What has happened to good BLS?

[EMSer 15]

Perhaps there are agencies out there that throw parties for their members. Don't hardworking, dedicated, volunteers deserve a night to celebrate their hard work for the past year? I don't see the money as being wasted but rather spent giving the people who help a stress free and relaxing night one night a year.

sorry, i disagree 100% when taxpayer money is used

if you need a party to 'pat yourselves on the back' you shouldnt be in public service, again - only if public money is used

i know some agencies use private funds to refill their FD bar taps and soda machine and that's fine (as far as finances go) Unlimited beer flowing 24/7 at the FD is another very serious issue...

my former agency collects usual tax money, BILLS patients insurance AND they beg for money via 'boot drops' and sending letters to homes asking for more money. please tell me SOMEONE on here is unbias enough to see the concern...

[Guest alsfirefighter]

Perhaps there are agencies out there that throw parties for their members. Don't hardworking, dedicated, volunteers deserve a night to celebrate their hard work for the past year? I don't see the money as being wasted but rather spent giving the people who help a stress free and relaxing night one night a year.

Is it possible that these agencies are not using the taxpayers money but rather money the members have earned, collected, and put aside for themselves? sounds quite possible to me.

DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT SPEAKING ABOUT SPECIFIC AGENCIES OR AGENCIES THAT I AM PART OF.

The answer to your question depends on a lot of factors. I perform my duties and as a dual role provider a hell of a lot more then 99% of volunteers...so where is my "night to celebrate" my hard work? The way I see it in my area...they get plenty as I wait and wait and wait for mutual aid. You speak as if they are doing it every day 24/7/365. Sounds like a great sound bite..but holds no merit.

Is it possible they are not using taxpayer money? Sure..but chances are they are in some way...if they 3rd party bill...some of that money is from medicaid/medicare...tax funded. Even if somehow it was by donations...does that still make it right? Go out to a parking lot asking for donations for a dinner? Or do people think they are helping with equipment costs?

And I just took the time to read some of the other posts from some of you....give me a break. Some of you need thicker skin...Firemoose if his post actually angered you that you couldn't reply..you definitely need to read my post right before this one. I feel for you and I'm sure your VAC has its funding issues...but what he posted...I see everyday...so now what? Why don't you be angry that I have VAC's around me that have more money to shake a stick at..can't over all their calls yet don't use the money to supplement their response with paid staff or do it so silly its mind blowing. But its ok..they get new ambualnces every 2 to 3 years. Smiles are great..but even if you show up an hour later and as long as you don't drop them..most people will smile. Yet again...instead of valuing someone's honesty...the cries of vollie bashing appear....if that is what is happening in his area..is he bashing? Or speaking the truth? And finally...no service is ever "free of charge." You get funding somehow.

[PFDRes47cue 653]

sorry, i disagree 100% when taxpayer money is used

if you need a party to 'pat yourselves on the back' you shouldnt be in public service, again - only if public money is used

i know some agencies use private funds to refill their FD bar taps and soda machine and that's fine (as far as finances go) Unlimited beer flowing 24/7 at the FD is another very serious issue...

my former agency collects usual tax money, BILLS patients insurance AND they beg for money via 'boot drops' and sending letters to homes asking for more money. please tell me SOMEONE on here is unbias enough to see the concern...

I was not referring to taxpayers money being used...not everything purchased by EMS agencies is taxpayer money or money that people donate thinking it is for equipment.

The answer to your question depends on a lot of factors. I perform my duties and as a dual role provider a hell of a lot more then 99% of volunteers...so where is my "night to celebrate" my hard work? The way I see it in my area...they get plenty as I wait and wait and wait for mutual aid. You speak as if they are doing it every day 24/7/365. Sounds like a great sound bite..but holds no merit.

Is it possible they are not using taxpayer money? Sure..but chances are they are in some way...if they 3rd party bill...some of that money is from medicaid/medicare...tax funded. Even if somehow it was by donations...does that still make it right? Go out to a parking lot asking for donations for a dinner? Or do people think they are helping with equipment costs?

