Mutual Aid Pumper

[ddoyle195 8]

In September 2006 my fire department (Doyle Hose Company No. 1, Cheektowaga, NY) took delivery of a E-One Typhoon Rescue pumper 1500gpm, 780gal, seating a total of eight firefighters, five of those seats accomodate air packs. This truck you've seen in Fire/Rescue, 1st responder Broadcast Network, and Fire Apparatus Magazine. We use to respopnd with our Engine 2 for mutual aid and this truck pretty much has everything we needed for mutual aid. Doyle Engine 2 also carries two preconnected Hurst Maverick tools and a Hurst Ram, Foam Pro system with two 35 gallon foam cells. The new pumper Doyle Engine 1 does not have an onboard foam system, nor does it carry the Hydraulic tools like Engine 2 does.

On a fire we mutual aided to for the Village of Sloan, NY back in late January early February there were a couple of tools we needed on that fire we could have used: a Little Giant ladder and a Dry wall hook. The little giant ladder eventually we used from our substation Doyle Hose Company No. 2 off their Rescue 7, but the Dry wall hook we did get and we used statndard Pike poles and Closet hooks to rip out some walls from the exterior of a small roof on the #3 side of the structure.

My question to you folks out there is this: 1) What tools and equipment do you carry on your mutual aid pumper, 2) Also the quantity of each of the tools. The good news is that a new Dry Wall hook from Fire Hooks Unlimited should be showing up any day now, however I don't know if we would be able to get a Little Giant ladder on our Engine 1. The reason why we send our Engine 1 for Mutual aid is because thats one of the things we designed the rig for. Doyle Engine 2 has been a work horse from when we got it in 1999-september 2006. We've put quiote a few miles and pump hours on that truck and it has responded fantastic for us. However we need the longevity out of that truck being that it runs all Motor Vehicle Accidents in our district along with Doyle 2's Rescue 7. We were also taking away the ability of Auto Extrication out of Doyle 1 if we were mutual aided.

I'm not saying Engine 1 cannot handle the job, but I always look to improve things and our situation and I look forward to you fellow brothers for some helpful idea's.

[Guest]

How about BEEF on a Weck?

[Remember585 815]

Not a bad question, asking what others carry. We have three Engine Companies, all of which are relatively similar but unique from each other at the same time. Our rigs are designed for our community and the needs we face daily. Over time we have learned that it is almost impossible to carry everything you'll ever need, but we do come close.

Our E118 is a 1993 HME/Saulsbury with a 1250 GPM pump, 1000 gallon water and 100 gallon foam tank. It has seating capable for eight but it is a little cramped. E118 carries the basic hand tool assortment - irons, brush tools, etc. plus specialized foam nozzles and equipment, a portable pump, Holmatro HCT3120 extrication tool, Ecco Quik-Vent chain saw, portable generator light and a Milwaukee Saw-zall. CFD320 should be able to elaborate.

Engine 119 is our 2006 Seagrave. It has a 1500 GPM pump with a 750 gallon water tank that can seat eight. This rig is our primary FAST unit and has been used to cover the Rescue and our Truck. It has a 10 KW hydraulic generator, multiple 500W flood lights, a 35' ground ladder, Little Giant ladder, NY Roof hooks, 4 pairs of irons, multiple other hand and brush tools. It also has a TIC, Multi-Gas meter, 2 Sawzalls (corded and cordless), Ecco Quik-Vent, K12 saw and Stihl saw, Holmatro HCT3120 extrication tool, stokes, ropes and other gear for the FAST.

Engine 120 is our Rescue-Pumper. It is a 2003 ALF with a 2000 GPM pump and a 1000 gallon tank. It carries the usual engine equipment plus a Hurst portable power unit and combi-tool.

I almost forgot all three Engines carry fans also. Over time our Engines have grown from nothing more then just pumpers to multi-versatile rigs well-stocked for almost anything we need. I believe we have multi-gas meters on order for the other two engines to further our abilities.

[Guest partyrock]

Good rule of thumb, don't send a mutual aid rig with anything less than you would expect showing up to your assignments. What I don't understand is why wouldn't you have a dry-wall hook on that rig? Its not particularly expensive and I'm assuming its standard equipment in your Co. The little giant is a nice tool, but like a dry wall hook, both are easy to get around without. Residential, an 6ft hook and irons are enough to gut the place. Commercial throw me a the 8ft. Still can't reach it, grab the attic ladder.

Thanks benz for the edit. I still think its a pretty good post for stupid o'clock in the morning

Edited April 2, 2007 by partyrock

[CHIEFPHIL 90]

Our Engines are pretty much set up the same.. each has a primary role in town as well as mutual aid:

Eng 5 first run engine in our district, attack engine.

Eng 6 our second due engine in our district is set up as a hose wagon. It is 3rd due across town . Hence we call it the "cross town express"

Each has a 50 gallon foam tank with thru the pump capability.

Each carries 2 PPV fans

Each has its own comb/gas meter

Each has 7 air pakc and 7 spare bottles

Each has its own TIC

Each carries the NFPA 1901 standard for firefighting equipment .

the main difference is that Eng 6 has 2000' of 5"

the other differernce is the amount of pre connects 6 vs 4

the first due carries a chain saw, the 2nd due[mutual aid] does not.

When this rig is called for, it is usaully needed for supply.

In the few times it is used in a cover situation, it has enough equipment to perform the role of a first due engine.

[Guest]

Partyrock hit the nail on the head...send out what you expect in. I would also add that also applies to people as well as equipment. I have seen mutual aid assignments (Station and on-scene) covered by depts that send a reserve rig with 2 or 3 firefighters as well as depts that send a front line rig with a crew that better resembles a Geritol ad.

While depts set up engines for specific tasks (rescue, foam, supply, etc) the basic function is as an engine...hose, hand tools, air and water. Keep it simple, as long as the crew can perform the basic function of the task it is assigned (Engine, truck, rescue) everything else will work itself out.

Use 1901 as a baseline and go from there.

[Guest]

Partyrock hit the nail on the head...send out what you expect in.  I would also add that also applies to people as well as equipment.  I have seen mutual aid assignments (Station and on-scene) covered by depts that send a reserve rig with 2 or 3 firefighters as well as depts that send a front line rig with a crew that better resembles a Geritol ad.

While depts set up engines for specific tasks (rescue, foam, supply, etc) the basic function is as an engine...hose, hand tools, air and water.  Keep it simple, as long as the crew can perform the basic function of the task it is assigned (Engine, truck, rescue) everything else will work itself out.

Use 1901 as a baseline and go from there.

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Good Points made, especially that of M/A Apparatus manpower. Why do some Depts. send equipment out of town on m/a with more men then they have staffing these rigs on a daily basis within their own juristiction? Let's start covering our own asses before we worry about our neighbors!

[robert benz 344]

Good rule of thumb, don't send a mutual aid rig with anything less than you would expect showing up to your assignments.  What I don't understand is why wouldn't you have a dry-wall hook on that rig?  Its not particularly expensive and I'm assuming its standard equipment in your Co.  The little giant is a nice tool, but like a dry wall hook, both are easy to get around without.  Residential, an 8ft hook and irons are enough to gut the place.  Commercial throw me a the 10ft.  Still can't reach it, grab the attic ladder.

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not to be picky but in a residential with 8 ft ceilings how do you use an 8 foot hook?

[Guest]

To be picky as well.....

If the department to which you responded needed hooks and ladders (note the wording for effect), perhaps a truck co. should be called.

I know that engines carry a multitude of equiptment, but if you (your department) has a ladder truck that has these tools on it, why would you have them on the engine as well.