Life's Gamble

[dc2t 80]

As I posted last week and the same thing happens again today after a several tones for ambulance the county finally calls for mutual aid bus. Maybe there should be signs posted in areas with spotty service. "Ambulance service unreliable" Wake up Westchester. The life you save may be your own.

[Guest]

I've always been privy to:

"New York City junkies get an ambulance faster than you will"

[x635 4,066]

It's ridiculos. Absolutely ridiculous.

I've said it again and again, and I honestly don't think anyone really cares about their patients. They say they do, their intentions may be well and good, but are they really? We put band aids on problems- but only when we need to. The rest we just make believe don't exist.

We're one of the wealthiest counties in the nations. Yet we can't afford decent EMS systems with guarenteed response times.

I also find it insulting to the EMS profession that all the large cities in Westchester contract out for their EMS, yet pay thier own police and fire forces. Why cheap out on EMS? Why give it to a commercial provider? For crying out loud, these cities have their own sanitation departments, yet EMS is given to a for-profit provider? Is it so hard to set up a model like Boston EMS, or even better- LA City or County FD's? Somebody explain to me a good reason why we don't see a city in Westchester start their own EMS service? Some EMS agenncies don't even recieve any tax money and rely on billing to support them....and they take pride in that! It's truly a shame.

Why give good paying, secure civil service jobs to our Paramedics and EMT's? Let's just let them suffer and struggle under the strong hands of the commercial entities? Let's not take the lead in Westchester, and set an example....and further the EMS profession and give the parity they deserve with Police and Fire. Heck, they do more runs then fire and PD do in most cases, yet are the most neglected! Is it fair that some of them have to sit and sleep squashed in a front seat of an ambulance on a streetcorner, in the dead of winter, for $9.00 an hour while we sit all nice and cozy in our stations.

People need to give up their egos, learn to play together nicely, and get desperate victims THEIR community BLS or if needed ALS ambulance that they pay for with their taxes in a timely fashion.

And don't even get me started on the negligent and ignorant communities that take firefighters and police officers off the streets to provide or supplement EMS. Another band-aid fix! People will get mugged , buildings will burn down...where were our firefighters and paramedics? Transporting an EDP to the hospital. I know there will be a day a chief will have to justify to his community why the proper staffing levels aren't there for EMS. But, at least in these communities you can get EMS guarenteed in some fashion.

We also need to draw the line between BLS/ALS transports and EMS. They are two seperate, completly different things.

We should put up signs that say "Warning- Politics, Selfishness, And Egos- Enter At Your Own Risk"

AND, when we hear a department getting re-toned for manpower for an EMS call, and it becomes a regular thing, PLEASE let's all laugh at the leadership of that department and their members who "care", and reflect in disgust on their leadership abilties and concern for their constituents. If you see them in a parade or at a social function or "the big one", question why they are there yet can't get their ambulance out at 3AM or 12PM?

As you can tell, I'm passionate about EMS, and I hope there are some that feel as strongly as I do that the bullshit needs to stop, and an agressive stance needs to be taken. Let's stand together and throw aside these morons who hold EMS back! We can do it! Somehow.

[Guest]

gosh...x635...were just ambulance drivers...we don't require such lavishness. Didn't you know that!?!

I barely made 13,000 (and thats one of the higher EMT salaries in the region) in 2006 - thank god for student loans and my old room at my parent's place...

[Guest]

EMS doesn't risk their lives. Firefighters and cops do. That's the difference.

[ex-commish 490]

EMS doesn't risk their lives. Firefighters and cops do. That's the difference.

←

Hmmm...I guess being exposed to hepititas, aids, and other diseases not risking thier lives? Wasn't one of the first reported MOS fatalties during 911 an EMT? What about trying to treat a violent EDP enroute to the hospital?

I am not fulltime EMS but don't demeanor those who are or also volunteer by saying they don't risk thier lives.

The issue that 635 presents is so true and needs to be addressed.

[NJMedic 96]

EMS doesn't risk their lives. Firefighters and cops do. That's the difference.

←

Another probie with "weeks" of experience heard from again.

[weaselff 6]

EMS doesn't risk their lives. Firefighters and cops do. That's the difference.

←

r

If this is what a probationary volly firefighter thinks of EMS, I guess we got our pulse on what the average citizen thinks. I completely agree with what X635 says, its time for EMS to be considered a premier emergency service like PD and FD. I am a career EMT who is sick of being and "ambulance driver". I love EMS but I am looking to get out as soon as I possibly can. I am sick of being treated like garbage by the citizens and government of the city I work for. I am sick of sitting on a streetcorner during blizzards and heatwaves and everything in between, waiting for the next sore throat, domino pain, insurance fraud MVA, etc, etc.

As for EMS not being dangerous I'd like to take my proby friend into the projects at 3AM for an EDP or unknown condition. I'm sure he'd add to the piss puddle in the elevator.

