Mount Vernon Ladder Truck Down Again

[61MACKBR1 222]

Based upon the information provided in today's Journal News report concerning yesterday's House Fire in Mount Vernon, FDMV's first due Ladder Truck (presumably TL-1) upon arrival had hydraulic problems when they were setting up the rig to fight the fire, and thus it could not be used. Instead FDMV used the YFD Ladder 79, that they have on loan from Yonkers, to fight the fire. How many weeks has YFD 79 been on loan to FDMV? Now it appears that all 4 Ladder Trucks that FDMV has are all down due to mechanical failure and failure to pass inspection? Maybe YFD can loan FDMV the Mack CF Tower Ladder (old TL-77) once it comes back from Pelham Manor? (Sad comment, but if Yonkers Mayor Amicone is shutting down Ladder Company 70 and moving TL75 to Station 14, maybe YFD can loan the "new" Smeal Ladder 70 to Mount Vernon as well as 79. Just tells you that Yonkers FD is much better supported as it relates to having available front line apparatus than Mount Vernon)

[antiquefirelt 994]

It seems that the Aerialscope product has started losing its reputation since Seagrave took over. Problems are popping up all over the land with the Seagrave Scopes. There will be a day when kids coming on the job will seem the Scope as "just another tower" unless Seagrave fixes the issues soon. Thankfully we couldn't afford one when we bought our MM ALF/LTI!

Imagine being happy you have an ALF over a Scope! For us the service was way to far away to deal with frequent issues, so this makes sense. Our ALF service is within 2 hrs vs 4 hrs and two states away. We even had the City Council convinced that if the Scope bid was within $50K of the others it would be a better longterm truck! HA! I glad we're not trying to live that one down, I got to many years to go.

Too bad for the FDMV brothers they seem to be taking a beating all over and just when you think the City did something decen by buying a decent truck...

Edited December 21, 2008 by antiquefirelt

[ajsbear 11]

Maybe Yonkers can supplement their budget by going into the Ladder Truck rental business.

[dadbo46 50]

I'm not sure if this whole FDMV situation is incompetence, is criminal or is political.........or a bit of all.

[x635 4,066]

While going into shop @ Home Depot near Marist College, I saw what appeared to be a TL-3 for Mt. Vernon getting fuel .

Was that enroute for repairs or the grave yard.

Isn't the E-One dealer near there???

[x129K 1,393]

Isn't the E-One dealer near there???

Yes.

[LT410 5]

TL-1 has not ran correctly since day 1. I do not recall it even making it through 1 whole month without some sort of mechanical breakdown. Is there not a lemon law when it comes to fire apparatus? Seagrave should replace this truck I do not understand how they could get away with selling a 750,000 truck and it have so many problems. The City spent good money thinking they bought the best perhaps they should of done more research before they made the deal. We are all disappointed, all show no go on this one. I hope seagrave reads this because they really built a piece of garbage and should be ashamed

[Lucifer 6]

And to add further, Ladder #3 was repaired at Nichols in Hyde Park and placed in service at 3rd St. The old TL-4 (Mack) is equiped and usable if needed as a spare. L-2 is now up at Nichols getting worked on. Things are getting done! It's too bad that you invest alot of taxpayer money in a piece of equipment (TL-1) and the product keeps malfunctioning.

[JM15 386]

Good point, I've never heard of anything like that. Is there a "lemon law" for apparatus like when you buy a car?

[dadbo46 50]

The NYS Lemon Law only covers cars (yea, a mobile home is covered too.)

See http://www.lemonlawclaims.com/New%20York%2...law%20guide.htm.

Take it from one who manages a large publicly owned fleet, if all remedys are persued and failed in accordance with your contract, you're only remedy is to sue.

Edited December 22, 2008 by dadbo46

[Truck4 48]

They set up TL-1 yesterday and put the stick up, but had an issue with overhead lines.

[Future Fireman 4]

It seems that the Aerialscope product has started losing its reputation since Seagrave took over. Problems are popping up all over the land with the Seagrave Scopes. There will be a day when kids coming on the job will seem the Scope as "just another tower" unless Seagrave fixes the issues soon. Thankfully we couldn't afford one when we bought our MM ALF/LTI!

Imagine being happy you have an ALF over a Scope! For us the service was way to far away to deal with frequent issues, so this makes sense. Our ALF service is within 2 hrs vs 4 hrs and two states away. We even had the City Council convinced that if the Scope bid was within $50K of the others it would be a better longterm truck! HA! I glad we're not trying to live that one down, I got to many years to go.

Too bad for the FDMV brothers they seem to be taking a beating all over and just when you think the City did something decen by buying a decent truck...

