International Flight(s) From the Westchester County Airport

[firedude 985]

This would be great for the local economy.

JetBlue Airways President and CEO David Barger says he'd like eventually to see seasonal flights from Westchester directly to international destinations, places such as the Caribbean and Mexico

"There are a lot of people that have time shares down in Aruba," Barger said Thursday in an interview with The Journal News at Westchester County Airport.

Full Article

Edited September 4, 2010 by firedude

[aviator70 16]

This would be great for the local economy.

Full Article

Yeah, the problem is they have this stupid slot system at the airport to appease all the people who built mansions overlooking the airport who complain about noise. Gotta lov eit, build a mansion near an airport or within 20 miles of an airport's flight path and then complain about noise.

[MoFire390 118]

Yeah, the problem is they have this stupid slot system at the airport to appease all the people who built mansions overlooking the airport who complain about noise. Gotta lov eit, build a mansion near an airport or within 20 miles of an airport's flight path and then complain about noise.

....maybe they should issue ear muffs to those residents

[ex-commish 490]

First I would like to see Jet Blue go to Vegas non-stop

[MoFire390 118]

First I would like to see Jet Blue go to Vegas non-stop

agreed!!!!

[dmc2007 17]

Yeah, the problem is they have this stupid slot system at the airport to appease all the people who built mansions overlooking the airport who complain about noise. Gotta lov eit, build a mansion near an airport or within 20 miles of an airport's flight path and then complain about noise.

The other issue is the lack of Customs facilities. While some of the FBO's (fixed base operators-essentially the various hangers that cater to business and general aviation) are set up to handle international arrivals, the main commercial terminal is not. It is highly doubtful that the NIMBY's in the area would allow the renovations to allow for such facilities.

There is a way around this issue, which would be pre-clearance of flights. CBP has officers in Bermuda, the Bahamas, and Aruba (as well as Ireland and Canada) that clear passengers on the ground before the plane departs, allowing the flight to arrive the same way a domestic one would. While it would make flights from those countries feasible, flights from Mexico and the other non-US controlled Caribbean islands would be nearly impossible.

[wraftery 1,275]

Yeah, the problem is they have this stupid slot system at the airport to appease all the people who built mansions overlooking the airport who complain about noise. Gotta lov eit, build a mansion near an airport or within 20 miles of an airport's flight path and then complain about noise.

Same ones that say "I flew right into Westchester...five minutes from home, no traffic, easy check-in, etc."

[helicopper 1,050]

First I would like to see Jet Blue go to Vegas non-stop

According to JetBlue they can't do HPN to Vegas because of the runway length and fuel requirement. If we can get the airport to extend the runway out over 684 we may have a chance!

[RescueKujo 130]

Yeah, the problem is they have this stupid slot system at the airport to appease all the people who built mansions overlooking the airport who complain about noise. Gotta lov eit, build a mansion near an airport or within 20 miles of an airport's flight path and then complain about noise.

That is like here in San Diego. Airport has been there since about 1930 (the airport is on the land Lindbergh first tested The Spirit of St Louis), and back in the 70s folks to the west filed lawsuits. The airport authority settled, retrofitting many homes with better windows that blocked out sound, and soundproofed the homes. The folks living there still complain, and most of those have bought their homes in the last 30 years...You would think as busy as Lindbergh Field (San Diego International) is that jets would have flown over as they were looking at the home...

[PCFD ENG58 1,085]

According to JetBlue they can't do HPN to Vegas because of the runway length and fuel requirement. If we can get the airport to extend the runway out over 684 we may have a chance!

Why not use 684?. oh thats right the planes whon't get up to enough speed to use it!

[firedude 985]

According to JetBlue they can't do HPN to Vegas because of the runway length and fuel requirement. If we can get the airport to extend the runway out over 684 we may have a chance!

Well, I do not think that is the problem. The Embraer E190 would not make it but the Airbus A320 has a 3,000nm range with full fuel. While it may take up almost all of HPN's 6500ft runway to take off, I think there would have to be major weight restrictions. Meaning that they would only be able to haul 100 people, in a 150 passenger jet. I think we are more likely to see American Airlines to Miami, before we see jetBlue to Vegas. As far as international flights, I would love to see direct flights to the Caribbean but they would have to clear Customs and their origin city. I am also waiting to see what the Continental and United merge means for Westchester. Continental pulled out of HPN a couple of years ago, while united goes direct from HPN to D.C. and Chicago. Any other cities you would like to see service to?

[Bnechis 3,961]

According to JetBlue they can't do HPN to Vegas because of the runway length and fuel requirement. If we can get the airport to extend the runway out over 684 we may have a chance!