I personally do not think that when an agency does not bill, and a patient sends a donation, that the patient is implying, "here is $100 buy some glucose." I would imagine that they more so are sending it to say thank you. And the patients who have asked how they can donate, say they want to send a donation as a thank you for our services.

I have also been n the situation where a patient takes out a $100 bill while WALKING into the ER and says, "Take this and buy your crew some drinks." OF COURSE I DECLINE THE MONEY!!!!!!! I REPEAT, OF COURSE I DECLINE THE MONEY!!!!!!! The point is that these are instances of people who are donating money as a thank you and want you to do something for yourself.

Your night to celebrate can be paid for by your income...

Im a pursuing music educator and in a year when I am working in a public school teaching music to students K-12 Monday thru Friday, my "night to celebrate" will be funded by me. There are volunteer music educators, music therapists, etc that receive donations. Is it wrong for the person to use the donation to buy dinner after a long day? Is the donator saying, "Here is $30, you MUST use it to buy valve oil?" I don't think so...

It is up to the worker to use the money he/she makes how he/she wants. IMHO the same goes for money that is not taxpayer money and is earned/saved up by the members themselves.

Edited April 5, 2011 by PFDRes47cue

[EMSer 15]

thanks alsfirefighter, you have always been a voice of reason on this forum

i appreciate the backup

i am indeed not bashing, i have stated issues with both Vollie and Paid. I just think there are many reasons for Vollies to be subpar and unfortunately we have to "deal with it" for the time being. On the other hand, Paid EMS has no excuse. If you can't do your job well and do it right, you deserve to be fired, that goes for any job in any industry; public SERVANTS are no different. If you think otherwise, move to Wisconsin

Edited April 5, 2011 by EMSer

[x129K 1,393]

ALS - you have your party every two weeks! LOL

[PFDRes47cue 653]

If you think otherwise, move to Wisconsin

HAHA nice!

[EMSer 15]

I was not referring to taxpayers money being used...not everything purchased by EMS agencies is taxpayer money or money that people donate thinking it is for equipment.

I personally do not think that when an agency does not bill, and a patient sends a donation, that the%

Edited April 5, 2011 by EMSer

[PFDRes47cue 653]

As is true with all great discussions, three sides are formed and disagreements arise. All sides make great and valid points. If we all agreed all the time, there would be no discussions, no need for words.

Edited April 5, 2011 by PFDRes47cue

[Guest alsfirefighter]

ALS - you have your party every two weeks! LOL

If that's the case...I need a bigger party...lol.

[Bnechis 3,961]

Just wanted to jump in on the discussion for a quick second. Forget about the title of EMT or Paramedic for a minute; speaking solely as a trained and certified practitioner of emergency medicine, nothing frustrates me more than walking into a room full of other trained and certified practitioners of prehospital emergency medicine, asking "What do ya got?" and being met with blank stares. Then asking "What vitals did you get?" and being met with blank stares. Then asking "Can anyone tell me anything about our patient?" only to be handed the clipboard with the patient's name and address written on the PCR, which does me absolutely no good at that given moment.

I agree with what you are saying and have seen this issue more times than I care to, but I have also seen the reverse.

One call that stands out in my mind was a 2am Diff Breather. The Pt. was in his 70's or 80's awakened at 3am with diff. breathing. My BLS-FR Engine arrived, determined a chief complaint, placed the patient on oxygen, baseline vital signs done. Meds & Hx written down for the Medic and we were taking a 2nd BP when the ALS crew arrived on-scene (we were there about 4 minutes prior).

