Why No Ladder Pipe?

[x635 4,066]

I'm curious as to departments that spec their straight sticks without a ladderpipe.

I know many cities that do it, and I always see photos of "the big one" where a manual ladder pipe (hose, hose straps, and large nozzle) has to be put in place.

Why don't departments spend a couple of thousand dollars extra to have prepiped waterways to save time and energy. I know the cons include added ladder weight ,maintenance and operational issues- plus cost.

I know in this area we have plenty of tower ladders, but sometimes the straight stick is able to get where those monstrosities can't.

[IzzyEng4 427]

I'm curious as to departments that spec their straight sticks without a ladderpipe.

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If you look at NYC, Boston and Yonkers for example (I'm more familiar with NYC & Boston) It depends how they use their aerials. For many years before Smeal and other companies came out with the pinnable water way and now the motorized retractable, the pre-pipes were connected permanently to one fly of an aerial and this cause problems with access to the tip of the ladder.

If you look at pictures from the 80's and 90's where the old style ladder pipes were still in use, you can see the problems when putting an aerial up to a roof on a steep angle and the gap between the aerial and side of the building. Also look at trying to place the tip of an aerial with the older devices into a window, plus it was on less thing to get in the way, like spotlights at the tips of the aerials.

Since aerial ladders in these towns were utilized more for rescue and egress situation and "water tower" operation were secondary then I can see them not being purchased. With pinnable and movable waterways now, I think it is feasible to purchase them on aerial since they area much safer than running a hose and clamping down the nozzle on the aerial. I was a witness back in 1995 to a catastrophic failure to a clamp down pipe an nozzle where a member of my department was thrown from the aerial, so I'm a firm believer in pre-pipes.

[JetPhoto 626]

It depends how they use their aerials.

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Excellent points Izzy!

[Oswegowind 17]

This is another great question...especially for Yonkers FD personnel. Why do none of the straight sticks come prepiped? Just wondering... There have been numerous fires in which I was at as an EMT and thought that it was odd to see them hosed up with a long rope controlling the angle of the stream. Of course than I researched it and learned that was the way it was done for so long until ladders started coming with prepiping and lots of other cool features...like live video from the top, thermal imaging and all the other cool technology that has come to us over the past few years. As well I think it is nice to have a tower ladder or two but Northern Westchester is becoming a little overload with them NO??? In my immediate vicinity I think L51, L35, and L10 are the only sticks left...all others have gone to the elevator ride. (LT8, L45, L46, L44 are just some I can think off of the cuff).

[Future Fireman 4]

Seth, I agree with you on this one. Ladder pipes really should be made standard on ALL aerials. Not only would it help in the event of 'the big one', but some places the straight stick can go down ( like extend the aerial down an alley) and set up a water pipe where the area is too narrow for a platform.

Just my opinion

Mike

[Guest partyrock]

Seth, I agree with you on this one. Ladder pipes really should be made standard on ALL aerials. Not only would it help in the event of 'the big one', but some places the straight stick can go down ( like extend the aerial down an alley) and set up a water pipe where the area is too narrow for a platform.

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If you've got an alley too narrow for a bucket, good luck getting your stick in there. Radant heat from from the fire is going to roast whatever you put in that small of a space. Also, how would you direct your stream into any of the windows. At best you'd be hitting the wall two feet into the room.

Down here you probably won't be seeing pre-piped sticks any time soon. The few times we do wind up running hose, its a defensive operation so you should be taking the time to do it right and do it safely. Besides we have a hard enough time keeping sticks in service without worrying about ladder pipes.