The Status Of Hartsdale's Truck Company AKA TL-15

[FDNYBuff97 5]

I believe Fairview's ladder is still being dispatched with hartsdale

It said Mount Vernon on the front of it

[firefighter59 20]

Its the old E-One Mt Vernon ladder 4

[jjpinto 297]

Here is a photo of it the day before it went to Hartsdale

[sfrd18 360]

Joe never ceases to have a picture at the ready. Great job.

[moggie6 54]

I'm sure the tax payers in Hartsdales district are up in arms about it all. Oh wait the probably are letting the commissioners and chief do their jobs.

[Bnechis 3,961]

I'm sure the tax payers in Hartsdales district are up in arms about it all. Oh wait the probably are letting the commissioners and chief do their jobs.

I'm sure the tax payers in Hartsdale and in most districts do not know or care about the FD until they are dialling 911.

Then they pray that the dept is well staffed, well trained, well equiped, and not committed to another incident.

[x635 4,066]

Was MVFD L-4 refurbed recently......it seems to be in great condtion.

[61MACKBR1 222]

The Old FDMV Ladder 4 (formally FDMV Ladder 3) was one of those Mount Vernon FD "War Horses" (similiar to the Old FDMV Snorkel 1 and the Old FDMV 1967 Mack C Box Rescue Truck). Many many fires in Mount Vernon this truck went to.

Yes, it appears to be in great shape, considering how many times this rig was down for repairs in recent years.

I would suspect that the staff up within the Hartsdale FD would have gone thru additional training to run this rig as it is quite different than the ladder trucks that have run up in Hartsdale in years past.

Here is a photo of it the day before it went to Hartsdale

[spike2231 38]

i saw this ladder filling up at the town yard and i thought it was greenvilles L4 it had L 4 on the bucket not sure if it still said mt vernon i will look closer next time

[spike2231 38]

were is TL 15 went out for repairs what seem like yrs ago

[x635 4,066]

TL-15, the 1994 FWD/Baker will never return to service. There are a variety of conflicts between everyone involved, as to who is responsible for what, with a lot of misunderstandings thrown in the mix. This will prevent the truck from being fixed or refurbised.

Mount Vernon Ladder 4 was apparently purchased for a VERY reasonable price, and will be used for the foreseable future. I'm told it's in great condition, and the members of HFD really like it. It fits in Station 2 (West Hartsdale Ave), and will be quartered there. It will assume the "TL-15" designator. Common everyday staffing will remain 1 firefighter, who is also the apparatus operator only.

There is no word whether a new or used TL is being spec'd, or will be purchased.

[x635 4,066]

Some additonal information....Mount Vernon's Tower Ladder is 23 YEARS OLD, and served in Mount Vernon, an inner urban city with a high fire load and crappy streets. It's in great condition for a spare, but to run as a frontline? Personally, the only reason I think it's still alive is because of Mount Vernon FD's ONE talented mechanic who was basically not given the proper resources needed to maintain this truck.

From the photo, it looks great cosmetically, but does it meet the unique needs that TL-15 was desinged for?

Even before this situation, Hatsdale's Tower Ladder 15 was 14 years old, and there had been no prior replacement plans or anticipated,dedicated or allocated savings to replace it.

[x129K 1,393]

For Christ's sake - from what I read on here - beggars can't be choosers! It may be old(ish)...it may be dirty...it may be from MT Vernon...but if it helps out the guys in Hartsdale, so be it...Good for them...and good on MV for loaning it...and of course - excellent for the residents of the township that may need it for rescue!

Borrowed needs, while not unique needs, are better than no needs....aren't they?

How did it work at last night J O B? I imagine well as we have not read anything here about it...

[x635 4,066]

After operating that truck and seeing what it can do at numerous locations in Hartsdale and A LOT of training from numerous guys in the department during our probie period, I really think that TL-15 (the original) is really suited for communities like Hartsdale, which need the ability to push a lot of water into a ground level storefront, or pile elderly residents from the 6th floor of a 7 story wood frame OMD and deliver them to the ground.

Add in the tight streets and outrigger spread (not that the E-One doesn't have a great jacking system), and the ability to push through a parapet or similar obstacle, I think it is a solution made for Hartsdale. And have also been told that by members and officers of Hartsdale,.

