America is not broke

[99subi 121]

I'm glad you think so highly of "the fat slobs" at DPW. Do you like garbage/recycling pickup? Street and traffic lights that work? Snow removal, road repair, park maintenance? Free flowing sewers and clean water supply? You must be kidding with that. Its ignorant. You want to work on the back of a garbage truck for 30 years and not have anything? What happens when sewage backs up into your home on a holiday weekend?

Must be real nice in your world.

I do enjoy my garbage pick up, funny thing is, its contracted out to CRP. State highway dept does a fine job keeping traffic lights working. Road repair? have you seen the roads in Westchester county? free flowing sewers? i had to clean the one in front of my house yesterday becuase there was still 2 feet of water flooding the street..... I have a septic, that's my responsibility... but if sewage did back up 1 someone didnt do their job,2 i guess id be screwed because they have most holidays off. I do not want to work on the back of a garbage truck for 30 years.. therefore i will not apply for that job. Listen im not sayin all DPW workers are like this, but take a look around, there is quite a few.

[27east 19]

I do enjoy my garbage pick up, funny thing is, its contracted out to CRP. State highway dept does a fine job keeping traffic lights working. Road repair? have you seen the roads in Westchester county? free flowing sewers? i had to clean the one in front of my house yesterday becuase there was still 2 feet of water flooding the street..... I have a septic, that's my responsibility... but if sewage did back up 1 someone didnt do their job,2 i guess id be screwed because they have most holidays off. I do not want to work on the back of a garbage truck for 30 years.. therefore i will not apply for that job. Listen im not sayin all DPW workers are like this, but take a look around, there is quite a few.

You cleaned the sewer in front of your house? Climbed into the manhole? But you have septic? Took it upon yourself to maintain the public rights-of-way?

Suprise, suprise, but not every sewer backup is a result of one of your favorite fat slobs falling asleep on the job.

NYS DOT is union too, and they get a pension. OH MY GOSH!

When did you gather all this knowledge? You sound like someone who, mabye, possibly, just once, inquired about a DPW job and you didn't get it.

Must be real nice in your world. Let me know when there's a job opening.

[helicopper 1,050]

Another reminder from the staff:

DO NOT MAKE BLANKET STATEMENTS SMEARING ENTIRE DISCIPLINES OR PROFESSIONS.

If you havea specific complaints about an agency or its personnel the proper forum to address them is with that department or your town's elected officials, not in an internet forum.

[99subi 121]

You cleaned the sewer in front of your house? Climbed into the manhole? But you have septic? Took it upon yourself to maintain the public rights-of-way?

Suprise, suprise, but not every sewer backup is a result of one of your favorite fat slobs falling asleep on the job.

NYS DOT is union too, and they get a pension. OH MY GOSH!

When did you gather all this knowledge? You sound like someone who, mabye, possibly, just once, inquired about a DPW job and you didn't get it.

Must be real nice in your world. Let me know when there's a job opening.

Yes the sewer in front of my house, not a manhole, but a sewer, you know the ones that drain water from the street surface? I take it upon myself every year to clean the whole side of my street so it doesn't get washed out from the drains being clogged. Every time i put a call into the town to do it , it goes unanswered. I dont have an issue with NYS DOT they seem to keep all the roads they are responsible for in good shape. And they get a pension sweet! You think i have an issue with unions? i am Union thank you very much. I take issue with local DPW's. Take a look at a village like blank. they have their own DPW and then the town of blank overlaps and works in the same areas............ waste of money and i see these guys at dunkin donuts for hours on end sitting shooting the s***.. that's what pisses me off. And for the record, no i have never inquired or applied for a position at any DPW, like i said before i don't want to be on the back of a garbage truck for 30 years.

Edited March 10, 2011 by 99subi

[firefighter-70 27]

I stand by my post. I said foreign aid was tens of billions of dollars and it is. I still think it should be reduced (not elminated).

Foreign aid is in the billons without question. What should be asked is "whats foreign aid pay for?". Its used to further our national interests whether it be civilian directed aid or militay to military aid. In many cases it's given to the foreign nation with conditions requiring them to purchase american made equipment which I have seen first hand (this does put americans to work). Many times the aid is in the form of weapons that are no longer used by US forces or DOD. These weapons can be anything from the M60A3s/M1 Main Battle Tanks (as seen in Egypt)to out dated US kevlar helmets seen worn by many countries through out the world. Civilian aid also comes in many forms such as AIDS prevention to dam construction to create irrigation to produce crops for consumption for foreign nations. If its used to further the interests of the United States i'm in. If its wasted on BS that does little or nothing concerning US interests then cut it like a towed jumper.

