Firefighters have to get killed, Its part of the job?!?!?

[Dondestro 9]

I found this story really interesting. Yes I understand that things can go wrong and we can die or get seriously injured. But the way this lieut was talking bothers me.

From Firehouse.com 02-26-2008

BURTON A. CLARK

Firehouse.Com Contributor

In 1976, my lieutenant said, "Firefighters have to get killed; it's part of the job."* His statement frightened me. (see article below) Does the fire service and society believe this statement? Do you agree or disagree with this statement?

FullStory:

http://cms.firehouse.com/content/article/a...16&id=58484

Edited February 28, 2008 by jack10562
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[helicopper 1,050]

Great article! And if you read the article he wrote 32 years ago, it is still (unfortunately) true.

One especially interesting passage...

The NIOSH line of duty death studies report that we do not follow our own safety SOP's, national standards, and training doctrine. We do not use our safety equipment. We do not hold firefighters, officers, or chiefs responsible and accountable when it comes to safety. More fire service personnel are disciplined for being late for work then safety violations. In other words, we tolerate and accept safety misconduct, which can and does result in firefighter death or injury.

Why is there so little accountability in this industry?

[jack10562 414]

Great article! And if you read the article he wrote 32 years ago, it is still (unfortunately) true.

One especially interesting passage...

Why is there so little accountability in this industry?

That, my friend, is the Million dollar question! And, for what it's worth, pertains to behavior that is not confined just to firefighting.

After any OTJ injury or a LODD, there is "much wailing, much wringing of hands, and gnashing of teeth"

We come away always asking: Why this, or, How Come that? Then, it's back to work.

Consequences of a failure to perform safely for the individual are usually swift, and depending on the severity, quite often deadly. Many times circumstances are out of the control of the injured, then again, many times not.

So, the answer to that question remains elusive, like the 'Holy Grail'.

[Dondestro 9]

Exactly my thoughts. why is it that when something bad happens, we point fingers we point out what happened wrong then the next thing we know the same thing happens somewhere else and someone else gets hurt.....I understand things happen but if it is a problem, why don't we STOP.Think.and hopefully PREVENT it from happening again.

I have bad habits as do most of us. but unfortunatly we all have learned alot from accidents when people get hurt or killed( but how many times does the same accident need to happen before people really take into account the problem. Sometimes it could be lack of saftey officer sometimes lazyness.

Accountability is a very large problem your correct but in two area, the first being I can't count the number of times I personaly have not "TAGED" in before leaving the truck, and that in my eyes is my own fault. 2nd. Whos fault is it when people who make mistakes are not disciplined?

[Monty 35]

Exactly my thoughts. why is it that when something bad happens, we point fingers we point out what happened wrong then the next thing we know the same thing happens somewhere else and someone else gets hurt.....I understand things happen but if it is a problem, why don't we STOP.Think.and hopefully PREVENT it from happening again.

I have bad habits as do most of us. but unfortunatly we all have learned alot from accidents when people get hurt or killed( but how many times does the same accident need to happen before people really take into account the problem. Sometimes it could be lack of saftey officer sometimes lazyness.

Accountability is a very large problem your correct but in two area, the first being I can't count the number of times I personaly have not "TAGED" in before leaving the truck, and that in my eyes is my own fault. 2nd. Whos fault is it when people who make mistakes are not disciplined?

Do departments around here use any kind of accountability? How about PARs? It seems to be a big free for all from what I've seen.

A few in my department have some County issued tags but those took for ever and don't seem to be anything more happening with those.

I know elsewhere in NY there are some pretty rigid accountability systems in place.

[FFD941 20]

Look at any mask confidence course.

The obstacle you are going through at one point or another killed a fellow brother. We ALL learn from anothers mistake.

[x635 4,066]

"Firefighters have to get killed; it's part of the job."

Sounds EXACTLY like something my former Chief would say. Unfortunetly, some people have that old school mindset.....and some people would rather save dollars then firefighters. I think as we see more of the old "regime" start to retire or become obsolete, we'll see a safer fire service. However, if we continue to elect Chiefs and Commisioners who are out of touch with the fire service, we're really not going to have people that TRULY have our safety in mind.