Why Are Police Officers Down Here So Different?

[JJB531 652]

Eli's humorous statement bears some truth, at least "up here".

My intent with thie is not to lead this to a career/volunteer ff bash forum, but, i have to ask: does anyone have any idea of what percentage of ESU members are on volunteer FD's on the island or in upstate counties??

Division wide its a relatively small percentage. I think its more prevalent for guys who are volunteer firefighters to belong to Long Island departments rather then upstate departments

[mreis95 77]

What is the one thing cops and fireman have in common? They both want to be firemen...

God created fireman so cops would have heros haha.

Kidding

[mreis95 77]

Personally I don't think you can compare two local PDs let alone two that are across the country from eachother. Sane goes for FDs they all have different ways of operating and what not that works for them and the area they serve.

Edited March 8, 2011 by mreis95

[ronnie 2]

Were do I start. I can only speak for the area that is protected by Greenburgh Police Dept., since that was my employer for 25 years. Ems was handled by the police Dept. in Greenburgh because they are many volunteer fire companies and several paid fire companies. It would not be feasible to have each company doing EMS work. As far as doing extrications again most of the fire companies were not interested in doing auto accidents. when the Paramedic program was started in 1980 again it was a federal grant that was open to any service, but only the PD applied for it. In the late 1997 when the Town of Greenburgh wanted to form a Technical rescue team the three paid fire departments did not want to be the agency running it. Greenburgh Police Department took on the lead role and was awarded the federal grant. Two of the three paid fire departments were involved in a minmial role. The volunteer departments were not able to supply the manpower for the training that was involved. For many years the fire departments did not want to get involved in EMS. With all that said in my 25 years I have worked with a lot of firefighters that were more then willing to help. Over the years the fire departments are getting more involved in EMS. I resent that the original author of this thread is making it sound like New York police departments specially there officer do not go out of there way. Again I can only speak from my own observation and say that I have seen many police officer and firefighters go above the call of duty. I think that things are changing and police and fire departments are working much closer. Thank you for letting me vent.

[Fire24 1]

A lot of very good posts here. We need to remember it is about who needs our help, for whatever reason, and not about fighting each other over what jobs we will do. With everyone dealing with reductions in personnel, having people trained to help in a variety of areas helps to make the job go better. Working together is what it's all about. We will all have our service-specific roles and I doubt that you'll ever see a cop putting out a fire or a firefighter taking point on an entry. But when it's something that we can all work on, why not make things more efficient with people from all agencies helping out? I believe, by and large, that we do a pretty good job up here in the northeast in all areas of emergency services. Let's continue to work towards improving our services, collectively, so that we do the best job that we can when the public needs our help.

[Group42 5]

One Word

EGO

[x635 4,066]

Personally I don't think you can compare two local PDs let alone two that are across the country from eachother. Sane goes for FDs they all have different ways of operating and what not that works for them and the area they serve.

Were do I start. I can only speak for the area that is protected by Greenburgh Police Dept., since that was my employer for 25 years.

I resent that the original author of this thread is making it sound like New York police departments specially there officer do not go out of there way.

First, I hope you guys read my post above.

In regards to comparison, we can all learn from one another. That's one of the things that makes national conferences so great. I love meeting people from other areas and seeing and hearing how they view and do things.

As far as Greenburgh and Ronnie's comments, I wholeheatedly support them as they were the leader and innovator at the time and I understand the history. The still have a great EMS system. But their EMS system does affect patrol staffing, and in some cases, FD staffing. It also affects response times, and I've witnessed numerous mutual aid requests. I see it getting better now that they are hiring more civilian EMT's for 79 (or whatever designation it is nowadays). Their Police Officer-Paramedic concept is a great one, and it allows an officer to continue their work as a Paramedic and use those skills as well as those of a Police Officer, which can be extremly beneficial in a lot of situations, but they don't need to get tied up on BLS 911 transports. However, the lack of funding by the Town for GPD*EMS is always too little to late....Greenburgh EMS were one of the last agencies in Westchester to fully deploy LifePak 12's because of funding. When did a ride along with GPD*EMS in 2000, we went through 4 vehicles. The first one we started out in, was freezing cold because it was kept outside in the winter with only a small space heater inside. Using the ambulance for patrol 24/7 takes it's toll. As a Greenburgh resident, I paid high taxes for this service. Situations like having to drive the ambulance to the hospital when I needed EMS for my mother because it was going to be a wait for officer to drive it after a 20 minute wait for the ambulance to even arrive (I was an EMT at the time though) and seeing the amount of times Ardsley, Elmsford, White Plains, and Scarsdale would go mutual aid into Greenburgh was ridiculous.