[SRS131EMTFF 471]

I heard some where that its all about public preseption:

For example: FFs and POs are seen as risking their lives day in and day out for the public safety and well being......

On the other hand, EMS is over looked as either non-essential, non-dangerous and unworth....

While the first one is right, the second idea is wrong.....EMS do risk their lives

The public does not see EMS as risking their lives so it is possible that the public will and does have less respect for EMS.....maybe if the public was better educated about EMS then their would be more support finanically, equipment and personal.

[Guest]

Oh really. I have experience. You tell me how many people have died lately because an ambulance couldn't get a crew. Or tell me an EMT that was killed doing their job and not an mva. Point proven. I can tell you in a second all the people that died because the cops or firefighters weren't there, and those that died because they were.

[weaselff 6]

Oh really. I have experience. You tell me how many people have died lately because an ambulance couldn't get a crew. Or tell me an EMT that was killed doing their job and not an mva. Point proven. I can tell you in a second all the people that died because the cops or firefighters weren't there, and those that died because they were.

←

First off your post does not even come close to making sense. I really have no idea what point you are trying to get across. Are you trying to say that most EMT's die in MVA's? Well you'd be right. I'm sure you didn't know that the vast majority of FF and LEO deaths are also due to MVA's. In fact a NYS trooper was killed in an MVA in Suffolk County LI earlier this week. When an emergency responder is killed in an MVA is his death somehow less tragic? Is he less brave? Do you think it matters to his family members, friends and co-workers that his death occured in an MVA rather than a shootout or fire? These people were killed doing their jobs. Have some respect or leave the Emergency Services family. You are not wanted.

As for EMT's and Medic's killed in the line of duty, there are a few that have been killed in violent incidents. Most recently in 2004 a female EMT/FF in Lexington KY was shot and killed on the scene of an injury from a domestic dispute. From my own experiences I have been punched in the face and spit on by uncooperstive patients. Not to mention being exposed to TB, Meningitis and Hep C on the regular. I couldn't begin to tell you about drivers who act as if the flare pattern on the road is merely a suggestion. Talk to any EMT or Paramedic with real street experience and they will share similar stories. I really had no idea how insane this world is until I started working the streets.

Danbury, you have a lot of learning to do, and you better start learning quick. Hopefully when you get to firefighter 1 school, you get an instructor who makes you wish you were never born let alone be a firefighter. Its obvious the senior members of your department haven't been teaching you anything. Its also obvious you have no experience in firefighting, EMS or life.

[corporal 6]

That's an estimated 12.7 fatalities per 100,000 EMS workers, making it close to the death rates for police (14.2) and firefighters (16.5) in the same time period, the study says. And it's more than twice the national average for all workers (5.0).

but ems isn't dangerous!

[Guest]

EMS doesn't risk their lives. Firefighters and cops do. That's the difference.

←

I really, really, really pray that you never have to call an ambulance.

You obviously have no experience as far as EMS, Fire or Policing is concerned. If you did, you wouldn't have made such an ignorant, small-minded, and foolish statement. Every time i turn that ambulance on to respond to a medical emergency i risk MY life. Every time i turn on those lights and siren my chances of getting into a MVA jumps 30%. Every time i have to maneuver through oncoming traffic, i risk MY life. Every time i step out of my ambulance and into an emergency scene i risk MY life. Every time im operating at an MVA, with hundreds of potential hazards, i risk MY life.

Just like the firefighter battling a blaze or the police officer chasing down a perp on foot, our lives are in danger. Were not asking for a medal - we all have willingly accepted this occupational hazards -, we are just asking for the same recognition and representation.

I don't need to sit here and be told that my job is not worth while by some punk. Shut down NYC*EMS, the participatings, the commercials, and the VACs and people WILL die. This is non-negotiable, its the fact of the mater.

Edited January 28, 2007 by 66Alpha1

[Skooter92 7]

Pots354:

In twenty years of service, I have lost friends, colleagues and been notified of the deaths of utter strangers, all in EMS, stemming from many causes. These people have been shot, stabbed, died from AIDS/Hepatitis contracted from an OTJ exposure, died in MVAs, had buildings fall on them, died from respiratory ailments contracted from breathing in deadly fumes and particles, killed themselves due to depression, or otherwise faded away because of what we do.

Don't you DARE disgrace their memory, of the friends I've lost, of those LODD funerals I've gone to, of the notices that have gone out and STILL choke me up in front of my monitor when I read them. You want to be a stupid, ignorant little piece of insignificant material in your little corner of the sandbox, feel free. But don't trivialize our loss.

Do us all a favor. Keep your half-a$$ed opinions where they belong. Rattling around in your empty little pointy head.

Edited January 28, 2007 by Skooter92

[Guest partyrock]

Yeah, EMS is cake walk. One FDNY EMS captain hospitalized after being run over at a fire, another Bronx EMT sent to the hospital after a patient attacked her in the back of the ambulance, and a brooklyn crew attacked late last year by several only to be saved after several ff's jumped in. These are just the three that come to mind.