I did not know the crew and they did not know me (they also did not see my certification patch). I advised them that the age/male pt. with a hx of CHF, on lasix with 3 pillow orthopnia was awakened due to DIB. Also advised that we were there before (for similar problem) and the full pt vitals and that he had rales 1/2 way up bilaterally. The EMT said thank you removed our bp cuff and placed theirs on and started to take another BP. The patient asked why a 3rd was needed and the crew said: "We have to take our own because we cant trust the firemen to take a BP". The patient turned to the medic and asked if this was true. Before the medic could answer the patient started yelling at the EMT. He said as a cardiologist, he would trust my assessment and before discounting the 1st responders, they should pay a little more attention to whether we appear to have a clue. He then advised the crew that the engine company had 3 EMT's and a paramedic instructor.

You never know the level of training you will find on an incident. The range covers the spectrum.

C) The EMT certification has become more of a joke than anything else. Individuals at job fairs are encouraged to take the EMT class because "after 6 months of training you can make $10 an hour". It's like a bad infomercial. This is not a knock to EMT's, but more so at the means of selecting and recruiting candidates who are being attracted to the field because it's marketed as a quick and easy way to get a certification and start making money; similar to these shady phlebotomy and medical assistant programs you see on TV at 3am.

This has not changed in 30 years. While its an issue, its nothing new as its always been an issue.

E) Lack of appropriate field training for new providers and a lack of continuing education for all providers.

I believe that this along with a lack of ongoing supervision are the biggest areas that we have to blame for poor skills at all levels.

[MoFire390 118]

If that's the case...I need a bigger party...lol.

nahhh just need a larger crowd to help u out with that!!!!

[x129K 1,393]

nahhh just need a larger crowd to help u out with that!!!!

Hahaha...there is already quite a big "crowd" taking from our checks as it is! LOL

[JJB531 652]

I agree with what you are saying and have seen this issue more times than I care to, but I have also seen the reverse.

One call that stands out in my mind was a 2am Diff Breather. The Pt. was in his 70's or 80's awakened at 3am with diff. breathing. My BLS-FR Engine arrived, determined a chief complaint, placed the patient on oxygen, baseline vital signs done. Meds & Hx written down for the Medic and we were taking a 2nd BP when the ALS crew arrived on-scene (we were there about 4 minutes prior).

I did not know the crew and they did not know me (they also did not see my certification patch). I advised them that the age/male pt. with a hx of CHF, on lasix with 3 pillow orthopnia was awakened due to DIB. Also advised that we were there before (for similar problem) and the full pt vitals and that he had rales 1/2 way up bilaterally. The EMT said thank you removed our bp cuff and placed theirs on and started to take another BP. The patient asked why a 3rd was needed and the crew said: "We have to take our own because we cant trust the firemen to take a BP". The patient turned to the medic and asked if this was true. Before the medic could answer the patient started yelling at the EMT. He said as a cardiologist, he would trust my assessment and before discounting the 1st responders, they should pay a little more attention to whether we appear to have a clue. He then advised the crew that the engine company had 3 EMT's and a paramedic instructor.

You never know the level of training you will find on an incident. The range covers .

I don't deny that the reverse occurs on occasion. My only issue with what occurred is the response by the EMT from the EMS crew, not the re-taking of the patients blood pressure. If the medic who responded to the job has some level of trust in his/her EMT's ability to take an accurate blood pressure, and is not familiar with the FD crew or their ability to take accurate vital signs (remember, there are great EMT's and medics and there are horrible EMT's/medics), then it may be SOP for that particular crew to retake vitals on every patient they encounter to ensure accuracy. You know the importance of accurate vitals (especially BP) when treating patients with exacerbation of CHF with vasodilators. Eventually the responsibility falls on the medic, not on the EMT or crew from the FD. Personally I recheck every BP myself before medicating patients unless I'm working with someone who I have absolute 100% trust in. It's nothing personal, it's just business.

The EMT should have come up with a more diplomatic response instead of demeaning the FD members on scene. A simple, "we just need to make sure your BP is still stable before we medicate you" would have sufficed.