[mfc2257 464]

Yes the sewer in front of my house, not a manhole, but a sewer, you know the ones that drain water from the street surface?

The rest of America calls that a storm drain. A sewer takes waste water from your home and processes it for cleanliness. A storm drain takes runoff and at best has a basic catch mechanism for debris that rolls in off the street. You cleaned debris from a storm drain.

[99subi 121]

Thank you for the clarification.

[Goose 188]

Foreign aid is in the billons without question. What should be asked is "whats foreign aid pay for?". Its used to further our national interests whether it be civilian directed aid or militay to military aid. In many cases it's given to the foreign nation with conditions requiring them to purchase american made equipment which I have seen first hand (this does put americans to work). Many times the aid is in the form of weapons that are no longer used by US forces or DOD. These weapons can be anything from the M60A3s/M1 Main Battle Tanks (as seen in Egypt)to out dated US kevlar helmets seen worn by many countries through out the world. Civilian aid also comes in many forms such as AIDS prevention to dam construction to create irrigation to produce crops for consumption for foreign nations. If its used to further the interests of the United States i'm in. If its wasted on BS that does little or nothing concerning US interests then cut it like a towed jumper.

The problem with foreign aid is that the US government has no mechanism or apparatus to ensure that the billions we dump into our "national interests" overseas actually makes a difference. The money rarely, if ever in the worst cases, gets to the people and programs who need it the most.....it often becomes bolus of cash for corrupt leaders and/or regimes.

Sadly NGOs (non-governmental organizations) tend to be far better about putting cash to work and making a difference on the ground. Look @ some of the work the Bill & Melinda Gates foundation has done in terms of AIDS/immunizations/hunger.

Edited March 10, 2011 by Goose

[99subi 121]

Goose is right on the money with that one,(no pun intended)

[mvfire8989 22]

The problem with foreign aid is that the US government has no mechanism or apparatus to ensure that the billions we dump into our "national interests" overseas actually makes a difference. The money rarely, if ever in the worst cases, gets to the people and programs who need it the most.....it often becomes bolus of cash for corrupt leaders and/or regimes.

While that may sometimes be true, some of our money is making a difference. This program for example does have mechanisms in place to ensure that our tax dollars are being well spent.

My link

Edited March 10, 2011 by mvfire8989

[Bnechis 3,961]

The problem with foreign aid is that the US government has no mechanism or apparatus to ensure that the billions we dump into our "national interests" overseas actually makes a difference. The money rarely, if ever in the worst cases, gets to the people and programs who need it the most.....it often becomes bolus of cash for corrupt leaders and/or regimes.

And how is this any different from domestic spending?

[Goose 188]

I was referencing discussion about foreign aid, not domestic spending. So, i'm not quite sure i follow you're question. If you're looking for an opinion, then i would agree that there is an awful lot of frivolous spending with little to no return. Thats why i would support allowing the president to possess line item veto powers.

Edited March 10, 2011 by Goose

[SRS131EMTFF 471]

Geez, I leave for three days and suddenly the bravo goes from SOP to GOP, who would have guessed.

There is a bumpersticker out there somewhere that reads something like "it will be a great day when our schools get all the money they need and the air force has to hold a bake sale to buy a bomber." The comments about over paid teachers made me think of that.

[99subi 121]

Every year these schools want more and more money. Why? What changes in teaching kids that calls for all this extra money.Granted the need for computers and such would call for a budget increase, but what else? why every time there is a vote its a huge increase?

[SRS131EMTFF 471]

No one agrees more than me that schools waste a massive amount of money but I firmly believe we should be paying teachers enough to get the job done effectively and with sufficient results. If we successfully funded our education system the way we successfully funded our military, we would be innovating, inventing, and engineering our way out of this recession instead of floundering with 10% unemployment, 2 foreign wars, a crashing housing market, constant assaults on public workers and a surging foreign investment pool. Education is 1/10th the Defense budget if you look it up (70 billion vs. 700 billion). Imagine the good you could do if you halved the defense budget and invested that back into Americas workers, education system and infrastructure (not that this should actually be done but hopefully you get the point, its a lot cash spent no matter how you slice/justify it).

Edited March 10, 2011 by bvfdjc316

[mfc2257 464]

Geez, I leave for three days and suddenly the bravo goes from SOP to GOP, who would have guessed.