As for the lack off respect for the industry, a few people have touched on it, I just wanted to add alittle.

EMS is a relatively new service, with most only being started up in the last 50 or 60 years. There is little gray area as to the necesity of the services provided by fire and PD. When you are robbed, thats it. You're robbed. If you home is on fire, its on fire and you want someone to come and ut it out. Every time your sick do you need an ambulance? How about every time you hurt yourself? There are plenty of instances where an ambulance and nothing less will prevent further injury and/or even save your life. The catch is most people will never need an ambulance. Most never need a cop, but more cops = less crime. More EMT's don't do a whole lot to prevent illness. When your house catches on fire there is precious little youo can do. The fire dept must arrive to make a difference. Alot of times, if you can get yourself to a hospital you have no need for an ambulance.

The best bet for EMS changing its image is to improve its efficiancy. Finding ways to reduce the garbage txps and increasing the level of prehospital care. Hopefully in the comming years we will see something akin to Englands paramedics who can treat and leave patients. In an effort to alleviate the long waits in their emergency rooms they have begun to allow their medics to provide treatment for minor injuries and minor medical problems and not have to transport.

Sorry for the rambling nature of this, I've been trying to get this out between calls all night.

[Guest]

I have 0% involvement in any type of EMS service and i KNOW that everytime those emts are called upon they risk their lives just like the rest of us. When those lights and sirens go on, the people operating that vehicle put their lives on the line. I hope to never again hear that EMS doesnt put their lives on the line. what a selfish, ignorant post....makes me sick

[fac911 33]

EMS doesn't risk their lives. Firefighters and cops do. That's the difference.

←

Are you kidding me rookie. Are you looking to start a war

[nycemt728 49]

pots354, I don't mean to beat a dead horse, but ignorant statements like that are no joke. So if EMS is not dangerous, neither is spending hours on end in the station watching tv and eating waiting for a fire that might not come. (no offense to the ffs on the forum, just wanted to make a point) What you have down is taken a superfical view of the lifesaving work we do. Is some of EMS work bull? Offcourse but so is fire and so is PD. Your opininon shows NO respect and no knowlege of EMS OR any public service. I won't list the ways we as EMT's and medics risk our lives because; 1. theres too many, and 2. everyone else on this forum knows what you don't. I agree, you need to have revelation or leave the world of public service to those more open minded and professional than yourself.

And as for the origional post, I think its disgraceful that WC has so much trouble w/ EMS from time to time and I totally agree w/ X635 its a prb of both volunteer and 3rd party, b/c when i was flagged for an MVA i had to wait a equally distasteful and dangerous amt of time for contracted service as i would for a VAC. I unfortunately don't see us becoming equal in the minds of the public anytime soon, but that doesnt mean we should stop trying!

[mlfcemt093 0]

Are you kidding me rookie.  Are you looking to start a war

←

right.....because i'm not issued a bullet resistant vest and have never been shot in my direction in the projects because my uniform dose not look like a cops

rookie ur very ignorant please keep ur posts to what ur 100% sure about because ur not very good w/opinion

[ltjay157 10]

Yea, EMS work isn't dangerous. That's why my brother wore a vest when working for FDNY as an EMT. How about the medics that work for AMR in Bridgeport Ct that went out and bought their own vests because people used to try to rob them of their drug box. I've been in the fire service 14 years and only involved in EMS doing patient care at car accidents/fire scenes. Nothing is more fun trying to take a patient out of a car on a long board in the middle of a major road with cars zipping by not more than 2 ft away at times. EMS is grossly underpaid in a good majority of the US. I make more money as a new dispatcher than a new medic which is deplorable.

But back to the topic at hand. I feel that the re-toning of a VAC for a call is a problem. The same happens in my town everyday. M-F we have a paid crew from 6am-4pm. If the go out on a call and a second one comes in, there's nobody around when it's the BS nose bleed, back pain etc. But if there's an MVA w/extrication right after that BS call, you have 6 or 7 EMT's around. I'm just hate the glory hounds that show up for the good calls (FF's included), it makes me wonder what they are here for. When I'm home I go to every fire call no matter how dumb it may sound. It doesn't matter if it's 3am or 3pm. Somebody calls you for help, you shouldn't have to think twice about going. We are here to help people, not egos.

[IzzyEng4 427]

Oh really. I have experience. You tell me how many people have died lately because an ambulance couldn't get a crew. Or tell me an EMT that was killed doing their job and not an mva. Point proven. I can tell you in a second all the people that died because the cops or firefighters weren't there, and those that died because they were.

←

Since I see you area from Danbury, how about the EMT that a few years ago, providing cared for a patient contracted HEP-C!!! So That doesn't matter????????? Talk about ignorance.... with exposures on the rise and look NATIONWIDE for how many ambulances DAILY are involved in accidents or even air ambulances. If you have "experience" may bee you should pick up the latest JEMS magazine and start reading up on your history before you make a comment.