I'm just suprised this is acceptable to the Union, FDNY has that 10 year rule in place for a reason...I understand FDNY is different with the demands placed on their apparatus, but a 23 year old Aerial Truck for the foreseable future for Hartsdale is acceptable to them? I do acknowledge that TL-15 spent many weeks and months at a time out of service, because of the ORIGINAL manufacturer, BAKER, built it horribly and Hartsdale did not make sure it was getting service by trained Aerialscope people and Aerialscope parts for it's life. Aerialscope nowadays is a MUCH better quality product and has basically been internally reinvented, and over 40 years of use and still more orders by FDNY prove why it's still the best.

Examples (memories) shown below:

[firedude 985]

Can someone explain to me why MVFD L4 is designated as a "ladder" and not a "tower ladder". Looks like a TL to me.

[x129K 1,393]

Looks like a ladder tower to me....

[Bnechis 3,961]

I really think that TL-15 (the original) is really suited for communities like Hartsdale, which need the ability to push a lot of water into a ground level storefront, or pile elderly residents from the 6th floor of a 7 story wood frame OMD and deliver them to the ground.

1) Any apparatus that the manufacturer states requires a minimum of 3 fireifghters to operate (1 at the turntable when personel are in the bucket and 2 in the bucket if in smoke), and the dept. that purchase it only has 1 firefighter assigned is not really "suited" for that dept.

2)How is a 75' ariel ideal in a community that has a large number of 7 story buildings? Wouldn't a 100' footer make more sense?

[x635 4,066]

1) Any apparatus that the manufacturer states requires a minimum of 3 fireifghters to operate (1 at the turntable when personel are in the bucket and 2 in the bucket if in smoke), and the dept. that purchase it only has 1 firefighter assigned is not really "suited" for that dept.

2)How is a 75' ariel ideal in a community that has a large number of 7 story buildings? Wouldn't a 100' footer make more sense?

TL-15 was a 95' Baker Aerialscope.

I agree completly with you about the staffing. But with Hartsdale's staffing, no apparatus would be suited for it. The plan, or the best I can explain it at the time I left in 2008, is that manpower would come from Engine 170 (like it does on mutual aid),or Engine 169 depending on the situation and what is primarily needed at the scene. By generally that time, Fairview or Greenville would be there and take on whatever was needed. But Hartsdale can't afford and doesn't value manpower or place emphasis on it. They would rather pay a fully qualified interior firefighter on overtime to dispatch/keep records at the firehouse then let 60 Control dispatch for free and put another firefighter on the truck instead of the desk.

I also must add the truck can be set up and ready to go with one person in 2 minutes or less. Trust me, we were tested on it!

Also, a question. Can Hartsdale FD "add on" to an FDNY order, like a lot of departments did ways back? (that's if they can afford it)

[DR104 141]

I'm sure the tax payers in Hartsdale and in most districts do not know or care about the FD until they are dialling 911.

Then they pray that the dept is well staffed, well trained, well equiped, and not committed to another incident.

And as long the money isnt coming out of their wallets!!!! When The City of White Plains were laying off Fifefighter & Cops not one phone rang at city hall,BUT when the city tried to stop loose leaf crub side pick up, meaning that all the landscapers would have to bag leaf or take them away and charge more money, The phone calls at city hall didnt stop!!!! The city gave in and they continued the loose leaf pick ups

[x635 4,066]

And as long the money isnt coming out of their wallets!!!! When The City of White Plains were laying off Fifefighter & Cops not one phone rang at city hall,BUT when the city tried to stop loose leaf crub side pick up, meaning that all the landscapers would have to bag leaf or take them away and charge more money, The phone calls at city hall didnt stop!!!! The city gave in and they continued the loose leaf pick ups

Fire Department's spend a lot of time at grade schools doing fire prevention and education.

Maybe, if we tried different methods with the publc, they'd have a better understanding of what we do and what we need. Give great customer service and the Community will give back. They don't know what the FD or PD needs and why.

As far as the leaf piles, they are very visible everyday. They also create a traffic hazard, especially when it snows. We work with the DPW guys who are also essential to the City's operations and infastructure.

I'm sure if ads were taken out explaining the situation of Police Officers and Firefighters being laid off and why people can lose property or worse, lives. They can also explain the millions of dollars of givebacks that the city gave developers of all these projects and delayed tax payments, when these developers would have built regardless but they know how to play the situation. And White Plains has always tried to go the cheapest possible route with the FD for as long as I can remember.

But back to the Hartsdale Tower Ladder 15 topic.

[IzzyEng4 427]

Can someone explain to me why MVFD L4 is designated as a "ladder" and not a "tower ladder". Looks like a TL to me.

More than likely the original was an aerial ladder truck and when they purchased the TL, they didn't feel like changing the designation maybe?