There is a bumpersticker out there somewhere that reads something like "it will be a great day when our schools get all the money they need and the air force has to hold a bake sale to buy a bomber." The comments about over paid teachers made me think of that.

At 20 years old I guess we couldn't expect you to understand how terrifying the cold war was because you were born a scant 12 months before it was over. The brave men and women of our armed services supported and manned B-52's that flew in a constant path 24 hours a day for nearly 30 years from middle America up past Greenland through the Artic and down the Alaskan coast to mount a moments notice strike to counter the aggression that the USSR had no problem using elsewhere. BTW those bombers never had to drop a single bomb. They just had to be there.

[SRS131EMTFF 471]

At 20 years old I guess we couldn't expect you to understand how terrifying the cold war was because you were born a scant 12 months before it was over. The brave men and women of our armed services supported and manned B-52's that flew in a constant path 24 hours a day for nearly 30 years from middle America up past Greenland through the Artic and down the Alaskan coast to mount a moments notice strike to counter the aggression that the USSR had no problem using elsewhere. BTW those bombers never had to drop a single bomb. They just had to be there.

21+ years ago that may have been an issue, but it is just that a past issue. Call me crazy but I am far more afraid of the the loss of American global dominance than some terrorist or communist threat. And I would be willing to bet that affects you too more than any communist or terror threat. We live in a time of economic crisis, not military crisis, we can't forget that.

Edited March 10, 2011 by bvfdjc316

[mfc2257 464]

21+ years ago that may have been an issue, but it is just that a past issue. Call me crazy but I am far more afraid of the yuan becoming the world currency over the dollar than some terrorist or communist threat. And I would be willing to bet that affects you too more than any communist or terror threat. We live in a time of economic crisis, not military crisis, to confuse the two would be foolish.

Funny but I'm not as concerned about the Chinese currency becoming the world standard over the dozens of terror attacks carried out by folks from the middle east and Africa against the US.

BTW I've been in financial services since I was 16 (ill be 34 this weekend) when I started working for a well known advisor in Rye. I've been part of a team that has managed billions in pension money. I'm not concerned with the US losing seniority in the global currency sandbox.

Edited March 10, 2011 by mfc2257

[SRS131EMTFF 471]

Funny but I'm not as concerned about the Chinese currency becoming the world standard over the dozens of terror attacks carried out by folks from the middle east and Africa against the US.

BTW I've been in financial services since I was 16 (ill be 34 this weekend) when I started working for a well known advisor in Rye. I've been part of a team that has managed billions in pension money. I'm not concerned with the US losing seniority in the global currency sandbox.

I was using that as a metaphor for the loss of an America hegemony but point taken and I stand corrected. I still maintain that we need to invest in our education, at the cost of other more swollen and inefficient programs, where ever they may be. This will be the only way we stand a chance to be competitive and dominant in the global economy. We obviously have different priorities in our lives and I respect that, thankfully in this country your vote is worth exactly as much as mine (although the electoral college can throw some curve balls) and we are allowed to exercise that right. Stay Safe.

Edited March 10, 2011 by bvfdjc316

[99subi 121]

When you say invest in education. What will this do?

[Bnechis 3,961]

Education is 1/10th the Defense budget if you look it up (70 billion vs. 700 billion).

Is that 70 billion just what the FEDs put in to education? I think if you add the state aid and every school districts local tax leve, you will find we spend a tad more. Defense $$ is primarily just the federal cost and local $$ does not get added to that figure.

[Bnechis 3,961]

21+ years ago that may have been an issue, but it is just that a past issue. Call me crazy but I am far more afraid of the the loss of American global dominance than some terrorist or communist threat. And I would be willing to bet that affects you too more than any communist or terror threat. We live in a time of economic crisis, not military crisis, we can't forget that.

In the 1930's we lived in a greater economic crisis and when those looked to the past they new that we won the "war to end all wars" (WWI) nothing to worry about, no more wars. Just because you do not see a threat, does not mean its not lerking around the next corner.

[bfxfd 8]

That's a pretty bold statement to make in a forum like this with probably 75% of the membership being union employees, and for that I admire your fortitude.

