.