[firemoose827 324]

daaaaaamn, chill out people

usually when someone puts the "sorry for the rant" disclaimer on the post that means they're getting out frustrations

a post that started to be "IMHO" went a little off target helicopter...again, the disclaimer...

yes, my former agency, as MANY OTHER agencies in the surrounding area have EXPENSIVE parties and other PERKS at the expense of the taxpayer! maybe not in your area, but definately in mine! my former agency(s) spend about $10,000 for 2 lavish parties (EDIT: these 2 parties happen each year) and the majority of people think it's ok and those that condemn it still attend it because it's a place to get drunk and eat for free!!

most all of the vollies i know are wonderful and caring people, they just suck at being EMT's (and they know it)

but what can they do?? they have other responsibilities in life, you have the ability to train and retrain PAID EMT's

sorry, there isn't an excuse for being a sucky paid EMT, and i blame the state of NY, REMSCO and the company(s) for allowing EMT-B's and Medics to be subpar. if youre a paid guy and suck, you deserve to be fired, plain and simple

not so easy to do to vollies

Get ready...another disclaimer...YES, i know not everyone sucks at EMS, but we SEEM to agree that EMS personnel are getting worse each year. thats the rant

People are always quick to use "Taxpayers Money" in these rants. We have fundraisers all year long, and not just people standing in the road with a hat collecting money, actual fundraisers where people come in willingly and pay money for a service or a product such as a meal or a community wide yard sale. We than use some of that money (Very little) to throw an annual banquet. Thats not a bad thing. I agree with you though in some aspects, there are some providers (Notice I said providers, not 'paid' or 'volunteer' or 'basic' or 'advanced') that just plain suck. They have no compassion, no skills, no clue about whats going on with the patient and they should be removed from EMS. But to flat out come out and say that all volunteers should go ASAP...Thats not just a humble opinion.

Quick clipboard story;

About 15 years ago, my department responded to an MVA, occupants were out of the car upon my arrival, but injured, laying on the side of the road...

The ambulance shows up, the EMS Captain walks over to me and hands me the dreaded clipboard...

I look at her, refused the clipboard and said, "I think we need something a little bigger, like a backboard please......"

THAT did NOT go over very well...LOL

LMAO...Great story, Im sure we all were in your shoes at one point or the other!! lol

And I just took the time to read some of the other posts from some of you....give me a break. Some of you need thicker skin...Firemoose if his post actually angered you that you couldn't reply..you definitely need to read my post right before this one. I feel for you and I'm sure your VAC has its funding issues...but what he posted...I see everyday...so now what? Why don't you be angry that I have VAC's around me that have more money to shake a stick at..can't over all their calls yet don't use the money to supplement their response with paid staff or do it so silly its mind blowing. But its ok..they get new ambualnces every 2 to 3 years. Smiles are great..but even if you show up an hour later and as long as you don't drop them..most people will smile. Yet again...instead of valuing someone's honesty...the cries of vollie bashing appear....if that is what is happening in his area..is he bashing? Or speaking the truth? And finally...no service is ever "free of charge." You get funding somehow.

And to ALSfirefighter...There are times when someone is just plain mad at something, and rather than spew out a long and meaningless post attacking someone, we choose to pick our words carefully. Thats called "Self Control", which I use daily. I was merely beat to the punch by chopper who worded his response very respectfuly and tactfully. Which Is why I chose to thank him.

One persons opinion can differ from others, and when you say to someone that "Volunteer EMS should go ASAP" thats a blow to everyone whether you like it or not.

If he had stated that some providers need to pay closer attention in class and maybe even persue some extra studies to sharpen their skills...I would have agreed 100%. There are providers everywhere that do not even posses the basic skills to treat a splinter, yet they are out there and responding to the calls armed with their trusty clipboards, and they are ruining the reputations of other providers that give 150% every time the go to a call, even the little old ladies that need a hand to hold.

I have been both BLS and ALS, I have been an officer for years, spec'd a new rig and got it in service as an ALS unit, worked both as a paid provider and volunteer for at least 16 years now, and trust me...I see the bad ones too. But just because they suck doesnt mean the whole entire lot needs to be removed ASAP. Just the bad ones.