Its Vegas baby...take a chance. 50/50 you can get off the ground before 684. Thats better odds than you get in vegas.

[helicopper 1,050]

Well, I do not think that is the problem. The Embraer E190 would not make it but the Airbus A320 has a 3,000nm range with full fuel. While it may take up almost all of HPN's 6500ft runway to take off, I think there would have to be major weight restrictions. Meaning that they would only be able to haul 100 people, in a 150 passenger jet. I think we are more likely to see American Airlines to Miami, before we see jetBlue to Vegas. As far as international flights, I would love to see direct flights to the Caribbean but they would have to clear Customs and their origin city. I am also waiting to see what the Continental and United merge means for Westchester. Continental pulled out of HPN a couple of years ago, while united goes direct from HPN to D.C. and Chicago. Any other cities you would like to see service to?

Boy I'm glad you're not a flight planner for an airline!! Sure the A320 can make it there with full fuel but as you point out, they can't carry a full passenger load. That makes it a losing proposition because every flight out of JFK to LAS is full. There are also margins built in for safety that consider the weather, passenger/baggage weights, and such.

According to JetBlue, it simply won't work at Westchester.

[LTNRFD 266]

According to JetBlue they can't do HPN to Vegas because of the runway length and fuel requirement. If we can get the airport to extend the runway out over 684 we may have a chance!

I would think that to extend the runway out over 684 they would have to trim off some of the hill that is across the lake. Maybe they could make the extension like a parking deck and slope it upwards so the planes can clear the hill. That way they could leave the hill intact and keep the tree huggers happy.

[wraftery 1,275]

I am sure that, like me, many of you have taken courses at the airport. It's really pretty quiet. Even New Rochelle in LGA's flight path has more noise. I'm in VA now. If you want jet noise, come on down and hear those USN F-18's practice touch-n-go's.

[dadbo46 50]

I would think that to extend the runway out over 684 they would have to trim off some of the hill that is across the lake. Maybe they could make the extension like a parking deck and slope it upwards so the planes can clear the hill. That way they could leave the hill intact and keep the tree huggers happy.

Yea.....but then you have the water issue. Rye Lake is part of the Kensico Resevoir which handles most of NYC's drinking water. The water huggers (fish ?) would not be happy.....and rightfully so.

[helicopper 1,050]

I would think that to extend the runway out over 684 they would have to trim off some of the hill that is across the lake. Maybe they could make the extension like a parking deck and slope it upwards so the planes can clear the hill. That way they could leave the hill intact and keep the tree huggers happy.

That's a great idea. Like the really old aircraft carriers with a ski jump like ramp at the end. A runway bridge right over 120 and 684 and we're in business. Then we can start bringing the big boy's (737, 757) in for flights. Then Westchester will learn about noise.

Hey, Bill, watch out for the F-18's. They have a special ways of dealing with complaints!

[dwcfireman 656]

That's a great idea. Like the really old aircraft carriers with a ski jump like ramp at the end. A runway bridge right over 120 and 684 and we're in business. Then we can start bringing the big boy's (737, 757) in for flights. Then Westchester will learn about noise.

Hey, Bill, watch out for the F-18's. They have a special ways of dealing with complaints!

HPN can and does land and t/o 737's. It can handle the 757, but the wheel base is too large for most of the taxiways.

As far as the runway extension, it's never gonna happen (sorry guys). There's too much to take into consideration, from federal aviation regulations, security regs, and EPA standards. Never mind that there's just no available space on the airfield (the field is only 730 acres). Although, the deck structure would be kinda cool to see.

International flights can happen. CBP has a unit based at HPN located in the Avitat Hangar. Remember, AirCanada used to fly here.

And for the people who complain about noise....this is one of the quietest airports in the nation. I'm not going to stop you from calling the noise complaint line, but it's an airport!!!!!!! Of course there's going to be noise!

[dmc2007 17]

International flights can happen. CBP has a unit based at HPN located in the Avitat Hangar. Remember, AirCanada used to fly here.

Flights from Canada don't clear customs at any US airport-they are pre-cleared by CBP agents at Canadian airports before take off and then land essentially the same way domestic flights do. As for the Avitat operation, that unit is set up to receive business and general aviation travelers. It is highly doubtful that they could handle 150+ passengers at a time.

