Automatic License Plate Reader question

[Guest]

I just heard about this and looked it up....very interesting. Apparently, these cameras can be mounted on patrol cars and will automatically read the plates of cars passing by, then search a database to see if they are stolen, etc. Anyone seen one in person, or know if there's any around here? What do you think? Pretty expensive; I think one unit costs over $25,000. Pretty cool concept though!

The link:

http://www.elsagna.com/mobile.htm

(sorry, you may have to copy and paste)

[JM15 386]

These have been around for a while now. You might see it on police cars around you. They look like "bug eyes" mounted on top.

[INIT915 1,119]

NYSP have been using them for a few years now. Additionally, County PD and dozens of other towns/villages have since purchased the system.

[x129K 1,393]

Poughkeepsie has had one for a few yars as well..in fcat it JUST picked up a stolen car...

[helicopper 1,050]

As INIT said, there are a bunch of them around here now. State Police, County Police, Yonkers, Mt Vernon, and many many more...

[xfirefighter484x 234]

A previous thread about just such devices (lots of information posted in there):

http://www.emtbravo.net/index.php?showtopic=17965

[joshlost818 6]

I have seen them more and more and they are not only being installed on the tops of the cars. I have seen them mounted on the trunks so you cant see them on the slicktops.

[wcr20 17]

Hey chris -

put a set on the chopper?

[KC2OBW 1]

I have seen them more and more and they are not only being installed on the tops of the cars. I have seen them mounted on the trunks so you cant see them on the slicktops.

At work one day I was talking to one of the Town cops, and he said having the cameras on the trunk is more effective then being mounted in front of the lightbar.

[Just a guy 493]

the plate reader is a great tool. The speed is amazing and in yonkers we have a new data base that can store location of contact, with time of day, etc...

[NWFDMedic 58]

the plate reader is a great tool. The speed is amazing and in yonkers we have a new data base that can store location of contact, with time of day, etc...

Doesn't that seem a bit like big brother? I have little problem with them scanning the plates, but holding a list of where you were and when... not only does it seem like big brother, it also sounds like a violation of my civil liberties.

[20y2 43]

Doesn't that seem a bit like big brother? I have little problem with them scanning the plates, but holding a list of where you were and when... not only does it seem like big brother, it also sounds like a violation of my civil liberties.

You have absolutely no expectation of privacy while in public.

[FFD941 20]

Doesn't that seem a bit like big brother? I have little problem with them scanning the plates, but holding a list of where you were and when... not only does it seem like big brother, it also sounds like a violation of my civil liberties.

What about EZPASS?? or Traffic Camera's?? Big Brother has been here for awhile it's nothing new and if you've done nothing wrong, then what do you have to hide??

Edited February 7, 2009 by FFD941

[ny10570 745]

Doesn't that seem a bit like big brother? I have little problem with them scanning the plates, but holding a list of where you were and when... not only does it seem like big brother, it also sounds like a violation of my civil liberties.

It only records the plates that matched a plate in the database. Not every plate that it sees.

[tdc202 0]

I'm sure it was mentioned before but In Dutchess it was a big part in convicting those 2 guys who killed that family in Fishkill a year or so ago.

[Bnechis 3,961]

What about EZPASS?? or Traffic Camera's?? Big Brother has been here for awhile it's nothing new

1) You have absolutely no expectation of privacy while in public.

2) The plates are the property of the State of NY and driving is a privilage not a right.

and if you've done nothing wrong, then what do you have to hide??

While I have no problem with how this technology is being used. This statement was addressed by Ben Franklin: "Anyone who trades liberty for security deserves neither liberty nor security".

[NWFDMedic 58]

While I have no problem with how this technology is being used. This statement was addressed by Ben Franklin: "Anyone who trades liberty for security deserves neither liberty nor security".

I can't agree more with Ben Franklin's quote. If it only tracks tagged plates and the only ones that can be tagged are in the bad boy database, I have no problem with it. From the way it sounded originally, I thought they were making a huge database of people's travels.

[helicopper 1,050]

Metro London is ringed by these cameras in fixed locations to track vehicles and identify patterns that would be indicators of criminal activity and/or terrorism. The data is used to protect everyone working in this high profile area and reduce the likelihood of terrorist bombings like the Manchester truck bomb. The Brits swear by it.

Even if it is recording every license plate what civil liberties are being infringed upon?

Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Amendment II

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Amendment III

No Soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the Owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.

Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures , shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue , but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Amendment V

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

Amendment VI

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.

Amendment VII

In Suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury, shall be otherwise re-examined in any Court of the United States, than according to the rules of the common law.

Amendment VIII

Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.

Amendment IX

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

[OoO 24]

You could argue Amendment IV:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures , shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue , but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

[OoO 24]

I should add that I have no problem with scanning plates and checking them against a database, but I have a problem when a log is kept recording every plate scanned along with the location and time.

[Guest]

Why would you care if you haven't commited any crime. Keep your registraion vailid, and don't steel any cars and you have nothing to worry about.

Just an FYI for E-Z Pass users. The TA doesn't only scan your tag at toll barriers, they have tag readers on overpasses and sign stanchions all along the highway. More than one criminal has been implicated by information provided by the NYS TA

Edited February 7, 2009 by LAD19DER NY

[OnTheWheel 43]

They're down to about 10 or 12k. And like stated, if youre not doing anything wrong you dont have to worry about anything! Valuable tool for Law Enforcement. And they are currently working on FACE rocognition software.. Warrants etc will pop up as well. It's about time we started "cleaning" up our society, save the "civil liberties" for us law abiding citizens.

[x129K 1,393]

It's about time we started "cleaning" up our society, save the "civil liberties" for us law abiding citizens.

WORD!~

[helicopper 1,050]

You could argue Amendment IV:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures , shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue , but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

As there is neither a search or a seizure, I think you'd be hard pressed to make that argument stick. If it is maintained like the EZ-pass database or other systems already in existence, it is very likely that you'd have to get a court order to access it for investigatory purposes.

This is a great discussion, I'm curious to hear other opinions...

[JM15 386]

I've heard stories about people getting tickets for speeding between ez pass readers. Is this true or just an urban legend? Anyone?

[SRS131EMTFF 471]

The law is designed to protect both the criminals (Miranda/Constitution) and the general public (Constitution). The law extents its protection to anyone in and under its sovereignty regardless of accusations (Read innocent until proven guilty which has become less and less of a reality in this world).

While in public and driving on a public highway while in posession of NY state tags then one has no reasonable expectation of privacy under the common-law.

Anyone that says that you have nothing to hide has nothing to fear should reread the Forth Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America.

Edited February 8, 2009 by bvfdjc316

[Guest]

I've heard stories about people getting tickets for speeding between ez pass readers. Is this true or just an urban legend? Anyone?

I know the system is capable of this, but I am not aware of any tickets done this way.

[helicopper 1,050]

I've heard stories about people getting tickets for speeding between ez pass readers. Is this true or just an urban legend? Anyone?

According to Snopes it's not true - read here

[helicopper 1,050]

Anyone that says that you have nothing to hide has nothing to fear should reread the Forth Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America.

Huh? What do you mean?

[ny10570 745]

At this point the closest thing to speeding ticket you'll get from EZ-Pass is your account suspended for going too fast through the toll plaza. The fear is that the revenue generated by tracking speeders would be less than the revenue lost by cancelled EZ-Pass accounts.