Westchester 911, Who answers your call?

[Guest]

When you need help for a Police, Fire, or Medical Emergency you call 911.

Who answers your call for help?

In Westchester County your 911 call goes to the police department of the city, town, or village that you are calling from.

What happens when you're calling for a Medical Emergency: Heart Attack, Cardiac Arrest, Chest Pains, Choking, Bleeding, Drowning, or woman in Labor?

In some Westchester County Cities, Towns, and Villages your call is answered by or quickly transferred to a 911 EMD (Emergency Medical Dispatcher) they are trained in lifesaving information to assist you the 911 caller in emergencies such as giving instructions on how to administer CPR for someone whose heart has stopped. Unfortunately that's not made available to all Westchester residents.

Why is this? It's because not every City, Town, or Village in Westchester County has trained 911 EMD Dispatchers. In fact some such as your local police department who answer your initial 911 call do not even transfer the call to a 911 EMD Dispatcher such as the Westchester County Department of Emergency Services.

EXAMPLE: If you live in the City of Yonkers and you dial 911 your call will be answered by the Yonkers Police Department and your Medical Emergency call will be transferred to Empress Ambulance, they are the 911 EMS provider for the City of Yonkers. The dispatchers at Empress are EMD trained and will give you LIFE SAVING INSTRUCTIONS over the phone while you await emergency

personnel to arrive.

HOW COME ALL WESTCHESTER RESIDENTS DO NOT HAVE THE SAME

LEVEL OF SERVICE AVAILABLE WHEN YOU DIAL 911?

That is something we should ALL be concerned with not only because we are emergency service providers such as Police Officers, Firefighters, EMT's, and Paramedics but because WE LIVE HERE!

Westchester 911, Who answers your call?

[RWC130 594]

NICE POST! WOW.... :roll:

Glad I live in Peekskill where Fire / EMS is dispatched by 60-Control.

If my family member was in cardiac arrest I would hate to hear

"Help is on the way" and wait.... 3, 5, 10, 15 minutes.

[Stench60 29]

Thank the PD's. When the system was setup they're the group that had, and still have, the political muscle to force so many PSAP's. The system was flawed from the moment the police agencies required that they each receive their own 911 calls and not have them go to a central answering point.

[Guest alsfirefighter]

RWC, if you knew exactly what often goes on you'd might want to retract that statement. Most of the 911 calls for fire or medical are not transferred to 60 control directly nor properly. And it often results in delay in dispatch of over a minute, and often improper and incomplete address and call information leading to further delays and frustration.

[mikeinet 37]

I agree with your entire statment. Though, I feel the whole EMS system in westchester has issues...not just central dispatching.

If you look at CNY EMS dispatching (IE: Onondaga County) - Every Ambulance call is dispatched as a Priority. ALS is sent based on the priority automatically... Not based on the responding crew's disgression.

Everything needs to be more centralized overall, though it's hard to just sit down and do that. it's something that has to be done gradually over time.

[RWC130 594]

RWC, if you knew exactly what often goes on you'd might want to retract that statement.

ALS, I know exactly what goes on and I appreciate your doubt in what I know and or concern.

Yes, at times PPD does not transfer the calls, Not saying it's right. It's not! The point I was trying to make regarding this thread was Peekskill for the most part has a good 911 system between Police taking the call and 60-Control dispatching Fire-EMS. Everyone has problems that need to be worked out. Some are better than others.

I was once at the other end of the phone, the 911 caller. Cardiac Arrest at my house. The system worked great! Police, Fire, and EMS. Don't be so quick to bash a system which YOU are a part of.

If you have an issue and it sounds like a good one do something about it. We are all good a bitching!

A Concerned FF makes a great point in some Westchester areas

you get nothing. No EMD... Is that right?

[Guest DFFD227]

I gotta say in small villages PD is the way to go.

[Remember585 815]

In what ways do you think that DFFD?

I am from a small Village. Our PD is our dispatchers and the system we have is antiquated. I am not taking anything away from the job the PD does. They are good Police Officers and generally work well with us. However, they are not equipped, trained or manned enough to handle everything expected of them. And you know what - they shouldn't have to be!!!