I apologise if I offended anyone, I was merely being honest myself and stating that I felt that there was a definite issue with bad providers, and that the transition from classroom to field was where they were being misled down the wrong road of patient care, without the proper "initial" guidance from officers or experienced providers. Without someome to tell them the difference between book smarts and actuall reality, on the streets knowledge...They get lost in the crowd.

Stay Safe.

[JohnnyOV 2]

I don't deny that the reverse occurs on occasion. My only issue with what occurred is the response by the EMT from the EMS crew, not the re-taking of the patients blood pressure. If the medic who responded to the job has some level of trust in his/her EMT's ability to take an accurate blood pressure, and is not familiar with the FD crew or their ability to take accurate vital signs (remember, there are great EMT's and medics and there are horrible EMT's/medics), then it may be SOP for that particular crew to retake vitals on every patient they encounter to ensure accuracy. You know the importance of accurate vitals (especially BP) when treating patients with exacerbation of CHF with vasodilators. Eventually the responsibility falls on the medic, not on the EMT or crew from the FD. Personally I recheck every BP myself before medicating patients unless I'm working with someone who I have absolute 100% trust in. It's nothing personal, it's just business.

The EMT should have come up with a more diplomatic response instead of demeaning the FD members on scene. A simple, "we just need to make sure your BP is still stable before we medicate you" would have sufficed.

Or, they could have asked if they were EMT/PM/FR and the last time a round of vitals were taken... if you cant trust the guys working next to you, what is the point of having them there in the first place?

At school, our medical first response team built up such a great working relationship with the local FD and Ambulance service that when the Fire Department arrived, unless it was an ALS run, there was almost no need for them. They saved equipment, and were more then happy to get a short break and view the "college scenery." When the ambulance arrived, in the bus they went without waiting, and the bus drove off.

Knowing who you're working with, and building a rapport, even if its the first 5 seconds on a scene, is critical for smooth patient transfer from agency to agency and will provide the patient with a faster more efficient transfer from the scene to the hospital.

[JJB531 652]

Or, they could have asked if they were EMT/PM/FR and the last time a round of vitals were taken... if you cant trust the guys working next to you, what is the point of having them there in the first place?

At school, our medical first response team built up such a great working relationship with the local FD and Ambulance service that when the Fire Department arrived, unless it was an ALS run, there was almost no need for them. They saved equipment, and were more then happy to get a short break and view the "college scenery." When the ambulance arrived, in the bus they went without waiting, and the bus drove off.

Knowing who you're working with, and building a rapport, even if its the first 5 seconds on a scene, is critical for smooth patient transfer from agency to agency and will provide the patient with a faster more efficient transfer from the scene to the hospital.

The EMS crews in New Rochelle are pretty familiar that the firefighters are at a minimum EMT's. The point of having them there is to initiate patient care, especially to recognize and address life-threatening conditions which is where they are going to have the greatest impact on patient outcomes, and in New Rochelle they do an excellent job.

That being said, there's a stark difference being trusting the BP someone else took and just heading to the hospital compared to trusting the BP someone else took and then giving medications that can kill someone if the BP as reported was incorrect. The responsibility always comes down to the highest medical authority on scene. While it's a nice warm and fuzzy feeling to trust the people you work with, a responsible Paramedic will ensure that the patients vital signs meet the criteria to be eligible to receive certain medications. Maybe I'm the minority, but I'm not about to endanger my patients outcome as well as my certification because I was too lazy to do the responsible thing and ensure the patient's BP meets the criteria before I start administering medications.

As I said, it's nothing personal, but strictly business. I do agree that knowing who you work with and building a rapport with other agencies is important, but when the responsibility for the patient is resting in the lap of one person (highest medical authority on scene), that person has a responsibility to the patient to ensure that they receive the appropriate medical care and do not receive any treatments that could be detrimental to their outcome.

