Leasing apparatus?

[PoqFFEMT 6]

Ok, I've got a question that has been bugging me for a bit. Looking around the site, I came across that a Dutchess County department may or may not have leased a piece of apparatus.

My question is, Why? Why would any department lease such a large expense? Most individuals that lease a car or truck do so to just turn it in at the end and then lease a new vehicle. Is this the way the fire service is going to now? Would this not be a huge waste od taxpayer dollars?

I'd love to hear thoughs on this... For or against.

[Future Fireman 4]

Could it be a lease to own? After x amount of years, it's owned by the Dept. Maybe something like that?

Mike

Edited March 3, 2008 by Future Fireman

[PoqFFEMT 6]

Why not outright buy it? What woudl the advantage of leasing it be then?????

[x635 4,066]

If I'm not mistaken, both Las Vegas and Houston lease their apparatus. Maybe Kansas City too, I think?

Since leasing offers a ton of flexible financing options, I think it has something to do with preserving capital funds, and spreading the cost of purchasing the apparatus over a number of years, and avoids having to float a bond (and associated vote). All departments mentioned above went with the lease option and replaced their ENTIRE fleet at once.

There's a variety of options out there....I think some are "lease to buy", and some enable the buyer to trade in the apparatus when neccesary for newer apparatus. Keep in mind that a large number of municipal school bus fleets are leased, and it's becoming a popular muncipal option with refuse trucks, etc.

Most major apparatus manufacturers offer a leasing option.

[RDUNC67 1]

Ok, I've got a question that has been bugging me for a bit. Looking around the site, I came across that a Dutchess County department may or may not have leased a piece of apparatus.

My question is, Why? Why would any department lease such a large expense? Most individuals that lease a car or truck do so to just turn it in at the end and then lease a new vehicle. Is this the way the fire service is going to now? Would this not be a huge waste od taxpayer dollars?

I'd love to hear thoughs on this... For or against.

Most of the time when the word "lease" is mentioned in this situation they are usually talikng about "lease purchase", which is nothing more than borrowing the money and making payments back to whomever you got the money from, in my past experiences with this the FD would put a down payment on the vehicle and the payments then would be spread over 2-10 years, usally annual payments.

[Guest]

Also, as i have seen/ heard the lease to buy option is used to keep it from having to go to voters to pass a bond.

[houlidsa 76]

I know city of Schenectady actually leases their rigs. They are a true cash strapped city so it keeps their costs down. It is the only way that the Chief can insure that his members have the apparatus they need. Plus the up keep can wrapped in with the lease or lease to purchase prices.

[AndyC3J 190]

If I'm not mistaken, the Syosset Fire District (Nassau Co.) acquired their five new Pierce Dash pumpers under a 10-year lease agreement.

[Oswegowind 17]

I don't think FD apparatus are the only things leased. Didn't NY Pres EMS lease their ambulances? They always had nice buses! May be the way to go...then the leasing co is responsible for maintenance and such, like trucking co's leasing from uhaul and ryder and such on long term terms.

[Guest FFNick]

Departments also can lease apparatus when they need one in a hurry without bonding, etc. For instance, when their line rig does down for some reason - major crash, failure of aerial inspection, etc. A lease is a stop gap method to use while going through the replacement process.

[antiquefirelt 994]

FD's lease apparatus for the same reason people lease cars and SUVs. It's generally for one of two reasons.

First, you can't afford to buy that new truck you really want and the lease allows for lower payments.

The second reason, is if you accept that you'll always have a vehicle payment, can meet the terms of the lease (mileage) and will always wan t anew vehicle within 3-5 years.

For a FD that has had to spend tons of time and money limping aged apparatus, fighting to get funding when the trucks are still "in service" the lease option is fairly palatable. You'll never be more than x years aways from a new vehicle, with new technology and upgraded features that fit the changing needs of your dept., the maintenance costs will be lower as you are getting only the best years of the truck and the payments are low because the truck can be resold.

Maybe throw in the third reason as mentioned above that often lease purchase payments are low enough to not exceed the amount requiring voter approval and therefore can be done immediately.

Now in practice, one must wonder how the depreciation or trade in truck stands up to a trade-in inspection. Like car leases there must be some rules as to modifications to the original apparatus. What if you drill holes, change brackets, scratches, dings and dents? Also, how custom can the apparatus be to start? Are they all program trucks? I'd be interested to hear of how many FD's continue leasing after the first round of leased trucks is turned in.

Lastly, as noted before most are actually lease purchases, as we were offered with our new rescue pumper project. The bids come in with the prices then the bidders offer a lease-purchase program to keep the payments low so it looks better to the annual bean counters.