They are not hired to be dispatchers. They are Police Officers. There is no reason at all that they should be stuck with dispatching Fire and EMS as well. We run about 800 EMS calls per year, and I would say that 90% of the time, they follow us on the air and monitor our activities. BUT - that other 10% of the time, things get too busy in HQ to pay attention to us. There's times where they have an arrest going on, or a pursuit or another critical matter that takes priority over listening to EMS. Then what? If we keep calling them they usually turn the radio down so they can worry about their situation. And its understandable.

How about from the Fire end? We have set response assignments for different types of calls and different areas of our district. Again, about 80-90% of the time they get the assignment right, but what about the other 10-20% of the time? There's been several incidents where we have had the wrong first due engine sent, no ladder, no rescue, or in a recent case - only an engine for a confirmed fire!!! People argue that we, the FD, should know our own assignments. But why should we have to deal with this? We should be dispatched by a proven, more suitable system then rolodex and memory.

We also run into problems where the wrong tones are used, they acknowledge the wrong units, they don't dispatch us when we should be and worse yet - they ignore us!

I am positive that others on this board whom are of the progressive and proactive mindset will agree with me that a central dispatching point for fire and EMS is the way to go. The current system is outdated and unreliable. Mutual Aid requests are suppost to go thru 60 Control. Why not get dispatched from one place that has the capabilities to do all of this and beyond?

Spend some more time in this field, DFFD, and you will see where we're all coming from.

[DMA327 12]

AMEN!

[Guest DFFD227]

Remember, I completely agree with you, In Dobbs our Police Officers are the same, everyone knows everyone, they do a great job, and for dispatching they do a great job too! But perhaps your right, they lack the goodies that 60 - Control has, but they do provide good, fast and accurate services for our Fire and EMS. The Police shouldn't have to dispatch, your are 100% right on that, but if it's a fast way then why not? Every second counts, right?

I have been a Junior for a few years in the DFFD and before that I have monitored scanners before I joined, and for the most part I see, and listen how the police do there dispatching job. Our Dispatching center is in the same building as our Station 1 headquarters. Our PD is very good at monitoring 46.26 whenever our apparatus sign on they talk back and give us reassurance that they are there listening to us, and for our police to do that is really great!

For us, we have 4 different tones. Different tone for Ogden Engine, Different tone for Livingston Engine, Different tone for Resolute Hook and Ladder, and a general alarm tone. Whenever there is a company call needed, like a stuck occupied elevator, or a wash down, they will send a single company assignment. Most calls in Dobbs Ferry are full assignments, 2 engines 1 truck. 2 engines 1 truck for an activated fire alarm, 2 engines 1 truck for an Co detector, 2 engines 1 truck for smoke investigations, 2 engines 1 truck for any reported or working fires. I have noticed Croton with the new tones, and It's really easy to see those problems that may occur.

I think your right about a more organized and prepared dispatching center, but I have learned from experience that direct calls to the PD can prove a faster response time. I have called 911 a few times for the fire dept., and within a minute the tones are put out and it's a faster response time. I just like the fact calling 911 and finding my local police sergeant picking up the phone and knowing exactly whats up is really great. It's a nice local feeling. But is it really worth it if I call 911 and I get Croton Police and tell them I have a house burning, and Croton police then sends the info to 60 control, so 60 can do it? Thats a lot of time lost by the time everything is put into place. I think that once the tones go out by the police and it is a confirmed working fire, I believe that 60 - Control has every right to take over, and thats where the beautiful technology comes in because then 60 can provide mutual aid, and handle all the advance stuff from there.

Remember I know exactly where your coming from, and I know you are a dispatcher, and a very good one, and I respect that, I just think that if PD dispatch it could be a lot faster in a time of chaos. I'm just really concerned about response times thats all... Just my Opinion.

[tbendick 27]

DFFD227.

I think what most people would love to see is less PSAPs. So when you call 911 you goto the Dispatch center which is the same location as the Dispatcher.