[Guest alsfirefighter]

Or, they could have asked if they were EMT/PM/FR and the last time a round of vitals were taken... if you cant trust the guys working next to you, what is the point of having them there in the first place?

At school, our medical first response team built up such a great working relationship with the local FD and Ambulance service that when the Fire Department arrived, unless it was an ALS run, there was almost no need for them. They saved equipment, and were more then happy to get a short break and view the "college scenery." When the ambulance arrived, in the bus they went without waiting, and the bus drove off.

Knowing who you're working with, and building a rapport, even if its the first 5 seconds on a scene, is critical for smooth patient transfer from agency to agency and will provide the patient with a faster more efficient transfer from the scene to the hospital.

While the person whom Barry is using as an example was completely inappropriate...it does make you wonder why they felt the way that they did. If they didn't know who Barry was or his background then they are operating on prior experience more then likely. So I can see it both ways...the provider was inappropriate...but may have had some negative interactions which led the behavior..right or wrong. And while nice in a utopia, you can't always trust the people next to you. I have more times then I can count know that I was given a vital sign that was not accurate, the only difference is now I know by face who I may not ask nor listen to all that much.

Bottom line is this..if I were to walk in to your scenario Barry...I would have still gotten another BP...but probably in the ambulance...if I did ask for one in the place....I would have simply explained that due to I intended to administer medications and one that is BP dependent, that I wanted to one more good grasp on what it is. What am I really saying...in the end...its my call to give a medication...and its also my responsibility for its administration and what can occur once I give it. IF it makes me feel more comfortable to get one....then get over it. But I can say that I wouldn't have handled it the way the other provider has. The other thing I want to point out..is that while I am a huge advocate for fire based EMS....there are still many firefighters who could care less about EMS and don't do their jobs to the fullest or think they know how a paramedic job goes which is BS. Do it the right way or don't do it at all. I'm fortunate enough to work with guys who see the heart attack just as, or if not as important as the AFA.

[ONEEYEDMIC 68]

While the person whom Barry is using as an example was completely inappropriate...it does make you wonder why they felt the way that they did. If they didn't know who Barry was or his background then they are operating on prior experience more then likely. So I can see it both ways...the provider was inappropriate...but may have had some negative interactions which led the behavior..right or wrong. And while nice in a utopia, you can't always trust the people next to you. I have more times then I can count know that I was given a vital sign that was not accurate, the only difference is now I know by face who I may not ask nor listen to all that much.

Bottom line is this..if I were to walk in to your scenario Barry...I would have still gotten another BP...but probably in the ambulance...if I did ask for one in the place....I would have simply explained that due to I intended to administer medications and one that is BP dependent, that I wanted to one more good grasp on what it is. What am I really saying...in the end...its my call to give a medication...and its also my responsibility for its administration and what can occur once I give it. IF it makes me feel more comfortable to get one....then get over it. But I can say that I wouldn't have handled it the way the other provider has. The other thing I want to point out..is that while I am a huge advocate for fire based EMS....there are still many firefighters who could care less about EMS and don't do their jobs to the fullest or think they know how a paramedic job goes which is BS. Do it the right way or don't do it at all. I'm fortunate enough to work with guys who see the heart attack just as, or if not as important as the AFA.

I can't tell you how many times I have been on some sort of EMS call and gotten baseline vitals, minus the BP, Patient HX, etc.... and relayed that to an EMS crew whether it be and AMB or MEDIC and have them look at me like I got 15 heads. No I don't wear a "I was a medic patch" on my uniform but certain key phrases should tip you off that I may have a clue. This happens all the time with others as well. Now I could just get patient info for my report and sit there in my pockets and watch, but I don't. It's funny when the sh*t hits the fan and low and behold the COP is spiking a bag, opening and intubation roll and doing other stuff. I guess all those episodes of EMERGENCY paid off for me.

I guess my point is, you never know who you have in the room with you to help!

