Does Low Bid Really Exist?

[x635 4,066]

I'm curious, does the low bid process really exist in the apparatus world?

It seems to me that departments get what they want, and that there are tons of loopholes in the process that allow that to happen.

Also, another issue I see is salesmen who write specs for FD's that ony their company can meet and/or build.

Of course, there are departments that are strictly low bid, but I don't know of many.

[CFD320 35]

I assume you are referring specifically to apparatus...? If not go walk through the Grand Street Firehouse in Croton, you can see low bid construction at it's worst.

[Reliance 29]

I assume you are referring specifically to apparatus...?  If not go walk through the Grand Street Firehouse in Croton, you can see low bid construction at it's worst.

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Low bid means it all depends on who is paying the bill.

One department up here had a committee to spec a truck and changes were made that the committee were not happy about but since they don't pay the bill it's up to town council who approves the tender.

THe other question is How many town Fathers and councillors actually have ever used the truck being spec'd

[Guest]

In my department we did do something along these lines. In order to make a purchase over X dollars we must receive at least 3 bids. While specking our last truck we worked very closely with one company to help design the truck. We then put the bid out and only received one bid back. However, because of our by law stating we need at least 3 bids, we had to redo the bid process to get at least another 2 bids on the rig. We talked the company that had helped us out and they said it would be all right for us to put the rig back out to bid in order to get at least 3 bids on the rig. However, before we put the bid out a second time we talked with several other companies about what needs to be done to make the specs so that all companies, if they wanted to, could bid on it and meet the specks. When we put the bid back out, we received 3 bids in total, and chose the truck we felt was best for our needs. This company was not the company we had worked with throughout the process but was a company that gave a very competitive number and met our specs.

[ryefd192 2]

I believe low bid should exist assuming there are no extenuating circumstances. For instance; in Rye we have quite a few railroad bridges which most ladders will not fit under. So when we were looking for a new ladder, we had to take into account the height of these bridges. From my recolection, the Ladder we now have (and the similar one on order) were the only ones that could meet the height requirements as well as the other specs necessary. We ended up needed to find other bids for the latest one, but were able to show that the one was the only one that fit the bill. So once again...in a perfect environment, where you don't have low bridges, or narrow streets, or weight restrictions on roads, yes the lowest bid (as long as it is a reliable name) should be highly considered.

[Guest partyrock]

I strongly suggest you take a look into the apperatus ordering procdure. Its an intertesting process. I know I've seen a spec compnay posting on here a few times, east west fire apperatus consutants(something like that). Maybe they would be willing to show you the ropes.

The bidding process like everything else set up by government agencies has loopholes in it so people can get what they want. Any time someone complains that the work done or vehicle built is crap because of low bid is mistaken. Its the spec that was written that resulted in the crappy product.

The biggest flaw with low bid is that it entices the bidders to cut corners to keep their prices down. Your job is to specify performance evaluators, specific components, materials, tollerances, etc to ensure you get the quality of product you desire.

Apperatus companies have certain products and construction techniques that are unique to them. The right combination of these proprietary products and you can guide a bid towards a specific comany. Any company can still bid however, they just have to take exception with things they cannot accomodate and offer an alternative (there's a word or phrase for this, but it escapes me). The purchasing agency can set limitation on the exceptions and choose wether or not to allow certain exceptions.

If you truely want the best vehicle for your money the way to do it is find out what you need, and get specific about what you're going to to allow and require from the product. Thats where spec consultants come in. They have close relationships with all the players and can tell you honestly and give an unbiased perspective. They know which products are truely equal replacements for exceptions and when its just a rep trying to give their product the edge in bidding.

If your as stuck as rye apparently was, then hopefully its a good product and you have no regrets. Rye situation also allows them some manuvering in the bidding process because their requirements are so speific an ddictated by factors outside their control.