Most small PD's that do Fire or EMS Dispatch don't dedicate people to this function as well most don't have EMD.. I would love to see NYS pass the same laws as CT to require EMD.

Also how many PD's would consider adding EMS or Fire to the CAD systems and MDT systems for better tracking.

With 60-Control who has a common goal the more people on-line the more we can do.. Maybe after the new Radio System goes on-line sometime in the next 10 years people might see how it works. And then maybe 60-Control can grow to the Central Dispatch Center that it should be.

Last thought.. If you Fire or EMS agency wants to be Dispatch by someone other then 60 then you should get off 46.26 and other county wide freqs..

[Guest alsfirefighter]

RWC: I'm not bashing any system. I'm speaking the truth, and I am at the forefront of the argument with my position within the system. 98% of the total 911 call volume for fire and/or ems does not get transferred down to county control. And that is a conservative number, which if I had my numbers may even be worse. As far as your comment of doing something about, rest assured that I bring it up often every chance I get in a meeting, which is more then I can say of how the problem has compounded over the years and shrugged off, and I quote "its been that way since we got 911, and it will always be that way." And not to get overly into it, we all know who are the proactive and forward thinkers in the "system" and who isn't and doesn't like those who are.

DFFD, excellent posts. Those are the 2 best posts I've seen you write! You do have some reasonable points. However, NENA and the federal gov't commission on 911 recommends one central answering point. As well, if the 911 call is transferred correctly, you don't lose "alot" of time. Only the time it takes to push a button and have the other call taker pick up. What waste time is sending a car out at the same time. Direct dialing 60 control and then giving only pieces of information, etc. The fact is we probably lose more seconds with the system the way it is, and with incomplete info then we do with all the PSAP's. Additionally, there are a low percentage of calls where "seconds" count. And I'm willing to bet if they did do a study there would be no time difference noteworthy between a PD dispatching and 60 sending out a call.

[dc2t 80]

What is the actual percentage of 911 calls vs the 7 digit number.

I see more 7 digit calls vs 911. Also the more hands that process the call the response time is increased.

[Guest DG795]

maybe remember585 or another dispatcher can clarify this for me...

if a PD PSAP transfers the call, the ANI/ALI info is tranferred as well, including original call time.

By the PD hanging up and calling control themselves, none of this info would be transferred, keeping the original call time a "secret".

Could this be a viable theory??????? Food for thought.

Im not making any comment on positive or negative intent, just questioning if this is technically possible.

[Mofire24 27]

As someone that has worked both as a fire dispatcher and now currently as a police dispatcher I we get 911 calls alot of them being accident or false calls but when a medical or fire emergency comes in i do transfer it to the proper agency I have no problem doing so some times you cant transfer the call because you can bearly keep the person on the phone. You shouldnt take the main answering point away from the pd cause what's going to happen when you get a 911 call for a robbery or such your not going to send an engine obiviously there is alot of info they you might be able to get out of the caller no matter what the emergency. Some cities and villages and towns will not give up the 911 to a central point take yonkers for instance both the fire and PD are very busy agencies and might aswell be there own county. For the agencies that due get dispatched by fire control it is an asset because of the emd system. This is something that wont ever change.

[x635 4,066]

I want to say a million things in response to this topic, but I'm too tired to type it all.

The way the 911 phone and radio system in this county works is not only embarrasing, but it is quite dangerous to us all. How can we continue to live like this?

I don't see anything improving anytime soon in this county. Before any change can come, the county needs to step up to the plate, and prove to the field people that they want to and are capable of handling a centralized 911 operation. The way the things run now, its not possible. By this I mean they need to enact legislation, improve facilities and equipment, better organize and supervise their communications operations, enact standard protocols for everyone, improve training, improve agency relations/public outreach and most importanly, improve pay and increase morale for the 60 Control dispatchers. These guys and gals jobs are incredibly high stress and complicated, and continue to get more so each day with all the different ways of doing things in this county, and by the total lack of respect, appreciation, and thanks that they get by those in the field and others..

People in the field need to learn to put aside their control issues, make comprimises, and learn to work together. And respect each other on the air. And be professional on the air.