[barbosa10 7]

anyone heard of Gibraltar airport?

http://www.slightlywarped.com/crapfactory/curiosities/2009/gibraltarairport.htm

[dwcfireman 656]

<br />Flights from Canada don't clear customs at any US airport-they are pre-cleared by CBP agents at Canadian airports before take off and then land essentially the same way domestic flights do.  As for the Avitat operation, that unit is set up to receive business and general aviation travelers.  It is highly doubtful that they could handle 150+ passengers at a time.  <br /><br /><br />

<br /><br /><br />

Yes, you are correct in the CBP procedures for Canadian flights, and you are also correct in CBP's operation at Avitat. Thankfully, because there already is an office on site, it would take only minor alterations in the CBP's presence at HPN to make "true" international flights possible (ie CBP would have to establish an office and inspection checkpoint in the main terminal, which is currently impossible because simply there is no room).

I actually work in the Airport Operations Department, and I can tell you that there are many changes and projects happening at HPN, all to benefit passengers and to make the airport run more efficiently. Unfortunately, due to many restrictions, it is extremely difficult to accomplish a long term goal with what we have and what's available to us. Some of the smaller goals we're working on involve making more space for passengers and concessions, increasing capacity loads on the airfield, and creating a safer environment on the airline ramp for employees and passengers alike. Small changes like these over time will eventually allow for larger aircraft, faster turn-arounds, and international flights. But, in the mean time, HPN is just a small reliever airport for the NYC airport system.

[MoFire390 118]

HPN can and does land and t/o 737's. It can handle the 757, but the wheel base is too large for most of the taxiways.

As far as the runway extension, it's never gonna happen (sorry guys). There's too much to take into consideration, from federal aviation regulations, security regs, and EPA standards. Never mind that there's just no available space on the airfield (the field is only 730 acres). Although, the deck structure would be kinda cool to see.

International flights can happen. CBP has a unit based at HPN located in the Avitat Hangar. Remember, AirCanada used to fly here.

And for the people who complain about noise....this is one of the quietest airports in the nation. I'm not going to stop you from calling the noise complaint line, but it's an airport!!!!!!! Of course there's going to be noise!

but i want it to happen!!! why do we need AirCanada??? Canada is only a 7 hour drive.

[dmc2007 17]

<br /><br /><br />

Yes, you are correct in the CBP procedures for Canadian flights, and you are also correct in CBP's operation at Avitat. Thankfully, because there already is an office on site, it would take only minor alterations in the CBP's presence at HPN to make "true" international flights possible (ie CBP would have to establish an office and inspection checkpoint in the main terminal, which is currently impossible because simply there is no room).

I actually work in the Airport Operations Department, and I can tell you that there are many changes and projects happening at HPN, all to benefit passengers and to make the airport run more efficiently. Unfortunately, due to many restrictions, it is extremely difficult to accomplish a long term goal with what we have and what's available to us. Some of the smaller goals we're working on involve making more space for passengers and concessions, increasing capacity loads on the airfield, and creating a safer environment on the airline ramp for employees and passengers alike. Small changes like these over time will eventually allow for larger aircraft, faster turn-arounds, and international flights. But, in the mean time, HPN is just a small reliever airport for the NYC airport system.

Thanks for that informative post. It's good to hear that you guys are working to make HPN better, as it could really be invaluable in taking some of the strain off of JFK, LGA, and EWR. I can only imagine how difficult it must be to make anything happen over there.

[Bnechis 3,961]

but i want it to happen!!! why do we need AirCanada??? Canada is only a 7 hour drive.

Never been to Victoria or Vancouver, I see.

[Bnechis 3,961]

I actually work in the Airport Operations Department, and I can tell you that there are many changes and projects happening at HPN, all to benefit passengers and to make the airport run more efficiently.

The 3 critical projects that need to be addressed are:

1) Parking

2) Parking

& 3) Parking

[firedude 985]

Yes, you are correct in the CBP procedures for Canadian flights, and you are also correct in CBP's operation at Avitat. Thankfully, because there already is an office on site, it would take only minor alterations in the CBP's presence at HPN to make "true" international flights possible (ie CBP would have to establish an office and inspection checkpoint in the main terminal, which is currently impossible because simply there is no room).

I actually work in the Airport Operations Department, and I can tell you that there are many changes and projects happening at HPN, all to benefit passengers and to make the airport run more efficiently. Unfortunately, due to many restrictions, it is extremely difficult to accomplish a long term goal with what we have and what's available to us. Some of the smaller goals we're working on involve making more space for passengers and concessions, increasing capacity loads on the airfield, and creating a safer environment on the airline ramp for employees and passengers alike. Small changes like these over time will eventually allow for larger aircraft, faster turn-arounds, and international flights. But, in the mean time, HPN is just a small reliever airport for the NYC airport system.

HPN can and does land and t/o 737's. It can handle the 757, but the wheel base is too large for most of the taxiways.

As far as the runway extension, it's never gonna happen (sorry guys). There's too much to take into consideration, from federal aviation regulations, security regs, and EPA standards. Never mind that there's just no available space on the airfield (the field is only 730 acres). Although, the deck structure would be kinda cool to see.

