Explorers on Calls?

[Guest]

Where I am in Glenville, explorers are not to respond to emerency calls on a rig and/or with their personal vehicles, however in Port Chester and other surrounding areas, explorers seem to do whatever they want to do.

Can this just be a law that is written by the State of Connecticut, or just by my department (maybe)? What can the explorers in your departments' do?

[JohnnyOV 2]

The Junior Corps members in my department are not allowed to respond on calls until they are 16 and then they are only allowed to respond directly to the fire house, with NO blue lights and proceed to respond on the apparatus given that there is an available seat to sit in. They are exterior support only.

Video of our Junior Corps in action - http://www.yorktownfire.org/content/junior...unior_Corps.wmv

Edited January 30, 2008 by EMSJunkie712

[SageVigiles 1,194]

Explorers or Juniors? Because Explorers have certain national standards they have to follow. I'm more familiar with Law Enforcement Exploring so I don't know the specifics, but here is a link to some safety issues from Learning for Life, the organizing body of Explorers.

As far as CT State Law, the Department of Labor has regulations regarding employees under the age of 18.

I started as a Junior Firefighter in New Fairfield, CT at the age of 16. Juniors are allowed to go on calls but have restrictions on what they can/cannot do on a scene. Also, they cannot respond in POVs, only on department apparatus. What you are talking about sounds like a department policy, I would ask your Advisor to be sure.

Edited January 30, 2008 by SageVigiles

[Scottyk107 9]

The max that the boy scouts that run the Explorers will let you do is respond to calls on an emergency apparatus and assist to your abilities. Once there you are not permitted to don and air pack or enter a hazardous environment. Also are not allowed to use any hydrolic or power tools. The explorer insurance will only cover things that happen outside of those actions. Personally I have done a lot more then I was supposed to but that was only at the permission of my Lieutenant and under close supervision. Both explorer posts I was in allowed the maximum hands on experience that the boy scouts allowed and didn't implement any outside rules that I know some other depts have. It all really just relies on how much liability that dept wants to take on and if they are willing to put themselves and their officers in that position. I have NEVER heard of any dept letting any explorer respond in their own personal vehicle if it is a JR dept it may be different. It all

[jcoppola 52]

I guess this shows my age, but when I joined Belltown in 1985 at the age of 16, we were given turnout gear and were taken into working fires to "learn". We took the FF1 class and became certified at 18, but that did not hold us back from going to and working at fires before that. I know it was a long time ago and things change in our litigious society, but I learned some really good stuff from salty veterans and those memories are burned into my brain forever.

Fire explorer programs are good, but the explorers need to be clear on their duties and responsibilities.

JVC

[Scottyk107 9]

I thought it depends on the agency policys?

EMS Youth Corp- Min age 15 to become a member and take part in functions. 16 to respond to calls in the ambulance w/ cpr/aed and 16 to become a CFR

FIRE Junior- Min age 17 active prob ff

*correct me if Im wrong

I think with Juniors and youth corp that is all run internally by the department. With Explorers you are really separate but are sponsored by a dept so there are regulations that not only the dept sets but the acutual national boy scouts as well. I know our insurance was through the Boy Scouts so they really had the final say in what we could do.

[Guest]

i am talking about explorers, not junior firefighters, just for some clarification.

[rfdu39 89]

In Port Chester/Rye the explorers respond to working fires only. They cannot respond on the rigs or with blue lights.

[CHIEFPHIL 90]

First, is your program a true explorer post or a cadet program. There is a distinct difference.

Before you start comparing a NY dept to a CT dept, you have to understand all the legalities behind the scenes.

First and formost, what-ever the policy of your department is, you must follow it, it is set up for a reason, usually your safety.

Secondly, if you an explorer post, [14-18] I do not believe you fall under your towns/dept workers comp if you are injured. Whereas if you have a cadet program [16-18] you are part of the fire dept and thus covered by such plans. This is just one such reason why our department decided to go with a cadet program .

As a point of refrence the term cadet replaced junior firefighter in Ct legal terms in the last few years. Cadets are actual members of the department, explorers are not.

Being you are from Connecticut you will fall under the CT Dept of Labor standards concerning minor firefighters, defined as a person between the age of 16-and 17, there is also a section that covers 14-15 as well. Your department was sent these guidlines as well as all 313 fire departments in CT well over 1 year ago.

I believe there was another such topic posted here some time back. I also believe one of my guys posted our entire cadet program here as well.

[Guest]

we are an explorer program, i don't think we have a cadet program.... hmm....

[firemoose827 324]

Hey Zack, just a few things to hopefully help you out.

In NYS there are Explorers, which are a branch of the Boy Scouts of America and are covered under their insurance. So if you guys are explorers, you should have a Boy Scout Rep that meets with your advisors, and there are rules set forth by the Boy Scouts that all posts must use in their by-laws. Someone already touched on a number of them like no interior work, no use of hydraulic or power tools, and one they missed, no climbing ladders over 25 feet.

After those basic rules it falls down to your departments rules and what the advisors and chiefs allow you to do. In my dept our Explorers can ride the front seat of the tanker, engine ( if no firefighters are in it) tower ladder. Otherwise they are to ride in the rescue truck provided there is room, firefighters take priority.

