Forcible Entry: Tips, Tricks, Whys, And Whynots

[robert benz 344]

Ok the last topic took off into a forcible entry debate. Some great points were brought out, what tools work best given the situation, some from what wont work given the size up of the "door/ frame".

Based on responses from guys who have done a lot of f/e and from guys in quieter area's who may not do too much, lets see who prefers what technique and why.

I have had the luxury of being shown conventional forcible entry (irons) from highly respected members of FDNY. With that said, we (nrfd) setup two forcible entry simulators in one of our firehouses. Every member has been shown and has trained on the correct way to force a door that swings toward you and away from you. From this CORRECT way we have adapted and trained on the notion that there are no ALWAYS AND VERY FEW NEVERS when it comes to forcing a door.

As far as the hydra ram it is a hydro tool and it can and will fail, it is a great tool when used properly and when it is used by trained personal who can detect when it ISNT WORKING THE WAY IT IS SUPPOSED TO. ie THE DUMP VALVE IS NOT FULLY CLOSED!!!. Happens all the time and is one of the failures of the tool.

so hydra ram not too good on doors with angle iron butted against stop, possible mech failure, not recomended for doors that open toward you, and last on my list wood doors and frames. Good for One man operation, 10,000 lbs of force on or close to lock should defeat the lock, better for door control as door does not blow open.

Ok I started it lets see some good proven tips and tricks we can all learn something from.

[Guest TOYBUFF911]

This isn't brain surgery, but it takes some experience, practice and creativity to become proficient.

Myself and partner will bring the rabbit tool bag w/k-tool, halogen, sledge or 8lb axe, medical trauma bag and an AED. Our CAD system notifies us of keyholders and dispatch get information and family members with keys ETA for us so we can make a good informed decision upon arrival. Experienced officers know where to locate supers and keyholders, because most locations are repeat calls. Also carried is a shove knife, piece of plastic to slide behind a lock and in the rabbit bag a small bolt cutter for chain locks as well as a few wedges. EMS stands by until we clear the apartment and if determined not needed they are canceled to keep liability on those who entered the premise. JCESU was right with caution on dogs and also crime scenes or a potential suspect inside.

Good luck stay safe.

Below is a link that everyone can learn a few things from.

http://www.firefactory.com/FE.pdf

[Remember585 815]

We keep a piece of webbing on our Hydra-Ram with a slip knot on it to grab a door knob so the door doesn't get away from us.

Some other thoughts...

Wooden doors...

Solid: Irons

Hollow: Shove knife, screwdriver between door and jam. Or popping the pins out of the hinges.

Metal doors...

Outward: Irons

Inward: Hydra-ram, then Irons.

Also, if it is loaded with locks or other safety measures, and there is a legit emergency behind it - K12. Cut the skin and take a look, or if you know what is behind it and it makes sense to do so - make a pie cut around the latch and open that sucker up.

Door control for us firefighter types is important too. Bring a hook, a piece of rope or webbing to control the door, so it doesn't fly open. Position the handline in the right spot and be ready to use that door as a shield from fire.

[abaduck 123]

Great topic... surely there's at least one 'always' - try before you pry!

One general observation; I've heard from quite a few people that through-the-lock tends to be a neglected and underutilised technique.

Mike