International flights can happen. CBP has a unit based at HPN located in the Avitat Hangar. Remember, AirCanada used to fly here.

And for the people who complain about noise....this is one of the quietest airports in the nation. I'm not going to stop you from calling the noise complaint line, but it's an airport!!!!!!! Of course there's going to be noise!

I am glad to see that we have a Airport Ops guy on the forum! I am pretty sure a boeing 757 has landed at HPN before but not with any airline. The 757 has a wheelbase of 60ft while the Airbus A320 only has a wheelbase of 41.5ft. I am not sure the exact width of HPN's taxiways, even though I have been on them thousands of times as a pilot. However, the normal taxiway width for this catagory of airport is around 60ft. I am glad to see the terminal becoming more "user-friendly". I also do not understand people who move to area around an aiport and then complain about the noise! I am not sure how many officers work for CBP at Avitat, but I do not see them expanding to the main terminal any time soon.

Edited September 7, 2010 by firedude

[dwcfireman 656]

The 3 critical projects that need to be addressed are:

1) Parking

2) Parking

& 3) Parking

Haha. I hate this issue with a passion. Where parking is limited, there is enough parking to accommodate our passengers. The overflow lot at the north end of the field helps alleviate the problem (and there is a free shuttle from that site which brings passengers to the terminal). It's definitely not the permanent solution. There have been many ideas thrown around about adding a new parking structure or parking alternatives near the airport, but the options are just not viable enough. There's also a lot of pressure from surrounding communities about traffic issues and the construction of said parking structures (unfortunately most of the airport business is politics).

For those who don't know, AirCanada is no longer flying out of HPN. They were not profiting from the flight and pulled out at the beginning of July.

Someone also mentioned a 757 coming into HPN...that was President Bush when he flew in a few years back. The plane barely fit and was only able to use Taxiway A at the north end. Our primary taxiways are 75 ft wide, and most of the secondaries are only 50 ft. Like I said before, HPN is too small to afford the space for 100 ft taxiways like JFK or LGA. Then again, HPN was never intended for large air carrier aircraft, which accounts for the heavy use of business jets and general aviation users. The current design allows for 737s, which we don't see many of. AirTran brings one in every once in a blue moon, but there are a few 737 business jets that regularly use our facility.

[Bnechis 3,961]

Haha. I hate this issue with a passion. Where parking is limited, there is enough parking to accommodate our passengers. The overflow lot at the north end of the field helps alleviate the problem (and there is a free shuttle from that site which brings passengers to the terminal).

Unfortinatly, the county &/or the airport have not told anyone of this. They have told us there is not enough parking so get dropped off/picked up or take mass transit (which is not available from most communities or at 5am to get on the early flights. Are there any signs indicating that overflow is available?

[helicopper 1,050]

Haha. I hate this issue with a passion. Where parking is limited, there is enough parking to accommodate our passengers. The overflow lot at the north end of the field helps alleviate the problem (and there is a free shuttle from that site which brings passengers to the terminal). It's definitely not the permanent solution. There have been many ideas thrown around about adding a new parking structure or parking alternatives near the airport, but the options are just not viable enough. There's also a lot of pressure from surrounding communities about traffic issues and the construction of said parking structures (unfortunately most of the airport business is politics).

Sorry but I have to disagree. There is definitely not enough parking for commercial passengers and there never has been. 15 years ago in the old quonset hut terminal when the only travelers were business folks shuttling back and forth to DC and Chicago there wasn't enough parking and the situation hasn't improved. Parking on the grass, in traffic lanes, or anywhere you can shoe horn a car isn't adequate parking.

The parking structure was designed using the demographics of 15 years ago before AirTran or JetBlue existed let alone operated out of HPN. Politics definitely played a role in all this. The overflow lots do help but the bottom line is the airport has outgrown itself in parking and in the terminal. Watching families of four walk down airport road with all their luggage to the overflow lots out by building 2 or 3 highlights how screwed up the situation is.

The County has always yielded to the political wills of the neighborhood instead of treating the airport as the revenue stream that it is.

[helicopper 1,050]

Unfortinatly, the county &/or the airport have not told anyone of this. They have told us there is not enough parking so get dropped off/picked up or take mass transit (which is not available from most communities or at 5am to get on the early flights. Are there any signs indicating that overflow is available?

Yes. When they close the parking structure they post signs directly you to whichever space is being used for overflow parking. There is also a guard at the entrance who tries to keep people moving.

The best solution is getting dropped off because parking is almost as expensive as the city airports but you're right - that doesn't work well for early AM flights.