[MoFire390 118]

I can't tell you how many times I have been on some sort of EMS call and gotten baseline vitals, minus the BP, Patient HX, etc.... and relayed that to an EMS crew whether it be and AMB or MEDIC and have them look at me like I got 15 heads. No I don't wear a "I was a medic patch" on my uniform but certain key phrases should tip you off that I may have a clue. This happens all the time with others as well. Now I could just get patient info for my report and sit there in my pockets and watch, but I don't. It's funny when the sh*t hits the fan and low and behold the COP is spiking a bag, opening and intubation roll and doing other stuff. I guess all those episodes of EMERGENCY paid off for me.

I guess my point is, you never know who you have in the room with you to help!

your right on that one.

but on the otherside its good to know that someone with a background in EMS is there to help you out when poo hits the fan.

ALS, part of the reason why i admire u so much is ur thought process and how u do ur dective work to figure out whats going on.

[Bnechis 3,961]

While the person whom Barry is using as an example was completely inappropriate...it does make you wonder why they felt the way that they did. If they didn't know who Barry was or his background then they are operating on prior experience more then likely.

I don't know why they reacted that way, but it was not from previous experience in my system, since it was the 1st shift for both members of the crew, in the 1st 3 hours of a new contract.

Bottom line is this..if I were to walk in to your scenario Barry...I would have still gotten another BP...but probably in the ambulance...if I did ask for one in the place....I would have simply explained that due to I intended to administer medications and one that is BP dependent, that I wanted to one more good grasp on what it is. What am I really saying...in the end...its my call to give a medication...and its also my responsibility for its administration and what can occur once I give it. IF it makes me feel more comfortable to get one....then get over it.

I would have had no problem if they said they were required to get their own, or waited a few more minites. Since I had given them 2 set, 3-5 min apart. by the time they had set up the IV it would have had been time for a 3rd. Telling a patient that you do not trust some of the responders that are standing in his living room is a good way for the patient to loss all respect for you. Particularly if you do not know who the patient or the other responders are. I knew the patient for 20 years and he had given me medical control orders for many of his patients.

[Guest alsfirefighter]

I don't know why they reacted that way, but it was not from previous experience in my system, since it was the 1st shift for both members of the crew, in the 1st 3 hours of a new contract.

I would have had no problem if they said they were required to get their own, or waited a few more minites. Since I had given them 2 set, 3-5 min apart. by the time they had set up the IV it would have had been time for a 3rd. Telling a patient that you do not trust some of the responders that are standing in his living room is a good way for the patient to loss all respect for you. Particularly if you do not know who the patient or the other responders are. I knew the patient for 20 years and he had given me medical control orders for many of his patients.

Your second paragraph sums up my point exactly...there was a more tactful way to accomplish what they wanted. So it sounds like across the board they just weren't flat out familiar...like it or not..and I say this all the time..we all represent each other. They may have had a bad experience from another FD in another area or listened to those who say we all don't care about EMS.

[Tapout 42]

We all respresent each other.

We ALL represent EACH OTHER.

WE ALL REPRESENT EACH OTHER.

This simple line represents and perfectly sums up EVERYTHING we ALL do as EMS and ER healthcare providers.

Say this line before every single shift you work. If you believe it, get to work! But if you don't, call out and consider submitting your resignation. Then consider another job because you won't be good at what you get paid to do and you will be eventually fired for being useless and ineffective.

We all represent each other.

If you love this job, you will be a perfect example of those of us who also love this job. You will make me look great and I thank you in advance for all of the gratiitude I'll get!

But if you do badly because you don't love this job or do it for the wrong reasons, YOU MAKE ME AND ALL OF OF US WITH GOOD, ALTRUISTIC INTENTIONS, LOOK BAD. I will have to defend myself for YOUR lame actions and I will wish you ill in all kinds of ways. I'm harmless but Karma isn't. Never forget that and good luck with the fallout. I won't back you because you didn't back me.

Tapout