I believe that the Scope is a great Tower for operations, however, no matter how hard they try, there's going to be at least 1 lemon made by any apparatus manufacturer in any given year. Despite how hard they try, lemons are unavoidable. It probably doesn't help if the city that operates a lemon doesn't put the effort into it to get back in operable condition.

Mike

[antiquefirelt 994]

I believe that the Scope is a great Tower for operations, however, no matter how hard they try, there's going to be at least 1 lemon made by any apparatus manufacturer in any given year. Despite how hard they try, lemons are unavoidable. It probably doesn't help if the city that operates a lemon doesn't put the effort into it to get back in operable condition.

Mike

Mike this would explain FDMV's issue if it were just them. But alas, FDNY has had issues, as have many FD's who have taken delivery of the Seagrave Scopes. One doesn't need to dig very far to find a decent list of problems, many seem related to hydraulics. Again, very unfortunate given the Scope reputation.

[Guest]

Things are getting done!

And I feel that the EMTBravo board bringing these issues to light has helped TREMENDOUSLY with getting things done.

[25truck26 29]

I know guys down at 17 truck in the city (Bronx). They have a 2006 or 2007 TL obviously a seagrave and they told me 2 weeks ago they had major problems with it and that it was being sent to Wisconsin. Seems like lately there are a lot of issues with seagrave/ aerialscope ladders.

[ny10570 745]

Didn't Segrave recently redesign their Scope hydraulic systems. New system should either be out or coming soon.

[CPAGE 2]

Ido beleave before Seagrave took over the T/L busy is was called Baker and no one had any major issues with them. Now the it is called aerialscope and run / owned by Seagrave it has not been as good as it has in the past. So lets make sure with call an apple and apple and an orange an orange.

CPAGE

[ny10570 745]

A lot of people not too thrilled with their Bakers either. Two in Westchester for sure.

[antiquefirelt 994]

Didn't Segrave recently redesign their Scope hydraulic systems. New system should either be out or coming soon.

Actually now that you mention it, didn't Scope redesign the hydraulics just before moving to Seagrave? They went from the real long rams to shorter ones that are reversed in direction? Maybe Seagrave will re-design them back! I couldn't find a single post 2003-4 Scope with the long rams but I found a handful of the shorter reversed ram aerials on trucks between 2001-2003.

[CAM502 6]

And I feel that the EMTBravo board bringing these issues to light has helped TREMENDOUSLY with getting things done.

Joking r we??

[ny10570 745]

Actually now that you mention it, didn't Scope redesign the hydraulics just before moving to Seagrave? They went from the real long rams to shorter ones that are reversed in direction? Maybe Seagrave will re-design them back! I couldn't find a single post 2003-4 Scope with the long rams but I found a handful of the shorter reversed ram aerials on trucks between 2001-2003.

Everything I know about Scopes is based on conversations with more knowledgeable people. With that disclaimer out there, Baker introduced their new tower with a hydraulic time bomb that was purchased by many departments. Locally the victims were Pleasantville and Scarsdale(I think). These would catastrophically failed after so many hours of use. Seagrave took over and did their own redesign resulting in what is being sold now. I have no idea what is in store for the next change except that its wonderful, amazing, and perfect. Just like every other new thing.

[grumpyff 1,159]

Not Scarsdale,but Hartsdale. When they work, 'Scopes are a great product, but even when built by Baker they are/were maintanence intensive. When they break, they break big with lots of $$$ and headaches to fix.

[RWC130 594]

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2235/218385...255f8f4.jpg?v=0

[Guest FFNick]

Not Scarsdale,but Hartsdale. When they work, 'Scopes are a great product, but even when built by Baker they are/were maintanence intensive. When they break, they break big with lots of $$$ and headaches to fix.

We have a spare Tower that is a 75' Baker, it was refurbed from Lansing MI back in the 90's. The thing is bomb proof - and it sees work. It is the most durable and reliable piece in our fleet. It is too bad it is now a spare. We purchased one of the original Aerialscopes (Post Baker, Pre Seagrave). It was a nightmare for many reasons, so for better or worse, we got rid of it and bought a Pierce.

Then again, now that I read this thread, I do not know how any of my post, or much of this thread, actually relates to FDMVs problems.

Edited December 23, 2008 by FFNick

[ajsbear 11]

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2235/218385...255f8f4.jpg?v=0

The one I sent was better

[Turborich 12]

Isn't Mount Vernon getting a new E-one tower?

[stixx 7]

one of there ladders aren't down i saw it in new rochelle today

[dc2t 80]

one of there ladders aren't down i saw it in new rochelle today

How's this

[27east 19]

How's this

All that needs is a Roto-Ray and chevrons on the back.

[Future Fireman 4]

All that needs is a Roto-Ray and chevrons on the back.

...And a Q!