In contrast, down here, for a quarter of the taxes, we have a county run EMS system, all with ambulances less then two years old, with state of the art equipment and dual medic staffing, and pay starting at $55,000. Passing rate for their hiring exam is 8%. It's like, why can't Greenburgh do the same? They are very similar communities.

Greenburgh has excellent officers who are very much into protecting the community, however, and they probaly are just as frusterated, at the amount of funding the town gives for EMS.

Living in Hartsdale, both west Hartsdale and on Central Ave, and my father having a store at the four corners, I've been interested and watched Greenburgh EMS ever since I can imagine. Although people will claim that I have no idea what I'm talking about, I have been involved with GPD from many different angles, from working as a career firefighter in Hartsdale and volunteer firefighter in Ardsley, to dispatching at 60 Control, to being a resident. I also have involvement as a patient, which I don't remember anything about, my mother being a patient, other friends being patients, and my father being pronouced by Greenburgh EMS.

Me at I don't even remember what age at Fairview's open house. I used to love that event, not only because I was an apparatus buff at that age, but because they had Spiderman repel from the roof.

Disclaimer: I word my posts idiotically sometimes.

[Task Force 7 65]

Okay in my last post I gave a quote from a study done, but now I'm chiming in. Are Police Officers different here in Texas from those of NY? Yes, they are. But then Police in Los Angeles do things different from us. Seth, take a look where you live in Round Rock. Do your Officers walk a beat like those in NYC? No they don't. They drive around in their patrol car, or maybe ride a bike around the Outlet Mall. Does that make it right or wrong? No. We all do things differently. What works in Texas may not work in New York, Florida, California, etc. However in the end we all get the job done. My father walked a beat in Milwaukee when he was a cop. The people got to know him, because they saw him every day walking the streets. When we moved to Phoenix he drove around all day in his patrol car. The people of Phoenix didn't know him from Joe Q Public. But that's what worked for the Phoenix PD. Do I personally know my Police Officers that patrol Fort Worth. I only know 2! That's because I took the time to go to a neighborhood crime watch meeting to meet them. Do I see them on the streets. From time to time I see them drive by along with all the other Officers that patrol the Westside. What matters to me is when I dial 911 someone responds in timely manner. I don't care how they get there, or how they do it. Just as long as they help me when I need them. If every FD, PD, EMS were the same, we would all be driving the exact same patrol cars, fire trucks, and ambulances.

Everyone have a GREAT DAY and be safe out there!!

[x635 4,066]

Seth, take a look where you live in Round Rock. Do your Officers walk a beat like those in NYC? No they don't. They drive around in their patrol car, or maybe ride a bike around the Outlet Mall.

Yes, but that's also because there is no real downtown in Round Rock. At special events, such as the Dell Diamond, there are walking beats. There are plans for a walking beat with the downtown master plan.

In Austin, there are tons of officers that walk (or bike) a "beat", especially the downtown, central east, south central, airport, and park sectors. More officers are in training for bike and walking beats.DPS also has walking beats for the Capitol. AISD and ACC PD have walking beats for school campuses.

And in Round Rock, lol, Joe Q. Public knows the name of the officer driving around....because every officers name is on their patrol car or motorcycle! And officers don't just drive around, they stop in or make a presence at businesses routinely and get to know the people in their sector. I see the same officers at the same time of day in most areas....even though they work three 12's I can count on seeing them on patrol if their on duty. And they take their cars home, so the typical patrol car is pampered, and lasts 5 years in frontline service before going to the spare pool. When they budget for a new officer, they budget for all neccesary equipment as well. This allows a ton of off-duty officers to go in service to assemble when needed. And in my part of the City, we have Williamson County Sherriffs Office and DPS who patrol regularly.

Georgetown, Cedar Park, and Leander are all similar.

There's a unoffical slogan about Williamson County law enforecent: "Go On Vacation, Leave On Probation"

[ny10570 745]

Seth, most of you're gripes about PDs becoming too distracted with the additional duties of EMS and other specialties are staffing issues. The same problem crops up when you give all these roles to FDs. You need the manpower to do the job.

[AMISHFF 26]

I have noticed we get no notifications about PD calls in Yonkers anymore. Maybe all the ESU cops left the site because of the bantering.

