Senate bill could allow guns in libraries, parks, arenas, etc

[PFDRes47cue 653]

The Indiana Senate has proposed a bill that is very close to becoming a reality. The bill is "Senate Bill 292" which would allow people who are registered to carry firearms to bring them into public places.

Under the bill, local government would no longer be able to restrict firearms in municipal buildings without courts. That means licensed gun owners could bring their firearms into libraries, parks, arenas like Conseco Fieldhouse and even Lucas Oil Stadium, home to the 2012 Super Bowl.

www.fox59.com

I find this to be a scary bill. It allows firearms to be present in location that are often home to fights, drinking, drug deals, etc. I would not feel safe sitting at an Indiannapolis Colts game knowing that people are drinking (some heavily) and some people have tailgaited for hours prior to the game and now have guns. We have all been to sports game where fights break out and punches are thrown because one drunk fan says to another fan, ' Hey as*****! The (sports team) sucks!", or something like that. Now instead of a pu8nch or two being thrown prior to the arriva lof security or a good samaritan breaking the fight up, there will possibly be gunfire! Thats ridiculous.

The bills sponser, Senator Tomes feels that the guns will make public places safer because there will be more people with guns who will act as "first responders" in the case of an emergency...yeah ok pal, nice try!

Those good folks, he said, are the licensed gun owners. Tomes theory is the more of them we have in venues around the state, the safer our society will be.

"Your fellow Hoosier that has that firearm if something happens they are your first responder because they're right next to you shoulder to shoulder when it happens."

For some reason, I no longer want to go to the Super Bowl next year...someone else can have my ticket. Make sure you bring your gun just in case you spill some beer or popcorn on someone!

Edited February 18, 2011 by PFDRes47cue

[64FFMJK 21]

only problem is that if you drink you are no longer LEGALY carrying a firearm. Guns and drinking or drugs prescription or illegal do not mix.

[PFDRes47cue 653]

only problem is that if you drink you are no longer LEGALY carrying a firearm. Guns and drinking or drugs prescription or illegal do not mix.

Is that the law? I did not know that.

[Remember585 815]

I have no problem with people carrying firearms in public. It's done in other states and they don't have many reported issues.

[helicopper 1,050]

only problem is that if you drink you are no longer LEGALY carrying a firearm. Guns and drinking or drugs prescription or illegal do not mix.

Please cite the law to which you're referring.

Of course weapons and drugs (legal/otherwise) and alcohol don't mix but that is not a NYS statute.

[helicopper 1,050]

Is this proposed bill a state law or a federal law? In NYS, a firearm can already be carried in public places - with the exception being schools.

On private property it will remain the owner's prerogative to decide whether or not to admit someone carrying a weapon.

[PFDRes47cue 653]

Is this proposed bill a state law or a federal law? In NYS, a firearm can already be carried in public places - with the exception being schools.

On private property it will remain the owner's prerogative to decide whether or not to admit someone carrying a weapon.

You can bring a gun into a stadium/arena in NYS?

[64FFMJK 21]

Is this proposed bill a state law or a federal law? In NYS, a firearm can already be carried in public places - with the exception being schools.

On private property it will remain the owner's prerogative to decide whether or not to admit someone carrying a weapon.

It has been a stipulation on every permit I have ever had that being under the influence nullifies the permit, thus making it illegal to have the concealed weapon.

[64FFMJK 21]

You can bring a gun into a stadium/arena in NYS?

Most stadiums are private property so the owner can decide to allow weapons or not. Then again if you are carrying a "concealed weapon" no one should know you have it.

[PFDRes47cue 653]

Most stadiums are private property so the owner can decide to allow weapons or not. Then again if you are carrying a "concealed weapon" no one should know you have it.

Yes I thought they were private property. I imagine Lucas Oil Stadium where the colts play is private property too. However, the article says the bill will allows guns to be brought into the stadium.