Edited January 28, 2007 by IzzyEng4

[JBE 328]

Oh really. I have experience. You tell me how many people have died lately because an ambulance couldn't get a crew. Or tell me an EMT that was killed doing their job and not an mva. Point proven. I can tell you in a second all the people that died because the cops or firefighters weren't there, and those that died because they were.

←

How about the ones that are getting sick, or, have already died from working down at the Pile?? How about the ones that get shot at?? How about the girl who dropped dead of an MI shoveling the snow in front of the ambulance station??

It may not have happened because there wasn't a crew available and mutual aid had to be toned out. It may have already happened. Believe me, somebody out there will lose a loved one because of a slow repsonse time, and then there will be hell to pay. And, as usual, the problems will get solved because someone had to die to create change. Do yourself a favor, think before you type.

[helicopper 1,050]

Paramedic shot while responding to call for help - mars Hill, North Carolina 

A paramedic was shot in the chest Sunday night by a patient as she tried to take him into his home in Madison County's Wolf Laurel gated community, the Sheriff’s Department said this morning.

A spokeswoman for Mission Hospitals said the Emergency Medical Services employee, Tami Stephen of Yancey County, had stabilized in serious condition. Authorities said doctors would perform surgery today to remove the .22 caliber bullet.

Investigators charged Joseph Boyer Candler Jr., 68, with assault with a deadly weapon with intent to kill, Madison County Sheriff John Ledford said.

“Alcohol was a major factor in the shooting,” Ledford said.

The sheriff said firefighters and EMS workers responded to a report of a man “unresponsive” at the clubhouse at Wolf Laurel Country Club. They found Chandler under the influence of alcohol but not in serious danger.

Ledford said investigators are trying to determine what Chandler drank.and where.

Paramedics and firefighters accompanied Chandler's wife as she drove him to his nearby house at 374 El Miner Drive. Once there, they tried to move him from his car to a chair they could carry down an embankment to the house.

From a standing position outside the car, Ledford said, Chandler pulled the handgun from his pocket and fired a single shot at one of the two paramedics helping him.

“That’s the thing we’re trying to determine, is why somebody would shoot somebody who’s trying to give them aid," Ledford said.

A firefighter with Ebbs Chapel Volunteer Fire Department, Darrell Ponder, wrested the gun from Chandler. Another handgun and two clips of ammunition were found in his car, Ledford said.

Chandler was jailed this morning in lieu of a $750,000 bond and was to appear in court today.

Two charged after paramedic shot with airgun

 

The Ottawa Citizen

Thursday, December 21, 2006

Ottawa police have charged two Ottawa men after a paramedic was shot in the face with an airgun in October.

Police executed a warrant at 1065 Ramsey Cres. on Saturday, and on Wednesday charged two men with assault with a weapon and possession of weapon for a dangerous purpose.

The Ramsey Crescent residence is the same location where a paramedic was hit in the cheek with a pellet from an airgun while responding to a call on Oct. 26.

The paramedic was not seriously injured.

Joshua Vallentgoed, 18, and Johnathan Ranger, 23, have been charged.

Man Charged With Shooting at Police, Medics

Posted: Jan. 20, 2007

Updated: Jan. 21, 2007

A man who Durham police say fired at a police officer and Emergency Medical Services personnel is in custody.

Police said Keyone Dewone Goldston surrendered on Saturday while police were looking for him.

He faces a charge of assault with a firearm on a law enforcement officer for allegedly firing the shots on Friday, when the officer was assisting EMS personnel with a patient about 10 p.m. Police said Goldston, 28, of 407 E. Maynard Ave., appeared at the scene and shot twice at the officer and EMS personnel, then ran away.

Woman jailed in assault on paramedics - Jackson County, Mississippi 

A Jackson County woman was apparently drunk and threatening suicide and authorities when she was arrested on charges of assaulting Acadian Ambulance personnel, according to the Jackson County Sheriff's Department.

Sera J. Roach, 39, was arrested Saturday and charged with one count each of public drunkenness and felony assault of an emergency medical services personnel.

According to the Sheriff's Department, Acadian personnel Ryan Pearce, 22, and Christine Dainker, 36, were assaulted after they went to a home on Lily Orchard Road to respond to a report of someone who was drunk and trying to commit suicide using prescription drugs.

Authorities said Pearce and Dainker were trying to help Roach about 9:30 p.m. Saturday when she became violent.  Roach allegedly hit Pearce several times before she was restrained. She then broke free and allegedly hit Pearce several more times.  Authorities said Roach had a ring on one of her fingers and when she started hitting, one of the punches in Pearce's chest left blood marks.  Roach, authorities said, also attempted to kick Acadian Ambulance crew members during the incident.

