Rant

[Guest]

In my quest to become a member of a department I have come across a question I would like to ask you all to answer what the hell is wrong with these departments,volunteer process, and qualification. Half of the departments of which I emailed to ask if I was eligible to join didn't get back to me, the other half said because I didn't live in their district or next to their district I was ineligible to join even tho I can drive to the stations with in 10 mins and hear (HEAR) the other departments alarm. That department is about 5mins away. Are you kidding me? I was told by a lieutenant7 months ago I was eligible to join this one department but I never did because of personal reasons and then I email them and now I can't because I don't live close enough? Keep in mind all of these departments had signs up saying " Volunteer now, help your community" Well its given I may not live in their communities but I spend enough time going to college and shopping there. It's apparent the residents don't want to do it so why turn me away? One departments website even says that a decline of member in their department and surrounding departments has put a strain on them. I didn't try to join that department it self but its the surrounding ones I did. Last note the fire chief of a local volunteer department I tried to join never got notified back was talking to the news and said I quote " We had trouble getting man power to the scene to put out the fire seeing how its labor day weekend and no one was at the fire house" A department that is 15 or more minutes away depending on heavy traffic had to respond for mutual aid. The house of which was a two family dwelling was a total lose. And departments have the nerve to say they don't have the man power or need more volunteers and turn people away. Come on.

[fireguy43 35]

Rant is about the most appropriate name for this thread you could think of.....

[sfrd18 360]

In my quest to become a member of a department I have come across a question I would like to ask you all to answer what the hell is wrong with these departments,volunteer process, and qualification. Half of the departments of which I emailed to ask if I was eligible to join didn't get back to me, the other half said because I didn't live in their district or next to their district I was ineligible to join even tho I can drive to the stations with in 10 mins and hear (HEAR) the other departments alarm. That department is about 5mins away. Are you kidding me? I was told by a lieutenant7 months ago I was eligible to join this one department but I never did because of personal reasons and then I email them and now I can't because I don't live close enough? Keep in mind all of these departments had signs up saying " Volunteer now, help your community" Well its given I may not live in their communities but I spend enough time going to college and shopping there. It's apparent the residents don't want to do it so why turn me away? One departments website even says that a decline of member in their department and surrounding departments has put a strain on them. I didn't try to join that department it self but its the surrounding ones I did. Last note the fire chief of a local volunteer department I tried to join never got notified back was talking to the news and said I quote " We had trouble getting man power to the scene to put out the fire seeing how its labor day weekend and no one was at the fire house" A department that is 15 or more minutes away depending on heavy traffic had to respond for mutual aid. The house of which was a two family dwelling was a total lose. And departments have the nerve to say they don't have the man power or need more volunteers and turn people away. Come on.

That is exactly what's happening to me!!! My town has three volunteer fire departments, each in their own district. The fire department that I live closest to I am reluctant to join for personal reasons. I was considering joining another volunteer fire department across town in another district, but only five minutes away. All I'd have to do to get to one of that department's fire stations would be to hop on the highway a few miles, get off, and I'd literally be right there! Plus, two of my friends are volunteers there and I know a fire marshal who put in a good recommendation for me to their assistant chief, and explained my reasons for wanting to join there, however, there wasn't much the assistant chief could do, since he was not on the hiring committee/board of directors. However, when I talked to a captain at that department, he said that I'd have to join the department in my district, even though it's only a two minute difference in arrival time between the two departments, which is still a pretty quick response time. He even said that someone from another town could join that department. What makes no sense at all is that not only can I not join a department in my town that is only a few minutes out of my district, and the department I prefer to join is ALWAYS looking for volunteers, that same department would let a friend of mine join who lived in another town, almost 20 MINUTES AWAY!!! Now, how do they expect to get someone in that position to respond to fires if that person takes almost 20 minutes to get to one of their fire stations?

I have been into firefighting a long time, I know quite a few contacts in the fire service in high positions, and I know the job and what I'm doing practically inside and out, even more that most guys on the job today. In my opinion, it's not right, but unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be anything that I can do about it, other than to put in an application to that department, as well as the one in my district, and just see what happens. That is what a friend of mine, who is a paid firefighter, and the assistant chief of that department suggested. If anyone has any suggestions for me as well as to what else to do, I would gladly appreciate it.