Now, what do you do for a living, I see your affiliation is a volunteer firefighter, are you trying to get on the job somewhere? If in fact you are, I'd like to see what your opinion is after a few months on the job and as a member of the IAFF. What is your basis for making a statement like that? Who else can we bargain against, unfortunately the taxpayers are the ones who pay the salary here. I'd like to see the average private sector employed taxpayer do the job of FD, PD, or EMS for a month, actually better than that, six months. With those months surrounding the holiday season. I'd love to see how they react to working thanksgiving, christmas, new years...in the rain, snow, sleet, or the heat of july. How about being up in the middle of the night to respond to an emergency, or worse than that the ones who don't have the luxury of bunk. Guaranteed, the tune would change! The average, misinformed person crys about how much public employees "get", but what they don't see is the sacrifices we make. I understand that may sound a little corny, but it is the truth! Has Joe Taxpayer ever been blasted out of bed to go do CPR on someone that collapsed, responded to a structure fire or serious MVA, gone to a domestic or shooting? The answer is no, and for that they have no appreciation!

n.

Now for those who think we get a huge bag filled with money every two weeks:

In the municipality where I work, a majority of the city employees do not live within the city. Most were born there, grew up and went to school there, and got hired by the city. They realized when it was time to buy a home, with their salary, they couldn't afford to live within the city that they work. So they took their money and moved to a place much more affordable, with cheaper taxes, and a respectable home for a reasonable price. I'm not positive what the median cost of a home is in westchester, but it's considerably less in the northern counties. It's unfortunate that these employees don't make enough to live comfortably in the city they grew up and work in. If there were no right to collective bargaining or union protection, god only knows what would happen, and eventually it would impact service to the taxpayers. People wouldn't want to take the jobs if they didn't have these benefits because that would mean low pay, horrible (if any) health coverage and probably an unhappy and hostile work environment.

Who would respond if mom or dad were having difficulty breathing?

Who would show up when the next door neighbors are making too much noise?

Who would scrape up the dead skunk in front of your house?

So, I guess shame on us who want a salary that is enough to live on, a safe work environment, and a comfortable retirement after protecting the muncipalities who employed us for 20+ years!

Stepping off the soapbox now

I stand by my original statement. I am not attempting to get on the job anywhere but i have respect for what you and everyother member of the paid emergency services do. However we are apparching a point in america where public sector employees are no longer having to trade between long term job security or higher salary. Public sector employees are in some, not all, areas are being paid better than thier private sector counterparts with lucrative bonuses such as guaranteed pensions and healthcare for themselves and thier family, albeit with modest contributions. My point is that we have to regain the balance between private and public sector. For the most part public sector unions, with the exception of fire/ems and police, are negotiating for things that are not available or not possible through private sector employeers. The most flagrant example of this is the teachers unions. Tenure is something that no private sector employee has. Is this right? Do we really want a nation where going to work for the government is the most attractive option. I exclude police and fire from this because the private sector has no business in these areas. My original statement was in regards to the Wisconsin events where teachers and other non emergency personel are the most affected.

[Stepjam 118]

Teachers have become the scapegoat for big education budgets. I don't think that their compensation packages are entirely to blame. When you consider their educational requirements and the job overall, I personally don't believe that they are overpaid. At least, not in my district. However, consider the price tag of the large number of Administrators, Assistant Principals, and Psychologists/Guidance Counselors that make far more than the average teacher, then you might be on to something.

I ran into an old school chum of mine at a neighborhood reunion. He is now the "Technology Administrator" for a very large suburban school district. Basically, he is in charge of computers, software, multi-media, telecommunications, and all of the "technical staff" that install and run it all, and has his own mandate to constantly "improve" what he has by acquiring the latest and the best stuff that taxpayer money can buy. I didn't want to say so to his face, since he was very enthusiastic about his career and I certainly didn't mean anything personal, but I saw him and the juggernaut he managed as a very big part of the problem. I always believed in the old adage "if it aint broke, don't fix it."

With regard to teachers, the only thing I have a problem with is tenure. I'm sorry, but there are a few too many teachers out there who, while perhaps academically competent, are socially clueless and do more to alienate their students than they do to educate them. I think we can all agree that there are people who have no business being teachers. The difference is that they have almost NO accountability because of tenure. If a teacher sucks, or has a severe personality flaw when dealing with children, they should be out of a job.

Edited March 10, 2011 by Stepjam

[bfxfd 8]

Teachers have become the scapegoat for big education budgets. I don't think that their compensation packages are entirely to blame. When you consider their educational requirements and the job overall, I personally don't believe that they are overpaid. At least, not in my district. However, consider the price tag of the large number of Administrators, Assistant Principals, and Psychologists/Guidance Counselors that make far more than the average teacher, then you might be on to something.