[Haggerty 1029 16]

Now does being a police officer overide the fact you canty bring guns on private property? I think i read if a off duty police officer has his/her badge they can carry their gun pretty much anywhere, with federal restrictions? Not positive on this one.

[helicopper 1,050]

Now does being a police officer overide the fact you canty bring guns on private property? I think i read if a off duty police officer has his/her badge they can carry their gun pretty much anywhere, with federal restrictions? Not positive on this one.

Not sure what you mean by "federal restrictions" but a police officer can carry his gun anywhere in NYS.

Now there is an issue that he/she can be denied entry to private property (if off-duty, obviously on-duty cops can go whereever they have to) by the owner if he/she is armed. This has been a long-standing at the Staples Center in LA where they deny access to off-duty LAPD if they're armed. They don't want anyone in the facility with a weapon even if they're a cop.

I don't see how the Indiana Senate can compel a property owner to allow someone onto their property with a weapon if they don't want them there. Public property may be a different story but I'd have to see the text of the law to try to figure it out.

[nycemt728 49]

Not sure what you mean by "federal restrictions" but a police officer can carry his gun anywhere in NYS.

Not technically correct as this does not apply to federal facilities...the definition of which is actually quite broad. Agreed, guns and alchol don't mix...seems to me there is enough security present at sporting events that I don't want the added "help" of regular joes w/guns. I realize that folks can be judicious and responsible and not drink while carrying, but for every one of them there are probably just as many who not...causing me undue risk in a public setting where I would normally feel safe.

[Haggerty 1029 16]

Federal restrictions isnt the words i should of choosen, more along the line of gov. facilities, capital hill, state house, state capitals, etc.

[helicopper 1,050]

Most stadiums are private property so the owner can decide to allow weapons or not. Then again if you are carrying a "concealed weapon" no one should know you have it.

If you have to pass through screening with magnetometers or hand-held wands, concealed will be known.

[irishfire2491 24]

KEYWORD RESPONSIBILITY!!!!

If you dont like the new bill move to Westchester, Where you can't get a Full Carry!

[ex-commish 490]

Not sure what you mean by "federal restrictions" but a police officer can carry his gun anywhere in NYS.

I was told during a training day at work that unless it is for official duty you can not carry a firearm in a post office or within 1000 feet of a school.

[lad12derff 283]

Yes I thought they were private property. I imagine Lucas Oil Stadium where the colts play is private property too. However, the article says the bill will allows guns to be brought into the stadium.

Can you say sensationalism. That is what the article is providing. The media wants all the gun haters to be up in arms ( no pun intended ) and cry about this law. I am sure the Colts are not going to allow guns inside unless your a cop. It is also foolish for any stadium or private facility to stop off duty cops from carrying inside. I would want more help if things went bad at an event and cops were in attendance.

[PFDRes47cue 653]

Can you say sensationalism. That is what the article is providing. The media wants all the gun haters to be up in arms ( no pun intended ) and cry about this law. I am sure the Colts are not going to allow guns inside unless your a cop. It is also foolish for any stadium or private facility to stop off duty cops from carrying inside. I would want more help if things went bad at an event and cops were in attendance.

I don't know if that is so true... The article does ay that the Colts owner is concerned. I'm sure if the "common folk" was not going to be allowed to bring a firearm into the stadium he would not say he is concerned about it happening. I guess we will just have to see what happens.

And yes, I agree that off duty cops should be able to bring there weapon with them. Thats because I along with most people probably trust off duty cops carrying a firearm more than the average drinking Joe.

[antiquefirelt 994]

I'd be surprised if a law such as that proposed would allow a privately owned public access property such as a stadium, deny entry to persons legally carrying. This can be viewed as either allowing persons with guns to enter or not allowing owners to deny entry to a person legally exercising their right to carry. Not that this isn't fraught with troubles, given that there are many people who have yet to break the law that are carrying. But the whole issue can be a matter of prospective: are we allowing them entry or protecting their right to entry?