I spoke to a friend of mine in YPD ESU. He said there was no conflict at the rope job and everyone did a good job. They worked together with FD with not one issue. Maybe this guy posting may not be a cop like all the cop bashers think and maybe County tech rescue guy that always gets bashed, WCDES, or another firefighter, who does this stuff for a living and never gets the publicity that Yonkers got out of this job. The moderators should look at this.

[x635 4,066]

Seth, most of you're gripes about PDs becoming too distracted with the additional duties of EMS and other specialties are staffing issues. The same problem crops up when you give all these roles to FDs. You need the manpower to do the job.

That was one of my main points I was trying to make. Staffing. I get lost in my words sometimes, and thanks for succicntly clearing that up.

[pcarozza 3]

Ladies & gentlemen, this is how it starts. Instead of just letting the story play itself out with the MUCH NEEDED shot in the arm we emergency service workers have been waiting for in light of all the NEGATIVE press lately, WE'RE the ones who are going to bring it all crashing down with the finger pointing & chest puffing. There's no doubt in my mind the novelty of the rescue would've worn itself off in due time but to speed up the process with this OPEN FORUM infighting only exacerbates things. There have been some posts here mentioning working together & hand-in-hand at both emergency scenes & charity events. The OPINIONS (I'll get back to THAT!) expressed here will undoubtedly make their way onto one of those scenes & the downward spiral will never end! These social networking sites (Facebook, Twatter, etc.) do nothing more than allow EVERYONE to express their opinions, HOWEVER ridiculous! There's no filter, no authentication of background or experience, simply a log-in process & express away! Not to sound like an old timer but way back when, the only opinion anyone heard was Walter Cronkite's & that was because he was INFORMED & RELEVANT. Discussion is healthy but when it's muddied up by agendas & jealousy it ceases to be a discussion & takes on more of something akin to a competition. Again, at the risk of sounding like an old fart, can't we all get along?

[SOUSGT 357]

God created fireman so cops would have heros haha.

Kidding

I don't find this comment funny. You have opened up a can of worms and I expect you to apologize to every police officer. This type of "Humor" is unacceptable. If you have a God complex because you have a set of turnout gear and face smoke and flames then keep it to yourself.

I have spent 20 years on "the streets" in a city police department. During that time I have been shot at, had to face near riots and been injured several times dealing with violent and drunk people. I have had to search for bombs and people with guns.. Funny, I can't ever recall the room entry I had to make being determined too dangerous and we will just wait for the guy to come out. When was the last time you had to tell people that their friends (or worse their child) had died?

Still think you are a hero champ, I never did I did my job and waited for the next call.

It is not my intention to demean the fire service, blow my own horn, or to say one department is braver or better than the other, we all have our jobs to do and we all take risks every time we answer the call, but I am replying to one particular comment. We should take pride in our functions whatever we do and not demean the other services.

[ONEEYEDMIC 68]

God created fireman so cops would have heros haha.

Kidding

I'll remember that the next time I pull a FF over for a DWI! I'll also mention your screen name so they can give you the "hero" all the credit!

[5slow 9]

Having been a cop down south and in NY, I have to say unions. Texas and most states down south do not have the right to collective bargaining and union protection. You have no civil service protection and if they don't like you anymore you're gone! They can't fire you based on race, religion etc... because those are your FLSA rights, but they can fire you because you've underperformed on the job. Right to work states are a very different animal and coming from one to a state with unions it's very nice to say the least. Unions afford you many, many more rights than a job down south. They have fought for so many years to protect their members from a pissed off boss who just wants to fire you. Remember these points if you're up here and frustrated with the hiring processes of the northeast. If you move south to better yourself you're also losing that one protection which is priceless when you need your delegate. I'm lucky to have never had to deal with being administratively messed with, but raises are few and far between in right to work states. They only come whenever your local government decides to give you one, not when your union has negotiated one for you. I hope this helps the topic a little.

[x635 4,066]

Having been a cop down south and in NY, I have to say unions. Texas and most states down south do not have the right to collective bargaining and union protection. You have no civil service protection and if they don't like you anymore you're gone! .

Texas is a right to work state. PD's have unions and civil service protection.

But overall, unions are not a big thing in Texas.

[TXCHIEF 9]

Texas is a right to work state. PD's have unions and civil service protection.

But overall, unions are not a big thing in Texas.

X635 In Texas... Civil Service protection for PD & FD must first be voted in by the citizens of the municipality and in addition although the employees may join or form a union , again citizens must vote on allowing them to negotiate contracts with the municipality... commonly refereed to here on the ballot, as granting Meet & Confer