Another thing to consider....how much time and money is spent by the agencies that choose to dispatch themselves????? Money that could probaly be better allocated elsewhere.

Unfortunetly, simple nursery school principles are out, and chaos is in. A professional, organized, allied, responsive communications system, what keeps holding us back????? Beuracracy and tradition, IMO.

I'm not going to even get into the radio system...........yet. LOL

[x635 4,066]

Oh, in addition to my above post.........EMD for the most part IMO is useless if we are not going to use it to Priority dispatch.

EMD IS NOT JUST PRE-ARRIVAL INSTRUCTIONS!!!!!!!!!!

We need to realize that there is more to EMD than just that!!

[Guest alsfirefighter]

Westchester emergency services...100's of years of tradition unimpeded by tradition. And tradition is good for 2 things, reminding you where you need to go and stopping you from getting there....

Mofire, decent points, but then how do you explain why it works so well in so many other places? And I'm speaking on a county level. If the 3 major cities want to keep there 911 I can understand that totally, but there is no reason why 60 control shouldn't be a central agency. The argument about what if there is a robbery BS means nothing to me. Why is it ok for them to answer a medical call, but not ok for a central agency to answer 911 calls for police agency contacts? Why are there cities with larger populations then Westchester have simple call takers who then transfer the calls to the appropriate agency dispatcher and that works? I'm willing to bet that if they expanded control to accomplish what many think should happen, they would be more apt to receive training and to perform functions to support what the PD's would want then the other way around. Where I was PD in Viriginia and surrounding depts. all sent their dispatchers to an academy. Why isn't that the case here? Things won't change because there are those whom are still more worried about their ego's and who's doing what then accomplishing what is best for those we serve.

As far as the more hands involved comment. I disagree. Transferring a call via 911 takes only few seconds when done correctly. Depending on whom's opinion you take on what is a response time, it doesn't add on to it. (up front this isn't a bash) Considering the amount of all volunteer agencies in the county, and at any given time varying response times. How can we use that argument in regard to dispatching?

[mikeinet 37]

In Onondaga County the 911 center dispatches police/fire for the entire county (that includes the City of Syracuse Police & Fire) -- Rural/Metro Medical Services dispatch their own calls though in which case a 911 EMS call for the city is forwarded to them.

All local out-of-syracuse calls go to this one centralized dispatch center.

It's quite the ideal setup and I personally have not seen any problems with it. It's something to look after for an example.

[TRUCK6018 50]

Another thing to consider....how much time and money is spent by the agencies that choose to dispatch themselves?????

Too Much!!!!!

Money that could probaly be better allocated elsewhere.  

There's an election coming up in my town in less than two months. Would you be interested in running???

[Guest]

RWC130, MoFire24, you brought up some good points.

I don't feel the PSAP should be taken away from the PD's case and

point as you mentioned the robbery. But flip the coin when you have a caller reporting a cardiac arrest and you don't have EMD trained 911 operators. The call is taken directly by the PD not transferred to anyone who is medically trained to help them. That is the issue I have!!!

I feel the county 911 system as it is set up now should be able to function effectively however some changes need to me made. The points alsfirefighter made are true, some calls that come in are not properly handled by PD's. That is a serious issue which needs to be dealt with. If it's not being handled than that is an even bigger issue.

IF YOU ARE NOT PART OF THE SOLUTION, YOU MIGHT BE PART OF THE PROBLEM!

[chazEMT 5]

As a 911 Dispatcher for a PD here in Westchester County, I can see the potential probs with 911 going to a central point in the county...TRAINING TRAINING TRAINING first of all!!

The PD I work for is the PSAP for the town...we handle all incoming E911 calls...police, fire, EMS. We're EMD trained, and we dispatch PD and EMS. Fire calls are transferred to the appropriate agency.