[JBE 328]

Can you volunteer in the town in which you live in?? Why not try that??

[bigrig77 95]

Right... OK so why are you not volunteering in your town? Maybe you should move if you want to volunteer in one of these communities. It is also a pointless rant and really people have bigger issues on this site then some kid who cant get in a volly department. Make the step up to the paid department.

[kfire94 3]

In squad we trust I think you should get off the computer and go down to the fd's you want too join. You said you emailed this one and emailed that one. If you can't take some time out of your day to go down and see them in person then your not going to have time too be a member. Find out when their work detail or training nights are and talk too the members about joining. It shows that your willing to give up your time. Hint there's alot more then going too calls to being a firefighter. So your got to give up alot of your time.

Sfrd If your really interested in being a firefigher whether paid or volly. You need to change your attitude!! Your profile says your 14-17 years old so i'm going to call you kid because that is what you are. So kid thinking you know more then most people on the job is a bad attitude and going to get you nowhere real quick. In a volly dept. you will be outcasted and not like it there and paid they will eat you up an spit you out. So start over and go in like your some kid looking at being a firefigher and stand there keeping your mouth shut and your ears open. Good luck to both of you! and remember never stop training and never stop learning.

[IzzyEng4 427]

How about just going over to the VFC / VFD, fill out an application, pay the fee and go through the background check.

Could there be a problem with your background check that might find you unfavorable? (I am not making any accusations about you.)

Could a particular VFD might have a full active roster?

Could it be that since you live out of town for some of these departments that they rather accept someone from who lived in the district first?

Instead of coming here and rant about ________ Fire Department, how about taking a more proactive approach and actually apply to the department in person?

Just trying to throw out some questions for you just to widen the spectrum.

[Alpinerunner 61]

Show up during drill night. Due to the iffy office/internal communications in most volly departments, emails and phone calls don't work. You need to show up during drill and ask for an application and talk to their service board / recruiting department.

[crk830 8]

That is exactly what's happening to me!!! My town has three volunteer fire departments, each in their own district. The fire department that I live closest to I am reluctant to join for personal reasons.

I have been into firefighting a long time, I know quite a few contacts in the fire service in high positions, and I know the job and what I'm doing practically inside and out, even more that most guys on the job today. In my opinion, it's not right, but unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be anything that I can do about it, other than to put in an application to that department, as well as the one in my district, and just see what happens.

This isn't a good way to win many friends here on this board or in any Department. As for your town and the three departments I know many people on all three of them and you must have pissed off more than a few people to get "black balled". It has been said many times here at your age it is best to just shut up and learn take in everything you can even if you think you may know more than they do. How do you "know the job" if you aren't on a department? Watching TV shows doesn't count

[Guest]

Right... OK so why are you not volunteering in your town? Maybe you should move if you want to volunteer in one of these communities. It is also a pointless rant and really people have bigger issues on this site then some kid who cant get in a volly department. Make the step up to the paid department.

The point is the fact that the departments say on websites and make banners saying " Join now" "Help Needed" Oh and don't forget this slogan " what if you called and no one showed up?" and they won't let me join because I don't live in their district. Apparently the people that live there don't want to join. And the response time and care suffers. I cant volunteer in my town seeing how I live in a city with paid firefighters.

Edited July 14, 2010 by InSquadWeTrust

[FirefighterJr 2]

That is exactly what's happening to me!!! My town has three volunteer fire departments, each in their own district. The fire department that I live closest to I am reluctant to join for personal reasons. I was considering joining another volunteer fire department across town in another district, but only five minutes away. All I'd have to do to get to one of that department's fire stations would be to hop on the highway a few miles, get off, and I'd literally be right there! Plus, two of my friends are volunteers there and I know a fire marshal who put in a good recommendation for me to their assistant chief, and explained my reasons for wanting to join there, however, there wasn't much the assistant chief could do, since he was not on the hiring committee/board of directors. However, when I talked to a captain at that department, he said that I'd have to join the department in my district, even though it's only a two minute difference in arrival time between the two departments, which is still a pretty quick response time. He even said that someone from another town could join that department. What makes no sense at all is that not only can I not join a department in my town that is only a few minutes out of my district, and the department I prefer to join is ALWAYS looking for volunteers, that same department would let a friend of mine join who lived in another town, almost 20 MINUTES AWAY!!! Now, how do they expect to get someone in that position to respond to fires if that person takes almost 20 minutes to get to one of their fire stations?