[helicopper 1,050]

<BR>I was told during a training day at work that unless it is for official duty you can not carry a firearm in a post office or within 1000 feet of a school.<BR>

<BR><BR>I've heard people saying that too but there's nothing in the law that says that about schools. See below for exemptions for police and peace officers and school buildings (there's nothing at all about 1000 feet and weapons - just drugs).<BR><BR>

<B>S 265.20 Exemptions.<BR></B> <B>a. Sections 265.01, 265.02, 265.03, 265.04, 265.05, 265.10, 265.11,<BR>265.12, 265.13, 265.15 and 270.05 shall not apply to:<BR></B> 1. Possession of any of the weapons, instruments, appliances or<BR>substances specified in sections 265.01, 265.02, 265.03, 265.04, 265.05<BR>and 270.05 by the following:<BR> (a) Persons in the military service of the state of New York when duly<BR>authorized by regulations issued by the adjutant general to possess the<BR>same.<BR><B>(<IMG class=bbc_emoticon alt= src="http://www.emtbravo.net/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.gif"> Police officers as defined in subdivision thirty-four of section<BR>1.20 of the criminal procedure law.<BR> © Peace officers as defined by section 2.10 of the criminal<BR>procedure law.<BR></B> (d) Persons in the military or other service of the United States, in<BR>pursuit of official duty or when duly authorized by federal law,<BR>regulation or order to possess the same.<BR> (e) Persons employed in fulfilling defense contracts with the<BR>government of the United States or agencies thereof when possession of<BR>the same is necessary for manufacture, transport, installation and<BR>testing under the requirements of such contract.<BR>

<BR><BR>The federal statute that would apply to Post Offices is not as clear but there is still an exception for law enforcement. The exception may only be for on-duty police officers but that is subject to interpretation.<BR><BR>

18 USC 930 <BR>(a) Except as provided in subsection (d), whoever knowingly<BR>possesses or causes to be present a firearm or other dangerous<BR>weapon in a Federal facility </B>(other than a Federal court facility),<BR>or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned<BR>not more than 1 year, or both.<BR>(<IMG class=bbc_emoticon alt= src="http://www.emtbravo.net/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.gif"> Whoever, with intent that a firearm or other dangerous weapon<BR>be used in the commission of a crime, knowingly possesses or causes<BR>to be present such firearm or dangerous weapon in a Federal<BR>facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or<BR>imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both.<BR>© A person who kills any person in the course of a violation of<BR>subsection (a) or (<IMG class=bbc_emoticon alt= src="http://www.emtbravo.net/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.gif">, or in the course of an attack on a Federal<BR>facility involving the use of a firearm or other dangerous weapon,<BR>or attempts or conspires to do such an act, shall be punished as<BR>provided in sections 1111, 1112, 1113, and 1117.<BR><B>(d) Subsection (a) shall not apply to -<BR>(1) the lawful performance of official duties by an officer,<BR>agent, or employee of the United States, a State, or a political<BR>subdivision thereof, who is authorized by law to engage in or<BR>supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or<BR>prosecution of any violation of law;<BR>(2) the possession of a firearm or other dangerous weapon by a<BR>Federal official or a member of the Armed Forces if such<BR>possession is authorized by law; or<BR>(3) the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons<BR>in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful<BR>purposes.<BR></B>(e)(1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), whoever knowingly<BR>possesses or causes to be present a firearm in a Federal court<BR>facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title,<BR>imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both.<BR>(2) Paragraph (1) shall not apply to conduct which is described<BR>in paragraph (1) or (2) of subsection (d).<BR>(f) Nothing in this section limits the power of a court of the<BR>United States to punish for contempt or to promulgate rules or<BR>orders regulating, restricting, or prohibiting the possession of<BR>weapons within any building housing such court or any of its<BR>proceedings, or upon any grounds appurtenant to such building.<BR>(g) As used in this section:<BR>(1) The term "Federal facility" means a building or part<BR>thereof owned or leased by the Federal Government, where Federal<BR>employees are regularly present for the purpose of performing<BR>their official duties.<BR>(2) The term "dangerous weapon" means a weapon, device,<BR>instrument, material, or substance, animate or inanimate, that is<BR>used for, or is readily capable of, causing death or serious<BR>bodily injury, except that such term does not include a pocket<BR>knife with a blade of less than 2 1/2 inches in length.<BR>(3) The term "Federal court facility" means the courtroom,<BR>judges' chambers, witness rooms, jury deliberation rooms,<BR>attorney conference rooms, prisoner holding cells, offices of the<BR>court clerks, the United States attorney, and the United States<BR>marshal, probation and parole offices, and adjoining corridors of<BR>any court of the United States.<BR>(h) Notice of the provisions of subsections (a) and (<IMG class=bbc_emoticon alt= src="http://www.emtbravo.net/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.gif"> shall be<BR>posted conspicuously at each public entrance to each Federal<BR>facility, and notice of subsection (e) shall be posted<BR>conspicuously at each public entrance to each Federal court<BR>facility, and no person shall be convicted of an offense under<BR>subsection (a) or (e) with respect to a Federal facility if such<BR>notice is not so posted at such facility, unless such person had<BR>actual notice of subsection (a) or (e), as the case may be.