I ran into an old school chum of mine at a neighborhood reunion. He is now the "Technology Administrator" for a very large suburban school district. Basically, he is in charge of computers, software, multi-media, telecommunications, and all of the "technical staff" that install and run it all, and has his own mandate to constantly "improve" what he has by acquiring the latest and the best stuff that taxpayer money can buy. I didn't want to say so to his face, since he was very enthusiastic about his career and I certainly didn't mean anything personal, but I saw him and the juggernaut he managed as a very big part of the problem. I always believed in the old adage "if it aint broke, don't fix it."

With regard to teachers, the only thing I have a problem with is tenure. I'm sorry, but there are a few too many teachers out there who, while perhaps academically competent, are socially clueless and do more to alienate their students than they do to educate them. I think we can all agree that there are people who have no business being teachers. The difference is that they have almost NO accountability because of tenure. If a teacher sucks, or has a severe personality flaw when dealing with children, they should be out of a job.

You are absolutley right when you mention the pay for adminstrators. It is absolutley out of control. However these individuals negotiate their own contracts and have no job security beyond the length of said contract. Teachers have close to 25 years of job security.

[calhobs 110]

I stand by my original statement. I am not attempting to get on the job anywhere but i have respect for what you and everyother member of the paid emergency services do. However we are apparching a point in america where public sector employees are no longer having to trade between long term job security or higher salary. Public sector employees are in some, not all, areas are being paid better than thier private sector counterparts with lucrative bonuses such as guaranteed pensions and healthcare for themselves and thier family, albeit with modest contributions. My point is that we have to regain the balance between private and public sector. For the most part public sector unions, with the exception of fire/ems and police, are negotiating for things that are not available or not possible through private sector employeers. The most flagrant example of this is the teachers unions. Tenure is something that no private sector employee has. Is this right? Do we really want a nation where going to work for the government is the most attractive option. I exclude police and fire from this because the private sector has no business in these areas. My original statement was in regards to the Wisconsin events where teachers and other non emergency personel are the most affected.

Let me explain how Non Union Teachers get treated, My wife is a Speical Ed Teacher, for a Speical Education Services company who teach Special Ed students in thier homes throughout Westchester and Putnum Counties. She gets no medical insurence, no paid sick or vaction leave, she has to carry Malpratice insurence, has not gotten a raise in four years, and had her salarey cut by 15% this year do to State Budget cuts. Now you may say why dont she work for a school district, she has tried and do to her "lack of classroom exprience" she has been turned down. Besides that fact she enjoys what she is doing as does the thousands of teachers who do the samething as my wife. As we say being a Police Officer or a Fire Fighter is a calling, many teachers consider teaching to also be a calling.

[helicopper 1,050]

No one agrees more than me that schools waste a massive amount of money but I firmly believe we should be paying teachers enough to get the job done effectively and with sufficient results. If we successfully funded our education system the way we successfully funded our military, we would be innovating, inventing, and engineering our way out of this recession instead of floundering with 10% unemployment, 2 foreign wars, a crashing housing market, constant assaults on public workers and a surging foreign investment pool. Education is 1/10th the Defense budget if you look it up (70 billion vs. 700 billion). Imagine the good you could do if you halved the defense budget and invested that back into Americas workers, education system and infrastructure (not that this should actually be done but hopefully you get the point, its a lot cash spent no matter how you slice/justify it).

The federal share of education is 70B, what is the total expenditure on education in the US? How much do we pay in local taxes for national defense? ZERO! So the 700 billion is the total national expense. What is the total national expense for primary education?

We DO fund our education system and it is still failing us. School districts have increased their budgets, in some cases dramatically, every year. What do we have to show for it?

How much of that 70B in federal education spending actually makes it to the local classroom or to local students? We have to finance a federal "Department of Education" with staff, website, publications, reports, research, etc. How much of that makes a difference in our child's classroom.

Are there problems with defense spending? Absolutely! Government procurement is so complicated that it takes 10x longer and costs at least 5x as much to field anything for the military as it does for the public. This is wasteful and can without a doubt be improved but your education/defense spending analysis is flawed because you ignore the local expenditures for schools.

