Fire Police and Traffic Control

[v85 212]

http://www.recordonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100108/COMM/1080333/-1/NEWS

When a garbage truck overturned on Route 17 last month, not only did the crash snarl traffic on the highway, but the hours-long backups spilled onto to local roads such as Crystal Run Road and Route 211.But Mechanicstown's assistant fire chief, Andrew Skrobanski, who was supervising the crash scene, says when he called for local police agencies to assist in traffic control, he was rebuffed, save for one Orange County sheriff's patrol car

What does everyone think of this? Where should the line between police and fire police be for traffic control? What do you think of the departments who are saying their fire police won't do traffic control anymore? What is the point of having fire police then?

[Guest EFFP411]

http://www.recordonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100108/COMM/1080333/-1/NEWS

What does everyone think of this? Where should the line between police and fire police be for traffic control? What do you think of the departments who are saying their fire police won't do traffic control anymore? What is the point of having fire police then?

The point is there is only so much a small group of older men and women can do, as you well know a MAJORITY of those who do fire police are older, most departments don't have more then 10-15 FP personnel total, how it's alot to ask to have the same 5 old guys standing out there directing traffic long after the rest of the FD cleared the scene. Now I'm not saying it in a bad way, not ALL fire police are old, since after all I do it too. BUT keeping them on the scene after the rest of the department clears is a courtesy to the PD to give them time to do whatever it is they do, AND bring in the appropriate manpower to manage the situation. Being out there for 8-10 hours while everyone else has long since gone back home is alot to ask IMHO

Edited January 8, 2010 by EFFP411

[SageVigiles 1,194]

In New Fairfield our Fire Police guys are only supposed to do traffic at a non-fire incident (wires down, flooding condition, etc) for 2 hours. After that, the PD has to call in guys on OT. God only knows why its so hard for us to GET those OT guys in, I would be all over a minimum 4-hour road job.

[helicopper 1,050]

The article is a little bit light on substance. What was traffic direction on secondary roads while traffic was being re-routed off Route 17 supposed to accomplish? I don't see any emergency that would require the fire police or police - the issue was, it appears, volume which all the direction in the world can't alleviate.

There's got to be more to the story so, until then...

[Beekman 5]

Where was DOT? On any long duration call I've been to in East Fishkill (haven't had any in Beekman) DOT (TSP) or the Thruway (I-84) came out and relieved us. Secondary roads in Middletown? I don't think anything would help that situation but please feel free to bill the heck out of that carting company that is registered in Carmel but is really located in Beekman.

If you have any of these major thoroughfares in your jurisdiction, have your Fire Police lay out a traffic diversion plan. Keeps them occupied.

[Danger 160]

It's already happening in Wallkill. Circleville fire Chief Walter Szulwach says his fire police won't do traffic control unless it's absolutely necessary. And after the garbage truck cleanup, Skrobanski says Mechanicstown won't, either.

Then why did they buy a brand new custom fire police truck?

http://www.exit109.c...chanicstown.jpg

[v85 212]

Why have fire police at all if they are not going to do traffic control?

[Guest EFFP411]

Then why did they buy a brand new custom fire police truck?

http://www.exit109.c...chanicstown.jpg

I think we're missing the point here. if the leaders of these departments mentioned didn't feel that the local PD often abused the use of Fire Police on a regular basis to direct traffic all over town, well after the emergency is over, probably sometimes when the rest of the FD hasn't even been called, then I don't think we would even be having this dicussion. The point the FD's are trying to make is that it's not their responsibility to manage traffic for the police. they're supposed to ASSIST the PD in controlling it, not have to control it totally because there's only 1 LEO on the scene. Major incidents, disasters, MCI's aside they shouldnt be out there for 10's of hours for every incident.

As for that truck they just bought, it will probably be used at the scene/ relatively close to the scene to protect the dept's firefighters and other misc. personnel at the scene as it's intended, instead of having guys spread out all over town managing the ripple effect traffic snarls caused by the scene. The feeling I'm getting from this statement is that they don't mean that that wont be doing any traffic contol at all, only that they will not leave what is normally the older population of the FD out on the road for hours on end after everyone else has gone home. Anyone else see my point?

Our dept. gives PD 2 hours to bring in the proper staffing to manage the traffic so we can be released, after a couple incidents and conflicts that was the final decision made. 2 hours after the emergency is over and the incident is no longer a FD action then it's up to PD to take over.

[v85 212]

For this particular incident, I also wonder if there were simply no police available. Between the accident itself (DWI related) and the fact that it occured on the week before Christmas in the major shopping town in Orange County, it is concievable at least, that there were no other police units available.

[x635 4,066]

Then why did they buy a brand new custom fire police truck?

http://www.exit109.c...chanicstown.jpg

EXACTLY what I was going to say! Maybe they are sending the wrong message by investing all this money into traffic control equipment and custom apparatus for it, and then say it's not their job to do it.

But I kind of agree with EFFP411's post above, very well said.

I think that PD funding and the current NYS economy may also play a role. Also, planning the roadways to manage traffic for these shopping centers adequtely, as well as asking the shopping centers to direct security guards or pay officers to direct traffic in and around their facilty during busy holiday seasons, or at least plan for these types of incidents. PD shouldn't be tied up for life threatening emergencies however, and if they are suffering from being shorthanded and the FD clearly has the resources and manpower to assist with traffic, then that agency should help the PD out if it's justified. We're all on the same team, and it's not about "helping the police department out" with traffic.....in the end- you are helping the citizens out.