North Highlands Brush Fire 4/27/2009

[markmets415 524]

I respectfully disagree. Standards are standards and if you pick and choose the ones you're going to follow sooner or later someone is going to get hurt. You're certainly right that we have different types of fires here in the northeast then they do out west but that doesn't change the fact that the standard exists - and it exists for one reason alone - to protect firefighters. Does the NFPA standard say "only applicable west of the Mississippi? I think not.

All the qualifiers in your post seem to diminish your certainty that FF in NYS do not need appropriate PPE. Aren't the NYS Forest Rangers wearing the heavy duty yellow shirt and green pants? Isn't that fire resistant material and able to withstand snags, abrasions, etc.?

Maybe you're right that cotton shirts, cotton jeans and work boots are appropriate but is that enforced? Looking back at several recent fires I'd say, no.

My original point is that structural FF PPE is not appropriate for brush or wild fires and the appropriate stuff should be made available to you.

Please don't give me the expense excuse. Departments duplicate heavy equipment all the time - we need two hurst tools on this truck and two on that truck "just in case". Save one set of Hurst tools and buy the right PPE! I can't believe that it's the cop ranting about the right PPE and the FF saying it's not necessary.

100% correct Chris, we need to be much more forward thinking, the climate is changing and the Northeast is obviously effected, I can't remember this many larger scaled grass/brush fires and another red flag day today. So we finally are going to purchase the gear.

[ajsbear 11]

We keep brush gear on our brush truck, I think we now have 5 sets and more are in the works. PPE has no place in the woods. Wear it for an hour hiking and see how you feel. Going up and down the mountains you'll end up being carried out. Light weight brush gear is the way to go. We're getting more and more and larger brush fires. Especially near parkland.

[helicopper 1,050]

Aren't the NYS Forest Rangers wearing the heavy duty yellow shirt and green pants? Isn't that fire resistant material and able to withstand snags, abrasions, etc.?

I answered my own question - the above gear is 6.0 ounce Nomex so it is fire resistant. The cost is about $225.00 per set so it's far less than the other PPE pictured in this thread yet it still offers some degree of protection.

[mkronick 0]

http://firefighterclosecalls.com/fullstory.php?84846

CLOSE CALL IN SOUTH CAROLINA WILDLAND FIRE

"Friday, April 24, 2009- No deaths or serious injuries have been reported because of the devastating fire in Horry County, however, two Firefighters had a close call Thursday. They were temporarily trapped by the fast moving flames, but thanks to their training and equipment they were able to dodge any trouble. The firefighters had to use portable fire shelters to survive.

According to Forestry officials, firefighters have been battling these severe flames because the forests in the area have a lot of natural fuel, which can re-ignite the fire."

This is why you need the proper PPE for the situation.

[helicopper 1,050]

http://firefighterclosecalls.com/fullstory.php?84846

This is why you need the proper PPE for the situation.

And TRAINING!

[Tapout 42]

I can't believe that it's the cop ranting about the right PPE and the FF saying it's not necessary.

I have nothing to add to this-- I just thought it so perfectly summed up this entire argument it needed to be repeated.

Now, about those pink-tipped boots... where I get me a pair of those bad boys? I don't fight fires, but I could really have some fun ringing a bell or 2 sparring in them at my next karate class.

[16fire5 693]

There is a difference between this

and this

Jeans and work boots with these yellow shirts would do the trick. Here's how you enforce it come properly atired or don't get on the apparatus.

More importantly how many departments do wildland training (Red Card)? Or chain saw training?

Just like realizing conditions in structrual firefighting so you don't have to bail out a window the same holds true for wildland. Just as much as you see improper atire at brush fires you see bad strategy and tactics. Why are people in the middle of the burn area cutting down trees or waiting for a tree to fall on them? Worry about the snags that will fall across your break there is little reason to be in the middle of the burn area although it is a good place to escape extending fire.

[helicopper 1,050]

There is a difference between this

and this

Jeans and work boots with these yellow shirts would do the trick. Here's how you enforce it come properly atired or don't get on the apparatus.

More importantly how many departments do wildland training (Red Card)? Or chain saw training?

Just like realizing conditions in structrual firefighting so you don't have to bail out a window the same holds true for wildland. Just as much as you see improper atire at brush fires you see bad strategy and tactics. Why are people in the middle of the burn area cutting down trees or waiting for a tree to fall on them? Worry about the snags that will fall across your break there is little reason to be in the middle of the burn area although it is a good place to escape extending fire.

Jeans aren't Nomex. Why wouldn't you get the green pants if you're going to get the yellow shirts?

Your points about needing wildland fire behavior training and management of such fires are right on. Just because this is NY doesn't mean it isn't a legitimate training topic.

[Guest]

Over here in my paid department we have a Nomex shirt that we wear to brushfires, we wear our normal bunker pants, boots and helmets, the guys find that its nowhere near as bad once you lose the heavy jacket for the lightweight shirt, but your still protected with the Nomex. If we were caught wearing a T-shirt we would face the white shirts. But in this instance, I see no issues.