Jackson County sheriff's deputies arrested Roach, who was taken to the Jackson County jail pending a bond hearing. 

Man cited for punching technician - Moosic, Pennsylvania 

A man under the influence was charged with punching a Network Ambulance technician

Rebecca Degroot, 28, and Mark Degroot, 32, both of Pittston, were having an argument around midnight when Mr. Degroot grabbed the wheel from his wife, police said. Mrs. Degroot lost control of the vehicle and it struck the guardrails on both sides of the road. Both were charged with driving under the influence.

Mr. Degroot was charged for striking the ambulance technician while providing care to the patients on scene at the car crash.

EMS technician shot while on the job - Detroit, Michigan 

An EMS technician was shot while on the job on Saturday.

While inside Medic Unit 18, the technician was confronted by a man who robbed and shot him in the arm, police said.

The technician was transported to Sinai Grace Hospital where is he listed in temporary serious condition.

The shooter is described as a black man, 6 feet tall with a medium complexion. He was last seen wearing a ski mask, dark-colored jeans and a gray-hooded sweatshirt.

Police are investigating how the shooter managed to get inside the secured facility.

An investigation is under way.

Man charged with attacking cop and paramedic

A suspect in a domestic dispute faces charges he bit a police officer and attacked a paramedic inside an ambulance.

It was the second time in two days police were called to a disturbance involving Ryheeme Melvin Simmons, according to a Savannah-Chatham Metropolitan Police report.

The first incident occurred at the home of Simmons' ex-girlfriend, Yukarra Coleman, in Yamacraw Village on Sunday night, police spokesman Sgt. Mike Wilson said. Simmons fled when police arrived. But he returned to Coleman's home around 7 a.m. Monday.

That's when Coleman, 24, and two friends found the suspect hiding in her bedroom closet, according to a police report. Simmons then locked Coleman and her friends inside the apartment and refused to let them leave, police said.

The two friends got out and called police, while Simmons attacked Coleman, the report stated.

Coleman got away and fled down Bryan Street.

Simmons chased her and began fighting her. During the struggle, he grabbed her around the throat and stole several items from her pockets, the report stated.

That's when police arrived, but Simmons ran again.  Officers found him in the 100 block of Martin Luther King Jr. Boulevard.

Although he was captured, Simmons refused to let officers handcuff him, police said.  Simmons put up a fight, spitting on and kicking officers, police said.  He also bit Sgt. David Owens on the hand and told the officer he had AIDS, the report stated.

Police finally were able to subdue Simmons. Police searched Simmons and found his ex-girlfriend's belongings.

Paramedics placed the handcuffed suspect into an ambulance, but he continued to resist, police said.

While on his way to Memorial Health University Medical Center, Simmons punched MedStarOne EMT Jeff Hennings.

Hennings, 39, did not require treatment, according to hospital spokesman Michael Notrica.

Simmons, 25, was treated at Memorial and taken to the Chatham County jail. He is being held on charges of false imprisonment, burglary, robbery, felony reckless conduct, simple battery, obstruction, hindering an EMT and criminal trespass.

Owens, the injured officer, was treated at Candler Hospital and released, according to hospital spokeswoman Betsy Yates. He returned to work on Tuesday.

Jail records show Simmons has been arrested nine times since 2000 on charges ranging from simple battery and obstruction, to carrying a concealed weapon and shoplifting.

Paramedic assaulted, Calif. woman tased during ambulance transport

By GREG WELTER

Chico Enterprise-Record

Copyright 2006 MediaNews Group, Inc. and ANG Newspapers

All Rights Reserved

ORLAND, Calif. — It took a shock from a Taser gun and the efforts of six officers to control a heavily intoxicated woman being transported by ambulance Tuesday night to Enloe Medical Center in Chico.

Orland Police Chief Bob Pasero said Escalante Alejandrina, 26, was found at her Walker Street apartment about 9:30 p.m. possibly suffering from alcohol poisoning.

Westside Ambulance was driving the woman east on Highway 32 when she broke loose from her restraints and assaulted a paramedic.

As the ambulance waited at the highway and County Road M 1Ž2, two Orland police officers, a pair of Glenn County sheriff's deputies and two agents from the Tehama and Glenn Methamphetamine Enforcement Team raced to the scene.

Even with six officers holding her down, Orland Police Chief Bob Pasero said a Taser gun was also needed to subdue the woman and get her back in restraints.

The ambulance proceeded on toward Chico, but Alejandrina escaped from her restraints again at the highway and County Road VV.

Four of the officers got the woman under control after a brief struggle and the ambulance continued on to Enloe, with a couple of officers remaining in the ambulance.

Pasero said his department will request that charges be filed against the woman by the Glenn County district attorney, but said her level of intoxication probably makes that unlikely.

The paramedic attacked by Alejandrina wasn't seriously injured. 

