Intermediate ICS Evening Courses - QUESTION

[helicopper 1,050]

There have been several evening based ICS Intermediate (I-300) courses scheduled around the area on an evening schedule to accommodate those who cannot attend three consecutive workdays and all have been cancelled due to inadequate enrollment.

My question - where is everyone? According to NIMS, at least someone from every agency should take the course for compliance (in reality, there are probably 4-5 people in most agencies who would really benefit from it) but we haven't been able to fill one yet. I must also point out that there's no problem filling the day courses so the need must exist.

Are we ignoring this training because it is ICS or required by NIMS? Is there some other reason we're not able to fill these classes? This is probably a slightly biased opinion but the 300 course really gives people a leg up on applying ICS, especially for bigger than normal incidents. With more training requirements trickling down from NIMS every year, this isn't going to go away.

Inquiring minds want to know! What's the deal?

[Guest alsfirefighter]

Good question Chris. I had an I-200 schedule earlier in the year and had to cancel due to lack of students.

I-300 is a good course to have and really reinforces the principles of ICS and gets into more detailed needs when dealing with larger scale incidents and isn't available on-line.

Speaking of on-line ICS courses...I cannot stress enough again how it is night and day to take it on-line in generic form, compared to the classroom setting where we can bring it to the emergency service everyday level and show how it actually works better then what some are kidding themselves is incident command. It assists immensely with accountability, personnel efficiency and countless other ways....when you are actually using it properly.

[ex-commish 490]

Good question Chris. I had an I-200 schedule earlier in the year and had to cancel due to lack of students.

I-300 is a good course to have and really reinforces the principles of ICS and gets into more detailed needs when dealing with larger scale incidents and isn't available on-line.

Speaking of on-line ICS courses...I cannot stress enough again how it is night and day to take it on-line in generic form, compared to the classroom setting where we can bring it to the emergency service everyday level and show how it actually works better then what some are kidding themselves is incident command. It assists immensely with accountability, personnel efficiency and countless other ways....when you are actually using it properly.

This is very true. Nothing like a classroom setting which allows for questions and discussion. On-line training can be good for re-inforcing what you have learned in class.

[helicopper 1,050]

I laughed when I heard that they were going to do ICS training online. The whole basis of ICS is communication and coordination - how do you train for that staring at your computer screen? LOL.

"As specified in HSPD 5, NIMS compliance is a requirement to receive Federal preparedness awards, in the form of grants, cooperative agreements and direct contracts. The requirements for compliance to recipients of these awards, including the DHS Homeland Security Grant Program have been established annually since FY 2005. These requirements mandate that recipients of these awards will be NIMS compliant as a condition of the grant award."

FEMA just put out the above guidance about NIMS compliance requirements. No compliance, no money (grants, direct aid, etc.). Not a complicated equation.

[helicopper 1,050]

BUMP - among the users and lurkers on this board, is there any interest in an evening based ICS Intermediate Course? If there is, efforts will be made to schedule one before the end of the year.

[20Truck 7]

BUMP - among the users and lurkers on this board, is there any interest in an evening based ICS Intermediate Course? If there is, efforts will be made to schedule one before the end of the year.

Affirmative.

[Remember585 815]

I-300 right? I'd be interested assuming I can make it. I work the same tours as the guy that posted above me.

[20Truck 7]

Is it possible to finish I-300 in one night?

[helicopper 1,050]

Is it possible to finish I-300 in one night?

Considering that it is a 24 hour class, I'd say it is highly unlikely.

Generally, it's given over 3 full days. The evening based course is given in four evening sessions and one full day on a weekend.

Edited October 21, 2007 by Chris192

[tunaFish 0]

Affirmative.

That is a discriminatory picture.

You find it humorous?

[antiquefirelt 994]

No different up here. I just finished teaching both IS 300 and IS 400 and they were both poorly attended. Many depts are hoping it will go away. I can understand many vol. depts not being able to get their personnel to these classes given the reality of other necessary training. Most towns haven't begun to try to become NIMS compliant.

[Guest alsfirefighter]

Chris, I'm actually surprised you don't teach I-300. I'll email you today to run an idea I have by you.

Tuna....I'm not sure what your referring to, but I'm going off memory and if I'm right...it was not discrimanatory at all. If truck had the picture of an individual I'm thinking of, there is hardly anything you put in front of that man that could come close to the racial discrimination that he breeds and stokes.

[helicopper 1,050]

I'm obviously missing a picture somewhere... Oh well.

So it seems that among the 1000 or so active members only four want to take an I-300 in the evening???

No wonder we can't get it scheduled.

If there's more interest we may have some success in getting one at the training center in January or February. Come on, people - let us know!!!

[Monty 35]

I'm obviously missing a picture somewhere... Oh well.

So it seems that among the 1000 or so active members only four want to take an I-300 in the evening???

No wonder we can't get it scheduled.

If there's more interest we may have some success in getting one at the training center in January or February. Come on, people - let us know!!!

I don't need it - but would be interested. Is it feasible to offer it over a weekend? Or a couple of weekends? As it's a 24 hour class, 7-11pm seems to be about the norm (personally I have difficulty with classes before 7pm, especially if it's a series) - so that's 6 nights of class. Maybe the problem is that they're evening classes and they're aimed at Senior Leadership - and they have all those other events they're committed to .....

Unlikely, but maybe some agencies are saying we don't get any grants, we'll never use NIMS, so why bother? Or they're just applying for grants and ignoring the fact they're not trained / certified.

[hawkbase 21]

I'm interested! 4 nights and a weekend day sound feasible to me!

[helicopper 1,050]

I don't need it - but would be interested. Is it feasible to offer it over a weekend? Or a couple of weekends? As it's a 24 hour class, 7-11pm seems to be about the norm (personally I have difficulty with classes before 7pm, especially if it's a series) - so that's 6 nights of class. Maybe the problem is that they're evening classes and they're aimed at Senior Leadership - and they have all those other events they're committed to .....

Unlikely, but maybe some agencies are saying we don't get any grants, we'll never use NIMS, so why bother? Or they're just applying for grants and ignoring the fact they're not trained / certified.

Points taken about the scheduling.

As for "we'll never use NIMS"... Are you an FD/PD/EMS agency? Then you use NIMS almost everyday - at the very least the ICS component - for your own operations and any mutual aid response that you're involved with. If you have an event that will go on for more than a single operational period an agency will benefit from the concepts in the ICS intermediate course. It's all about planning, resource management, coordination, etc. Again, that sounds like stuff we do everyday!

So, to all those naysayers who think they don't need NIMS - think again. We've been doing the concepts in NIMS since before it was called NIMS. They just put it all together into a nice federal package for us.