I have been into firefighting a long time, I know quite a few contacts in the fire service in high positions, and I know the job and what I'm doing practically inside and out, even more that most guys on the job today. In my opinion, it's not right, but unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be anything that I can do about it, other than to put in an application to that department, as well as the one in my district, and just see what happens. That is what a friend of mine, who is a paid firefighter, and the assistant chief of that department suggested. If anyone has any suggestions for me as well as to what else to do, I would gladly appreciate it.

Bro, your in the 14-17 age how can you know what your doing inside and out when you still not even allowed to go into a building...and how the hell do you know more then most guys on the job...these guys went through a rigorous academy and train on a day to day bases...I would love you be there when you "show" these guys up...I am the captain at my post and got the position after taking a test...and I still don't know jack about what being a real FF is, I never been inside a fire.

Just my two cents...good luck though

[210 91]

That is exactly what's happening to me!!! My town has three volunteer fire departments, each in their own district. The fire department that I live closest to I am reluctant to join for personal reasons. I was considering joining another volunteer fire department across town in another district, but only five minutes away. All I'd have to do to get to one of that department's fire stations would be to hop on the highway a few miles, get off, and I'd literally be right there! Plus, two of my friends are volunteers there and I know a fire marshal who put in a good recommendation for me to their assistant chief, and explained my reasons for wanting to join there, however, there wasn't much the assistant chief could do, since he was not on the hiring committee/board of directors. However, when I talked to a captain at that department, he said that I'd have to join the department in my district, even though it's only a two minute difference in arrival time between the two departments, which is still a pretty quick response time. He even said that someone from another town could join that department. What makes no sense at all is that not only can I not join a department in my town that is only a few minutes out of my district, and the department I prefer to join is ALWAYS looking for volunteers, that same department would let a friend of mine join who lived in another town, almost 20 MINUTES AWAY!!! Now, how do they expect to get someone in that position to respond to fires if that person takes almost 20 minutes to get to one of their fire stations?

I have been into firefighting a long time, I know quite a few contacts in the fire service in high positions, and I know the job and what I'm doing practically inside and out, even more that most guys on the job today. In my opinion, it's not right, but unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be anything that I can do about it, other than to put in an application to that department, as well as the one in my district, and just see what happens. That is what a friend of mine, who is a paid firefighter, and the assistant chief of that department suggested. If anyone has any suggestions for me as well as to what else to do, I would gladly appreciate it.

14-17?

[Guest]

I've had similar experiences. Since then I've given up trying to join altogether.

[x129K 1,393]

14-17?

LOL....a true salty dawg...

[Ex-2114 7]

To qualify for the position of volunteer firefighter, an individual must:

Meet residence requirements, if they exist.

Meet the active membership requirements or bylaws of the entity or organization.

Successfully complete required probation or training needs.

Google got me here: http://www.dos.state.ny.us/fire/firehowto.html

ALSO.....

3. Any person elected to membership as a volunteer member of a fire

company shall be a resident of the fire district or of territory outside

the fire district which is afforded fire protection by the fire

department of the fire district, or any fire company thereof, pursuant

to a contract for fire protection, except as otherwise provided in

subdivision six.

4. The membership of a volunteer member of a fire company shall

terminate when he ceases to be a resident of the fire district or of any

territory outside the fire district which is afforded fire protection by

the fire department of the fire district, or any fire company thereof,

pursuant to a contract for fire protection, except as otherwise provided

in subdivision five.

This is here: http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/nycode/TWN/11/176-b

[nycemt728 49]

Wow, I love how everyone dismisses a younger member's claims. Like not one of the veteran guys have seen an organization acting like a current members only club? Come on. Personally, I have witnessed and or heard of this happening often and regardless of the original poster's issues, it needs to stop. In a time where work weeks are increasing in hours and jobs are harder to find, volunteers are harder and harder to come by. Every organization that even thinks of asking for someone to sacrifice their time should be doing everything they can to allow volunteers to give their time, not throw up antiquated and prideful barriers. I understand response times, but if a member can get there in a good time, who cares wheres he's coming from?? If my organization relied on members who lived in there area, guess what we would have three members, all the rest come from outside the area, and some from signifigant distances. If companies are worried about response times, make members coming from a longer distance stand full tours in house so their response time won't be an issue, and as a matter of fact the response time of the company would be better b/c there's memebers at the house. Everyone always complains about volunteers killing xyz service...how about current administrations????