Paramedic attacked while helping beaten elderly man

Kevin Roy

A Chicago paramedic was attacked and injured while responding to a call on Chicago's West Side. The Chicago Fire Department says attacks on paramedics and firefighters are a growing problem in the city.

Paramedic Renee Perry suffered a broken nose and other injuries in Sunday morning's attack. Police are searching for the suspect in that attack.

It is much more common than you might think. One study found 92 percent of paramedics in Chicago have been assaulted at some point, and in the course of a 12-year career, Chicago paramedics average more than nine assaults. The case this week is even worse, an aggravated battery that nearly left the paramedic blind.

"I actually felt bones crunch in my face," Perry said.

Renee Perry has a broken nose, a bloody eye, and in the moments after she was attacked early Sunday morning, she couldn't see out of her right eye. All of this from doing her job as a Chicago Fire Department paramedic.

It was 2:30 a.m. at Division and Kostner. Paramedics arrived well before police, responding to a call of an elderly man who had been beaten. As Perry was treating him, police say the same suspect struck her with a pipe.

"First of all, the battery victim was an old man, and to beat up an old man and then to beat up somebody just from behind without warning, that's cowardly, and I want him caught," said Renee Perry, injured paramedic.

As the rate of violent crimes has been dropping in recent years in Chicago, attacks against emergency personnel have been on the rise. In 2004, seven Chicago Fire Department personnel, paramedics and firefighters, were assaulted. Thirty more were battered.

This year, two have been assaulted, another 22 battered, a there has been a 23 percent increase over this time last year.

"A lot of times we show up on the scene before police do, so when we don't have the law enforcement element there to protect us because of quick response times, sometimes we're right in the middle of confrontations," said Don Walsh, Chicago EMS commissioner.

Nationally, it only seems to be escalating. Last year, while responding to the scene of a house explosion in Kansas City, paramedic Mary Seymour was shot twice in the chest and killed.

Though it has been more than 10 years since a Chicago paramedic was shot or stabbed on the job, Sunday's beating has left Renee Perry and her colleagues more than shaken.

"I've gone into crime scenes and place where there were gang fights and shootings, and never been scared, and now, I was at the store and somebody was coming up from behind me, and I got scared. I don't want to feel that way," said Perry.

The Chicago Fire Department has been conducting what it calls "street sense training" for several years now, teaching paramedics how to respond to dangerous scenes defensively. The fire department says it has been effective, but what would make an even bigger difference is for police to arrive as fast as they do. Sunday, police got the dispatch call two minutes before fire, but paramedics were on the scene long before police arrived.

The above come from a five minute Google search... And I'm sure that this is only a fraction of what happens every day around the Country. None of the above are motor vehicle accidents (whether struck by a vehicle at a scene or involved in an MVA).

To degrade EMS and assert that their work is not dangerous is unfair and inaccurate. This also doesn't include the increasing incidence of EMT's and medics contracting illnesses or diseases such as Hepatitis, HIV, meningitis, etc.

According to the National EMS Memorial Service, there were 22 line of duty DEATHS in 2005 and at least 12 in 2006. Thankfully, this is far fewer than either the fire service or law enforcement suffered in the same years but to say that EMS isn't dangerous is contradicted by these statistics! It boggles my mind that another emergency provider hase such negative opinions of EMS. Hey, big bad FF - when you get hurt at a fire, who's coming to take care of your opinionated a$$? In all your hours of experience have you ever been on the scene of a call where EMS was needed? Who did you look over your shoulder for? EMS, of course!

If you want to make a cavalier statement like that you should have some facts first!

Now, maybe we can put this tangent to rest and get back to the two real issues that were raised... Agencies not being able to get out the door and the poor recognition and inattention EMS receives from municipalities.

[JJB531 652]

Everyone knows that it is very clear that EMS has issues of parity of law enforcement and firefighting, and a part of the problem starts right with us, EMS providers!

First, there is no unity amongst EMS providers in this county (Westchester). Firefighters look at eachother as "brother firefighters", law enforcement officers look at eachother as "brother police officers" (don't mean to offend any females reading this board). There is no strong unity, or brotherhood (err, womanhood), in EMS, there is no unity to stand up and fight for our rights as EMS workers, rights to better pay, better training, a better EMS system for us and for our communities. When an issue arises with a police department or fire department, whether it's pay or staffing levels, or whatever it may be, a representative is there on TV or in the newspaper making the public aware of these issues. Who's making the public aware of the issues at hand for us? How much of the general public is aware of the training, commitment, continual training, knowledge, or capabilities of EMS providers in this county? Who's our voice, our representative?

Next, how many times have you seen a crew of a commercial EMS agency getting out of their ambulance, hats on backwards, shirts untucked, pizza stains on their jacket. Not to knock volunteers, because volunteering was how I began my interest in EMS and public safety, but volunteers showing up on jobs in shorts and hawaiian luau shirts like they just came from a beach resort? How are we supposed to be seen as professionals when we don't look professional in the public's eye? I know one agency who allows their members to wear jeans and sneakers with a duty shirt when they're riding... when have you ever seen a uniformed police officer on routine patrol wearing jeans with a uniform shirt and a gunbelt?

