New Chief Of Mount Vernon FD

[x129K 1,393]

Point taken, thanks

[efdcapt115 1,511]

Dan I wasn't directing my comments specifically towards your post, I'm sorry if you thought so. It's just that the FDMV quagmire has been on my mind a lot through the years.

You won't find a nicer group of brothers than the FDMV guys I've known through the years; and that starts with the 1st combined training class up at the academy and (at the time) Deputy Chief Henry Campbell, Lt. Ed Bruno, Lt. John Stewart and the other fine officers who helped mold that rag-tag bunch of knuckleheads including me and Joey Fiorello (God rest his soul) into a good firefighting force.

I always hoped for better things for the FDMV brothers. They had a heavier fire load than most in the county, and yet they lagged behind in pay, and it was just like the job was down on it's luck; yet the members there couldn't be a nicer and more dedicated group of firemen.

I have a lot of respect for the FDMV and it's fine traditions. Hopefully through so many controversies they can find the wherewithall to get it together.

Edited October 13, 2009 by efdcapt115

[x129K 1,393]

No sir...no problems - in fact you and Gamewell opened my naive eyes a bit more - thank you.

I agree with the dedication and honor of the FDMV...having worked there with Empress for a few years I got to see that first hand...that and Ken Flood taught my Essentials class!

[TimesUp 148]

Key word here: "supposed". Racial/ethnic discrimination still goes on (not just in NY, but around the nation) in various forms whether you want to admit it or not.

The Vulcans are allowed because other groups such as the Emerald Society, Columbia Association, etc are allowed to exist.

I've been following this thread since its inception and its too bad its evolved to this point because in all honesty, its starting to become an embarassment.

In my opinion, I think its time to close it as it outlived its usefulness a long time ago.

Gamwell you couldn't be any further off when you compare the Emerald society to the Vulcans. The Emerald society doesn't have a court ordered decree as to The Hiring practices for any fire dept. as does the vulcans. The most they have in common is they are both organizations. Although Its interesting that you share the same opinion as the vulcans.

Just thought I would stop any mis-information

Edited October 13, 2009 by ltrob

[mfc2257 464]

Lets get the differences straight. The Vulcans are a group of individuals where race is a qualifier for membership and the Emerald Society is a group who's members identify themselves as being of Irish or similar decent....An association with a group of countries not skin color. There is a big difference between the color of your skin and the country you come from..... The Irish and English continue to fight in the north, North and South Korea aren't buddies, there are plenty of conflicts in Africa, and check out Eastern Russia's former Republics.. All those folks look the same but they are willing to kill each other with little regard.

Please don't confuse race for identifying with your nation of origin. It's not the same.

May the Luck of the Irish Protect you !

Edited October 14, 2009 by mfc2257

[FirNaTine 370]

Gamwell you couldn't be any further off when you compare the Emerald society to the Vulcans. The Emerald society doesn't have a court ordered decree as to The Hiring practices for any fire dept. as does the vulcans. The most they have in common is they are both organizations. Although Its interesting that you share the same opinion as the vulcans.

Just thought I would stop any mis-information

And mis-information is what it is. Don't even waist your breath ltrob. This guy has no clue what he's talking about.

[gamewell45 258]

Gamwell you couldn't be any further off when you compare the Emerald society to the Vulcans.

Sorry but I have to disagree with you completely. Both are organizations representing groups of people based on either racial or ethnic origin and they each have their specific agenda. IMHO I think if anyone denies that, then they are not being honest with themselves.

[KCRD 6]

Sorry but I have to disagree with you completely. Both are organizations representing groups of people based on either racial or ethnic origin and they each have their specific agenda. IMHO I think if anyone denies that, then they are not being honest with themselves.

You are SO off. While both are groups of a certain racial origin, only one uses it for getting people hired or promoted based on "racial or ethnic origin" and not merit. Based on that fact alone you can't compare the two. When you divide the work place because you need a court order to hire, its pretty pathetic. As stated before, the point of civil service exams is get the most qualified person and not hire based on racial quota's.

Edited October 14, 2009 by KCRD

[CPAGE 2]

The Emerald Society does not have close door I know of more then a few black FF in the Emerald Society. I would love to see you or anyother white FF try and join the Vulcans that is just not going to happen. The Vulcans conduct business as an off shoot of a union only looking out for black members. BIG DIFFERENCE

[FirNaTine 370]

Ya gotta feel for the Brothers in the Vern. This move is an utter disgrace and slap in the face to those dedicated FDMV memebers who give 100% to their Job and that City. Talk about a blow to morale. I give them alot of credit for even going to work.

[gamewell45 258]

You are SO off. While both are groups of a certain racial origin, only one uses it for getting people hired or promoted based on "racial or ethnic origin" and not merit. Based on that fact alone you can't compare the two. When you divide the work place because you need a court order to hire, its pretty pathetic. As stated before, the point of civil service exams is get the most qualified person and not hire based on racial quota's.

KCRD, can you please point out to me in any of my posts in this thread where I stated that anything about "racial quota's"? All I said was that both are organizations representing groups of people based on either racial or ethnic origin and they each have their specific agenda; Nothing more; nothing less. What your talking about above is from your mouth and not mine.

[mfc2257 464]

KCRD, can you please point out to me in any of my posts in this thread where I stated that anything about "racial quota's"? All I said was that both are organizations representing groups of people based on either racial or ethnic origin and they each have their specific agenda; Nothing more; nothing less. What your talking about above is from your mouth and not mine.

I think that you are missing the theme surrounding the Vulcans discussion in this thread.... The Vulcans represent a cross section of FF's based on the color of their skin. Aside from you, I don't think anyone is going to argue that point. Based on this skin color association, the Vulcans attempt to use leverage to get more people of similar skin color hired. This is their agenda.

In my 32 years on this planet, and 16 years in the fire service, have I ever heard of the Emerald Society fighting to make sure that enough FF's of Irish background were getting hired. The agendas that you speak of aren't comparable.

[gamewell45 258]

I think that you are missing the theme surrounding the Vulcans discussion in this thread.... The Vulcans represent a cross section of FF's based on the color of their skin. Aside from you, I don't think anyone is going to argue that point. Based on this skin color association, the Vulcans attempt to use leverage to get more people of similar skin color hired. This is their agenda.

In my 32 years on this planet, and 16 years in the fire service, have I ever heard of the Emerald Society fighting to make sure that enough FF's of Irish background were getting hired. The agendas that you speak of aren't comparable.

I don't think anybody here has said that they did (Emerald Society).

[TimesUp 148]

I don't think anybody here has said that they did (Emerald Society).

Gamwell your comparisons of these to organizations falls short. When it comes down to it you know little about either. You are entitled to your opinion. Although in this case it seems you don't have the right information to back it up. Except to say that they are both organizations. With totally different agendas. By the way its O.K. to have an agenda as long as it doesn't screw somebody out of a job or promotion. The Emerald society plays no role in any departments hiring or promotion process.

[FirNaTine 370]

Gamwell your comparisons of these to organizations falls short. When it comes down to it you know little about either. You are entitled to your opinion. Although in this case it seems you don't have the right information to back it up. Except to say that they are both organizations. With totally different agendas. By the way its O.K. to have an agenda as long as it doesn't screw somebody out of a job or promotion. The Emerald society plays no role in any departments hiring or promotion process.

Gotts that right!