[KRF178 49]

I stand by my original statement. I am not attempting to get on the job anywhere but i have respect for what you and everyother member of the paid emergency services do. However we are apparching a point in america where public sector employees are no longer having to trade between long term job security or higher salary. Public sector employees are in some, not all, areas are being paid better than thier private sector counterparts with lucrative bonuses such as guaranteed pensions and healthcare for themselves and thier family, albeit with modest contributions. My point is that we have to regain the balance between private and public sector. For the most part public sector unions, with the exception of fire/ems and police, are negotiating for things that are not available or not possible through private sector employeers. The most flagrant example of this is the teachers unions. Tenure is something that no private sector employee has. Is this right? Do we really want a nation where going to work for the government is the most attractive option. I exclude police and fire from this because the private sector has no business in these areas. My original statement was in regards to the Wisconsin events where teachers and other non emergency personel are the most affected.

While I respect your opinion and appreciate that your previous comment wasn't directed at emergency services, I agree with some and disagree with some. While its true that some negotiated items aren't available for the private sector, there are some things in the private sector that aren't available to public employees. You don't see a public employee getting any monetary bonuses, company limo's, or things of that nature. Everything we have, we negotiated for and the unions have fought for. I know a guy employed in the private sector for some aeronautics company, you know what an average bonus is for him? At least $80k! When was the last time a public employee was given a cash bonus(not saying they're entitled to, just making a point). No one is saying to a cop, "hey nice job with that drug bust, here's a check for $50k, good going!" As far as teachers and tenure, that's kinda the only place that they can hold any administration over a barrel. Not for nothing but they are handed a pretty monumental task, educating and in some cases babysitting our youth. I know where I live a good percentage of the kids are complete animals, and anyone that can keep some kind of order in a classroom gets a ton of respect from me. For the most part teachers are responsible for these kids 6-8 hours a day, and not to mention, overcrowding of schools, parents who take no responsibility for their children, and dealing with some of the problems that children take from their home. I know a bunch of teachers, and not only is it stressful for them to maintain order in their classroom, it also takes a toll on them psychologically. Some of these kids that come from the dredges of the earth, parents who are addicts, don't get properly clothed and fed at home, and come to school looking for attention. Do they deserve everything, I'll agree and say no, but I will say that being a teacher isn't all glitz and glamour. They face a different kind of adversity in the schools than we see on the street as emergency service providers. I think I'd rather see a gunshot or stabbing victim rather than have to see a child that is physically or mentally abused at home day in and day out, but that's just me. I wouldn't want to stand in the shoes of an educator.

[Guest RADDOG7190]

It's not a soapbox - it is reality - our livelihoods!

Our cities/counties/etc try to put the screws to us as it is - imagine how much worse it would be WITHOUT Union representation!

Yes, the Unions DO help to keep those who screw up and don't deserve these jobs keep theirs occasionally, but they do so much other good for their respective members! (I know...I am preaching to the choir for the most part..LOL)

My union paycheck keeps my family healthy and lets me own a house and two solid cars. There is no way I could afford to own a home on my private sector paycheck at the job I had before this. Not saying it could not be done, but in MY case...it could not, not in the town I live in.

I am proud to be a city employee, but even prouder to be a part of a Union Brotherhood, as I know the majority of you all are.

People are forgetting who built this country, and who help contribute to these politicians campaigns....UNIONS. All this talk about the taxpayer the taxpayer, we are all taxpayers and Im so sick and tired of all these financial district guys bashing our Unions. Our economy isn't in this financial burden due to the unions, or the Pensions. Do i think that some things need to be revamped, yes i do. The reality of it is that in these municipalities a lot of it is due to poor budgeting, corruption, bad spending and the list goes on. We bomb other countries, spend trillions of dollars to do it, then we send them over food, but yet how many people are homeless and starving in NYC alone. I do think a lot of people who work in or used to work in the financial district, same people who got their half million dollar bonuses at xmas time, are sitting home, unemployed, pissed off that their taxes are going to some cop, firemen, or DPW guy and to boot he's pissed that these guys are getting Pensions. They also forget the work we do and the things we risk everyday when we go to work. I go to work everyday not knowing if Im coming home at the end of the day, even if I am at cushie job, its still the nature of the job. . Do I think its worth some kind of Pension when I retire along with making up to 100K, absolutely. Should collective bargaining be stripped from Union workers, absolutely not, its unconstitutional, the biggest criminals here are the politicians.

[JohnnyOV 2]

Education is 1/10th the Defense budget if you look it up (70 billion vs. 700 billion).

Pretty sure my parents pay that much in school taxes a year... or at least it sure feels like it to them.