To touch on a little something I brought up before... as EMS professionals, how many times have you opened up the newspaper and read an article on how "Police saves man's life doing CPR", only to find the last line to read, "and the patient was transported by paramedics to the hospital". I know it burns me as a paramedic to read that. Knowing the hard work that I put in to intubate, defibrillate, medicate, and all sortsa other ate's to the patient to stabilize them and get them to the hospital alive. Police departments and Fire departments have people who are public information officers, someone who releases stories like this to the media. So, who's our public information officer? Who's the one showing the media how crucial EMS providers are and how many lives we're responsible for saving EACH DAY.

To wrap up my little tangent here, I lastly place my blame on the higher ups in this county... those that have the power to make a difference, those that have the political connections, the media connections, and the ability to promote EMS, to make the public realize what a crucial, and necessary service it is that we provide. In my eyes, we have been failed by them. Look at the Westchester County DES website. Look at how many different training classes there are available to firefighters. What's available to EMS? NOTHING! Absolutely nothing. They post the EMT classes across the county, and that's it. Why isn't our glorious EMS division offering PHTLS, PALS, NALS, ACLS, WMD, AHLS, Rope Rescue courses for EMS providers, Rescue Technician Training to allow EMS providers to better access patients in austere environments? Right now if I want to take ACLS or PALS or PHTLS, I have to shell the money out of my own pocket. The DES's claim to fame was the mutual aid agreement. Big deal. What's the point of a mutual aid agreement when you have to get five steps into it to get a bus for an unresponsive. I'm sorry to say it, but even the "EMS BBQ" at Rye Playland is a joke. That's the most news coverage we get all year, 2 minutes on news 12 about how the "ambulance drivers" are getting together at Playland for a barbecue. When there is no uniformity and leadership at the top, how do you expect the troops to fall in and follow suit?

We have failed ourselves here, and failed ourselves miserably. We can't expect the public and municipalities to understand and realize what a crucial service we provide if we don't stand together, as a professional and unified front. When we look professional, sound professional (and educated for that matter), and act professional, then we will be treated how we want to be... like PROFESSIONALS! Until then, we will continue to be stuck, in the eyes of the public and the media, as just a bunch of ambulance drivers.

Edited January 30, 2007 by JJB531

[Guest alsfirefighter]

wow....strong statement.....rebuttal...(very good rebuttals at that brothers) and then.....crickets.

Good interaction despite a very ignorant and non-knowledgable comment.

[Guest WolfEMT]

EMS doesn't risk their lives. Firefighters and cops do. That's the difference.

←

So that means that I imagined almost getting hurt the other night at this:

Not only does every emergency responder (FD, PD, AND EMS) risk his or her life every single time the tones go off, we rarely get the respect that we deserve. And when that lack of respect comes from one of our own, whose ignorance trumps any ability that he (or she) might have in the academy or on the fireground, I get sick to my stomach. Pots, I'm not from Danbury, but if I were, I wouldn't want you anywhere near me on a scene; in plain English, your ignorance is dangerous.

And as far as the question that was posed at the beginning of the thread, it is unfortunate that we must sit and wait for a bus to come. I'm from an area in NJ that is similar to that of Westchester; it's a relatively affluent community, yet in some instances, there is an increased wait time for EMS arrival. However, my department has a very good mutual aid plan with the surrounding agencies and our inter-operability is beyond reproach. When we have bus out, there are members generally standing by at our quarters to handle a 2nd call. When there is a large scale emergency, our mutual aid plan goes into effect and have responders come in from our surrounding area either for our particular incident or for any other jobs that we might have pending.

Instead of making a ridiculous comment about how no one here really risks his or her life when called to duty, a better question would be to ask what kind of mutual aid plans the Westechester departments have so that we can solve the problem of waiting for a bus when it is needed.

[emt301 4]

EMS doesn't risk their lives. Firefighters and cops do. That's the difference.

←

Tell that to the families of EMS personnel who were injured or died (and those who breathed in toxic air and will get sick down the road) on 9/11 trying to help their fellow New Yorkers. Yeah, right, they don't risk their lives.

[ONEEYEDMIC 68]

Everyone knows that it is very clear that EMS has issues of parity of law enforcement and firefighting, and a part of the problem starts right with us, EMS providers! 

First, there is no unity amongst EMS providers in this county (Westchester).  Firefighters look at eachother as "brother firefighters", law enforcement officers look at eachother as "brother police officers" (don't mean to offend any females reading this board).  There is no strong unity, or brotherhood (err, womanhood), in EMS, there is no unity to stand up and fight for our rights as EMS workers, rights to better pay, better training, a better EMS system for us and for our communities.  When an issue arises with a police department or fire department, whether it's pay or staffing levels, or whatever it may be, a representative is there on TV or in the newspaper making the public aware of these issues.  Who's making the public aware of the issues at hand for us?  How much of the general public is aware of the training, commitment, continual training, knowledge, or capabilities of EMS providers in this county?  Who's our voice, our representative? 