[crk830 8]

Wow, I love how everyone dismisses a younger member's claims. Like not one of the veteran guys have seen an organization acting like a current members only club? Come on. Personally, I have witnessed and or heard of this happening often and regardless of the original poster's issues, it needs to stop. In a time where work weeks are increasing in hours and jobs are harder to find, volunteers are harder and harder to come by. Every organization that even thinks of asking for someone to sacrifice their time should be doing everything they can to allow volunteers to give their time, not throw up antiquated and prideful barriers. I understand response times, but if a member can get there in a good time, who cares wheres he's coming from?? If my organization relied on members who lived in there area, guess what we would have three members, all the rest come from outside the area, and some from signifigant distances. If companies are worried about response times, make members coming from a longer distance stand full tours in house so their response time won't be an issue, and as a matter of fact the response time of the company would be better b/c there's memebers at the house. Everyone always complains about volunteers killing xyz service...how about current administrations????

I believe most of the replies were about his know it all attitude and I know more than you do. He set the tone for this discussion and now has to face the criticism. As for the residence issues,each company has it own policies. I believe he is talking about Darien Ct and knowing members in all three of there departments I know first hand they all have some what liberal policies. It sounds as if he made his bed and now has to sleep in it by pissing people in those departments.

[sfrd18 360]

Sorry guys. I don't mean to sound like a know-it-all and I'm really not like that. I was just on a rant and getting a little carried away with myself. It's true I have said some controversial things, and I'm sorry for that. I think I got a little carried away with what I said about knowing more than most guys on the job and I apologize. Also, I do plan to keep my mouth shut and my ears open when I join any department, whether it be paid or career, and whether I know what I'm talking about and/or doing or not. Even when you think you know something, even inside and out, there's always something you might have forgotten or something new to learn. Sorry about that once again guys and it won't happen again.

[EMSer 15]

Get rid of the Vollie systems all together...EMS should be run by hospitals and FD/PD's should be run by the municipalities - whether local, county or state is another topic though.

I am a vollie and i can't stand vollies or the vollie system, it only exists to fail, not to mention vollies are NOT true volunteers anymore - they are PAID labor. They get paid with little pensions, stipens and beer. Not to mention they're fat and out of shape drunks. it's very sad to see what a good concept of Americana has become. I am a Vollie that is 100% pro Paid guys - they really are simply put - BETTER.

Edited July 14, 2010 by EMSer

[FFEMTPD72 2]

Get rid of the Vollie systems all together...EMS should be run by hospitals and FD/PD's should be run by the municipalities - whether local, county or state is another topic though.

I am a vollie and i can't stand vollies or the vollie system, it only exists to fail, not to mention vollies are NOT true volunteers anymore - they are PAID labor. They get paid with little pensions, stipens and beer. Not to mention they're fat and out of shape drunks. it's very sad to see what a good concept of Americana has become. I am a Vollie that is 100% pro Paid guys - they really are simply put - BETTER.

While I slightly agree, where will the funds come from? Volunteer districts save millions of dollars.

However, when I see departments on Long Island with bowling alleys, 20 LCD flat panel TV's and tiki bars in their stations...

[EMSer 15]

While I slightly agree, where will the funds come from? Volunteer districts save millions of dollars.

However, when I see departments on Long Island with bowling alleys, 20 LCD flat panel TV's and tiki bars in their stations...

somewhat true about the millions - take away what the vollies don't need - beer, soda, fat foods, parties, hard booze and INVEST that money to a paid system and it might work. in my town, there was a study that if taxes went up just $40 per household, paid departments can exist. $40 to ensure that God Forbid you need and ambulance or the fire dept, you know you'd be getting a better quality service. it really is an investment. You'll have fit ems workers, fit firefighters and better yet compitent people!!!! I don't see how any compitent individual could vote against this...

[gamewell45 258]

Get rid of the Vollie systems all together...EMS should be run by hospitals and FD/PD's should be run by the municipalities - whether local, county or state is another topic though.