The big problem with one agency taking the 911 call, then gathering the info, and passing it along to the appropriate agency is it turns into a game of "telephone," and info gets lost or changed in the process. I've unfortunately gotten calls from other agencies quite often telling me of an emergency in my jurisdiction called into their agency, and the only thing they can tell me is where it is, and the only sketchy details of what the emergency is...no callback number for the complainant, or whether there are weapons involved, or if the patient is conscious, etc. Direct E911 transfers work for the most part, however, the callers want their call answered NOW, not to be told "hang on, I'm transferring you to the Fire Dept." Also, two other problems that arise: the original operator who answered the call must stay on the line while the operator to whom the call was transferred gets the info until the call is terminated...which does not always happen; and I can't tell you how many times I've transferred out a 911 call, only to have the receiving point ring on and on!

Should all areas have access to E911, with trained, COMPETENT, Emergency Medical Dispatchers?? DEFINITELY! Would I feel comfortable with 60 Control handling Police emergency calls? NO. And not because I doubt the comptency of 60 Control's personnel...quite the opposite, my hat's off to all of 'em. But their purpose and expertise lies in Fire/EMS dispatch, and they've got quite a workload as it is!

Sorry I've rambled on...just wanted to throw my 2cents in.

[firebuff08 29]

After reading all of the posts on this subject, I just can not believe how slow Westchester County is to catch up with the rest of the world. Back in the late 1970's and early 1980's I was Chairman of the Communications Committee for the Westchester EMS Council and I served on two 911 study committees appointed by then County Executive DelBello. The same arguments against centralizing dispatch that are being made now were being made then. At the time, Westchester still did not have 911, though most populated area of the country did. I now live in CT and work in a PD based PSAP (we roll 911 calls for fire and ems to fire). CT has had 911 since the late 1960's. Here 911 is funded by the STate and the equipment is identical at all 106 PSAP's in the state. Training is given by and mandated by the State.

The biggest problem in Westchester as I see it now and as I saw it back in the 80's was too many chiefs of too many small and inefficient political entities. Back then and probably the same now, the 6 villages in Greenburgh, for example, has an officer on the desk dispatching and as few as 2 officers on the street. The town could have taken over dispatching for all of them without barely increasing the workload at the Town PD dispatch center.

The fewer the number of PSAPs, the fewer the number of transfers and lost calls. (Yeah, we have too many PSAP's here in Connecticut as well). At least we do not have as much duplication of services. Because we do not have counties (other than lines on a map) there is no county PD. You have two of the best examples of centralized fire and ems dispatch right in your own backyard...44 Control in Rockland County and Dutchess County Fire. Every call is dispatched in a precise, organized manner and there is clear, central control of the radio channels. Both Rockland and Dutchess have been doing it that way for 30 to 40 years!!! Why does everyone in Westchester want to reinvent the wheel?

[x635 4,066]

Some excellent posts on this thread.

I enjoyed that insight about the past, firebuff08. It seems like the more things change, the more things stay the same in this county. People's egos and other immature tatics put up a big wall to progress IMO, in this county. If people learned to work together, to stop duplicating services, and to combine infastrucutre, we could save millions upon millions that could be better applied elsewhere.

The reason why the PSAP system doesnt work efficiently and safely in this county is because (most) people dont want to work together and/or give up "control".

[pjm1733 22]

]

one thing is for sure all fires will go out eventually

train hard train often

emt bravo thanks for the forum =D>

edited

[Guest]

PJM1733, YOU HAVE MY VOTE FOR COUNTY EXECUTIVE!

EXCELLENT INPUT AND VIEWS. IT'S QUITE OBVIOUS

THE WESTCHESTER 911 SYSTEM HAS IT'S FLAWS.

TOO BAD NOT ENOUGH PEOPLE KNOW ABOUT IT.

EVERYONE JUST ASSUMES YOU 911 AND THE POLICE, FIRE,

EMS SHOW UP. NOT THE CASE! ANYONE WHO HAS A SCANNER

MIGHT KNOW THE TRUTH. IT'S SCARY!

I LIKE THE CONCEPT OF A "CENTRALIZED" 911 PSAP

BUT THAT WOULD MAKE SENSE AND IN WESTCHESTER WE

DON'T DARE DO A THING LIKE THAT!

[Guest DFFD227]

Great Post....AMEN!