Next, how many times have you seen a crew of a commercial EMS agency getting out of their ambulance, hats on backwards, shirts untucked, pizza stains on their jacket.  Not to knock volunteers, because volunteering was how I began my interest in EMS and public safety, but volunteers showing up on jobs in shorts and hawaiian luau shirts like they just came from a beach resort?  How are we supposed to be seen as professionals when we don't look professional in the public's eye?  I know one agency who allows their members to wear jeans and sneakers with a duty shirt when they're riding... when have you ever seen a uniformed police officer on routine patrol wearing jeans with a uniform shirt and a gunbelt? 

To touch on a little something I brought up before... as EMS professionals, how many times have you opened up the newspaper and read an article on how "Police saves man's life doing CPR", only to find the last line to read, "and the patient was transported by paramedics to the hospital".  I know it burns me as a paramedic to read that.  Knowing the hard work that I put in to intubate, defibrillate, medicate, and all sortsa other ate's to the patient to stabilize them and get them to the hospital alive.  Police departments and Fire departments have people who are public information officers, someone who releases stories like this to the media.  So, who's our public information officer?  Who's the one showing the media how crucial EMS providers are and how many lives we're responsible for saving EACH DAY. 

To wrap up my little tangent here, I lastly place my blame on the higher ups in this county... those that have the power to make a difference, those that have the political connections, the media connections, and the ability to promote EMS, to make the public realize what a crucial, and necessary service it is that we provide.  In my eyes, we have been failed by them.  Look at the Westchester County DES website.  Look at how many different training classes there are available to firefighters.  What's available to EMS?  NOTHING! Absolutely nothing.  They post the EMT classes across the county, and that's it.  Why isn't our glorious EMS division offering PHTLS, PALS, NALS, ACLS, WMD, AHLS, Rope Rescue courses for EMS providers, Rescue Technician Training to allow EMS providers to better access patients in austere environments?  Right now if I want to take ACLS or PALS or PHTLS, I have to shell the money out of my own pocket.  The DES's claim to fame was the mutual aid agreement.  Big deal.  What's the point of a mutual aid agreement when you have to get five steps into it to get a bus for an unresponsive.  I'm sorry to say it, but even the "EMS BBQ" at Rye Playland is a joke.  That's the most news coverage we get all year, 2 minutes on news 12 about how the "ambulance drivers" are getting together at Playland for a barbecue.  When there is no uniformity and leadership at the top, how do you expect the troops to fall in and follow suit?

We have failed ourselves here, and failed ourselves miserably.  We can't expect the public and municipalities to understand and realize what a crucial service we provide if we don't stand together, as a professional and unified front.  When we look professional, sound professional (and educated for that matter), and act professional, then we will be treated how we want to be... like PROFESSIONALS!  Until then, we will continue to be stuck, in the eyes of the public and the media, as just a bunch of ambulance drivers.

←

JJB, EXCELLENT points. In LE some books and classes stress that APPEARANCE is everything. If you look professional then it is LESS LIKELY that a person is going to mess with you. The theory is when you have intial contact with a person(s) they probably quickly look to how you appear to them. If you are dressed like a slob then they probably think that you really don't care about your job therefore you might be an easy target for an attack. If your uniform is pressed and your boots are polished they may think twice about attacking you. That is just what I have read and heard but LOOKS are the first thing that we see when we interact with the public.

[helicopper 1,050]

JJB, EXCELLENT points. In LE some books and classes stress that APPEARANCE is everything. If you look professional then it is LESS LIKELY that a person is going to mess with you. The theory is when you have intial contact with a person(s) they probably quickly look to how you appear to them. If you are dressed like a slob then they probably think that you really don't care about your job therefore you might be an easy target for an attack. If your uniform is pressed and your boots are polished they may think twice about attacking you. That is just what I have read and heard but LOOKS are the first thing that we see when we interact with the public.

←

Great point! It isn't just LE that stresses the importance of this point. I learned it many moons ago in EMS, again at the Police Academy and friends and colleagues in the private sector have more strict guidelines on appearance and behavior than alot of FD's and PD's I know. One in particular, has a week long training class on how employees shall dress, how their hair is styled, how they greet their counterparts, in general how to make a good impression.

In a nutshell it's like the old saying "you only get one chance to make a first impression!"

Professionalism is professionalism - note there is nothing in this word about paid or not so let's not go there.

[WAS967 97]

Thank you to all of you who came to the defense of our brothers and sisters in EMS.

To the ignorant:

http://www.astinagt.com/forums/image.php?u...line=1155258551