I am a vollie and i can't stand vollies or the vollie system, it only exists to fail, not to mention vollies are NOT true volunteers anymore - they are PAID labor. They get paid with little pensions, stipens and beer. Not to mention they're fat and out of shape drunks. it's very sad to see what a good concept of Americana has become. I am a Vollie that is 100% pro Paid guys - they really are simply put - BETTER.

Ok just how do you propose that we come up with the money to pay for every single fire department to go fully paid? I don't know where you've been, but we happen to be in the middle of a nasty recession; fire, police and public works departments across the country are laying off employees. Why? because of a combination of incompetence and the fact that there's no money!

If you hate the vollie system and can't stand vollies, then why are you a vollie in the first place?? Your uncharitable remarks are also uncalled for and stereotyping which show's complete ignorance on your part.

Sounds to me like your trying to kiss up to the career guys and thats fine; kissing their butts isn't going to get you hired on to a career FD or EMS; either way you'll still have to take the exam and pass it if you hope to join their ranks.

Edited July 14, 2010 by gamewell45

[Alpinerunner 61]

Take away their beer, soda, fat foods, hard booze? Come on. Don't waste your time gamewell. This must be satire.

[EMSer 15]

Ok just how do you propose that we come up with the money to pay for every single fire department to go fully paid? I don't know where you've been, but we happen to be in the middle of a nasty recession; fire, police and public works departments across the country are laying off employees. Why? because of a combination of incompetence and the fact that there's no money!

If you hate the vollie system and can't stand vollies, then why are you a vollie in the first place?? Your uncharitable remarks are also uncalled for and stereotyping which show's complete ignorance on your part.

Sounds to me like your trying to kiss up to the career guys and thats fine; kissing their butts isn't going to get you hired on to a career FD or EMS; either way you'll still have to take the exam and pass it if you hope to join their ranks.

Ha! i have no desire to do this for a living, i'm in the marketing field...thanks.

i am a vollie bacuase i do it for the sole fact that someone has to do it...but the ambulances that take 10, 15, 20, 30, or 45 minutes to just GET OUT THE DOOR are pathetic!!

how do i propose this tax increase to invest in our own health and the well being of our families, friends and homes...baby steps. one department at a time. Yes we are in a recession, but if you know anything about investing - you buy into it when it looks bad. Tell me why it takes 100 vollie firefighters to put out a fire when it takes usually 25-30 paid guys to do the same? Why do you think this is? seriously, i'd like someone to elaborate on this - if both paid and vollie FF's have a job to do why then can only the paid guys do it effectively and efficently?

the vollie world pisses so much money away it's friggin disgusting!

how about vollies trim the fat off their budgets and actually get some respectable volunteers who are well trained and actually physically fit to do the job.

i can't stand when i'm at a fire scene and i gotta take an overweight out of shape 55 year old firefighter to the hospital because he can't breathe or has chest pains...and asks to smoke a cigg before we load him in the ambulance!

The vollie system is not good, plain and simple. There are better systems out there, but vollies are too damn stubborn, egotistical or just plain dumb to learn and implment a new system. Thats why we need to get rid of them and get better educated and better trained and experianced people...not just the people that happen to see a banner hanging in the streets (no pun to the original poster, few good guys come from this, i hope you would be one of them)

Edited July 14, 2010 by EMSer

[jack10562 414]

You started to lose me with the 100 firefighter remark, then completed the transition with the "vollies are too damn stubborn" bit.

Seriously, it's the municipalities responsibility to decide if a paid department is the right choice for protection, and not the volunteer personnel themselves.

There are a few bad apples in every barrel, and while the volunteer service as a whole might be in serious trouble in some areas, it's not altogether broken.

Your brush is a bit too broad.

And let's not turn this into another paid-vs- vollie thread.

There are enough of those in the trash can already.

[EMSer 15]

You started to lose me with the 100 firefighter remark, then completed the transition with the "vollies are too damn stubborn" bit.

Seriously, it's the municipalities responsibility to decide if a paid department is the right choice for protection, and not the volunteer personnel themselves.

There are a few bad apples in every barrel, and while the volunteer service as a whole might be in serious trouble in some areas, it's not altogether broken.

Your brush is a bit too broad.

And let's not turn this into another paid-vs- vollie thread.

There are enough of those in the trash can already.

i added in my question regarding the 100 FF's bit

i was typing, but nothing came on the screen...