[helicopper 1,050]

It has been a stipulation on every permit I have ever had that being under the influence nullifies the permit, thus making it illegal to have the concealed weapon.

I think that's an administrative issue - there's no Penal Law charge for me to arrest you for but the issuing authority can revoke your permit after a civil proceeding if you violate a provision for its issuance. INIT, that sound right to you?

[DMA327 12]

It would seem to me this law would deter violence because possible perpetrators would be more scared to be shot by an innocent bystander or civilian who'd be carrying but unbeknown to the perp?

Anyone in law inforcement have comments???

[PFDRes47cue 653]

It would seem to me this law would deter violence because possible perpetrators would be more scared to be shot by an innocent bystander or civilian who'd be carrying but unbeknown to the perp?

Anyone in law inforcement have comments???

What makes you think the perp is not also carrying? Another view would be that it would motivate acts of violence and perps because they might think, "Might as well do such and such, if it gets out of control I have a gun."

Edited February 19, 2011 by PFDRes47cue

[x635 4,066]

What happens when this gun gets to a persons home? Are they going to secure it properly? What happens if they have kids? If they secure it properly, will they be able to get it out by the time it is needed?

If they leave it in their car to run in to a Quickie Mart that sells alchohol, what if the car is broken into?

In large crowds, how are they going to secure their weapon?

Are these people trained to use a firearm in an active shooter situation? How are they going to react to stress? Can they ensure they won't hit innocent civilians? If multiple people pull out guns in a large scale enviroment, how will they identify who is the real shooter? Isn't that what we have police for?

When a police officer fires his weapon, it often costs millions. How will these civilians protect themselves both legally and in a civil case?

ABC did a great special on this. If you have a few minutes, watch this:

http://abcnews.go.com/video/playerIndex?id=7312540

And are we still worried about the British invading? And when the Constitution was written, did the authors ever imagine automatic weapons? Or were they just thinking about muskets?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

Legislators should worry more about funding more police officers and more investigators to deal with these types of situations, get guns off the street, and tracking the guns that are out there and who's hands they are in.

[helicopper 1,050]

It would seem to me this law would deter violence because possible perpetrators would be more scared to be shot by an innocent bystander or civilian who'd be carrying but unbeknown to the perp?

Anyone in law inforcement have comments???

I think this has been looked at and there is no corollary between crime prevention/deterrence and permitted weapons.

Try checking the DOJ website for reports on the subject, I'm pretty sure they've done them.