On scene, they can do exterior ops, man outside hose lines, and master streams, help with overhaul provided they are accompanied by a dept officer and advisor, and change air bottles and fetch tools and stuff. Our explorers ride on the ambulance too, they can have CPR and First Aid, and act as an attendant helping the EMT, but they cant drive.

Just like jcoppola stated, Im showing my age too brother!!! When I was 14, a LOOOOOOONG time ago, I joined the "Junior Fire Dept" In Northport, LI. They allowed us to pack up at drills and fight car fires, and go in with an officer to see fire behavior at real fires, and we practised with the Jaws at drills. It was a lot different then, and like jcoppola I also learned a lot from the veterans. Guys who were vollunteers at Northport but also worked for FDNY, I respected the hell out of them and listened to them whenever they spoke, learned a lot too. Ill never forget those Junior days!

What it boils down to is whether or not you are an "Explorer" Post or a Junior Fire Dept, or a Cadet Program, and the rules set down for each as well as whatever your dept has for rules and SOP's.

Hope this helped. Keep learning and dont be too eager to jump into it, enjoy the days as a Junior, learn as much as you can and never be too cocky, and above all, never forget to respect your elders and chiefs, you'll learn a lot from them both.

Good Luck Junior Brother!!

Moose

[ryefd192 2]

To further clarify the Port Chester/ Rye Explorer situation; as already stated, the explorers cannot respond to anything except to fire calls. Working fires mostly, but they have been known to come to some general alarms. Secondly, the explorers cannot ride on apparatus to any call, and can only ride apparatus otherwise with permission from the chief of the department, and this is a very rare occurrence (happened with PCFD a couple times when I was in the Post, never in Rye). If responding to a call, the explorers are not allowed blue lights, and must park at least 1 block away from the incident if they are driving themselves. I hope all this helps.

[sbvfd596 2]

Sam

If you don't remember one of the first explorer meetings that you attended you were all sat down and explained the CT. STATE DEPT. OF LABOR REGULATIONS regarding Explorers and Junior Firefighters.

Just like everyone else said, it's difficult to compare two different agencies that are in two different states.

This topic has been discussed before on here.

It's too bad that I wasn't allowed to respond on calls and go into workers when I was 16 like some of the older guys were.

If you want, talk to your advisor and chief, they both have a copy of the state rules. I know it's unfair and frustrating that you cannot respond, and that all of you are stuck at the station being everyones personal maids. However, when you do turn 18 all of the members of your company will realize that you are a hardworking and dedicated individual who stuck around for a few years cleaning the firehouse and sitting out of drills, and does deserve a spot to ride on the rig. These days it's too risky to allow younger members to respond due to a large amount of accidents while en-route to alarms amongst many other things including liabilities and workmens comp as stated eariler.

Stick around and work hard and things will fall into place for you before you know it. I remember not two long ago I too was posting on here wondering why I have to get stuck at the firehouse, or sitting out at a drill when everyone else gets to play.

[sbvfd596 2]

some backround information on the town of greenwich explorer programs:

The Sound Beach Vol. Fire Dept has an explorer program

The Glenville Vol. Fire Co has an explorer program

GEMS has an explorer Program

GPD has an explorer program

The GEMS explorers I believe are allowed to ride along on the bus if they are at least 16 years of age, some time in the post and are MRT certified. ( I'm sure some EMS people can explain all of that and i'm sure there are restrictions to what they can and can't due)

The police explorers are allowed to do ride-alongs as far as I know, just like any other citizen signing a release form.

Depending upon the circumstance, and okay's from the cheif's I believe explorers are allowed to ride on a rig in the town as long as it is out of service and there is an officer or advisor on board. I know there have been accidents in the past where explorers have been in the rigs. As far as response's, explorers are not allowed to respond, and with the new rules they are not allowed to repack hose or stand on the hosebed. I know the town of darien ct still has a junior program where they have cadet ff's who are at least 16 and are allowed to ride as far as i know.

Hope this answers any further questions

[Guest alsfirefighter]

Just to add on...

In NYS you cannot take any fire training if you are an explorer. Only if you are a "junior firefighter" and that isn't by title alone you must be covered by the NYS VFBL insurance and have parental/guardian permission.

[ryefd192 2]

Just to add on...

In NYS you cannot take any fire training if you are an explorer. Only if you are a "junior firefighter" and that isn't by title alone you must be covered by the NYS VFBL insurance and have parental/guardian permission.

Rye took moves toward this problem; I was the first person in a program in which if you are an explorer, at 17 you can become a member of the department. You still have the limited privileges as an explorer, but you are able to get into training at 17 so when you turn 18 you can become a full member of the department right away. It is a way to be an explorer and be allowed to take training classes. I took Rescue Airbags and then FF1 while 17 (I turned 18 during FF1).

[fitzjr11 17]

Lake Carmel's Explorers use to be allowed to respond to calls, but was stopped several years ago when Jrs/Explorers were being killed in car accidents, fire truck accidents- it started w/ Chris Kangas from PA who was hi by a car while riding his bicycle to the fd for a call. Our Chief at that time decided that since the Explorers could not do much at the scene, why risk them comming. Basically a proactive approach, our explorers at the time did not like the idea however. If the explorers are at the fire house when a call comes in, they may get on certain apparatus, pending approval from LT and that they are not bumping a fire fighter. Once at a scene, explorers may not pass the closest fire truck and can assist w/ rehab and changing SCOTT packs.

I know in more rural areas, Explorers respond to calls because of man power issues.