NY Firefighter Series (FF I/II) and National Certification

[Guest alsfirefighter]

Sorry for the delay in getting back. I was correct in a previous post. The new firefighter curriculums of I and II qualify you TO TAKE the National Certification Test after completion of the course. The tests (there are 2 written tests you must pass, as well as skills testing) do not qualify as the national cert test, that is a seperate test that must be taken.

In addition, I have heard several grumblings about the new firefighter series. Which shocks me being it gives a 1 up on the level of entry training for firefighters, I hope the push for better training continues and that we will soon be required to recertify every 5 or so years to maintain being an interior firefighter. Yes the class seems long, 78 hours. But if you only currently have basic, it is actually quicker to just take firefighter I then to get all the other classes which are the equivalents.

[TRUCK6018 50]

  Yes the class seems long, 78 hours.  But if you only currently have basic, it is actually quicker to just take firefighter I then to get all the other classes which are the equivalents.

Is 78 hours really that long?

Yes, we all have those who say "well, we've done it this way for 100 years, why change now"? But, in my deptartment, probies are required to take either FF I or EMTB to get off probation. EMT is almost twice the length of FF I (140 hours plus hospital time) and there has never been a problem with them.

ALS is right, by the time one takes basic, intermediate and haz mat op's, it's shorter (timewise) to take FF I and there's less to worry about as far as needing to register for each class.

The biggest problem right now (and it's getting better) is the lack of FF I classes. This would be the problem with any new curriculum until the growing pains get squared away.

In general, county will be getting better in giving classes. As soon as the 23 or so new instructors get up to speed there should be more classes being given.

[Guest alsfirefighter]

In my opinion 78 is still too short. In Virginia my FFI was 135 hrs. I for one was hoping to be well into delivering a FFI course by now, however my orientation as SFI was delayed and my paperwork is somwhere within the county personnel vacuum. See a few of you in the classroom soon enough.

Also to correct my national cert info, you must in addition to the state class being passed you also must have proof of a cpr/first aid class (does not have to be current card) and completion of local policies/procedures at the local level.

[Guest rreimund]

In my opinion 78 is still too short.  In Virginia my FFI was 135 hrs.  I for one was hoping to be well into delivering a FFI course by now, however my orientation as SFI was delayed and my paperwork is somwhere within the county personnel vacuum.  See a few of you in the classroom soon enough.

Also to correct my national cert info, you must in addition to the state class being passed you also must have proof of a cpr/first aid class (does not have to be current card) and completion of local policies/procedures at the local level.

Sorry to hear your mixed up with all the red tape, but hopefully that'll all be resolved shortly. I do have a question, which I've not been able to get answered with any degree of consistancy. Perhaps you may know. (forgive me if it's been discussed ad nauseum already.)

In terms of going from the old system of Essentials Basic and Intermediate over to the FF1 system.. I've currently completed Basic, along with FF Survival. I believe I would only need Haz-Mat and Intermediate to reach the FF1 equivalency.

My question is, would it simply be easier to just take FF1?

[Guest alsfirefighter]

I don't have my paperwork in front of me, but I can tell you in addition you would need at a minimum a terrorism awareness course and I belive a letter stating you completed the requirements of local right to know, rules and regs. I'll over look it tonight and get back if I find anything else.

[Guest rreimund]

Great.. thanks for that..

[firecapt32 282]

you need 4 hours of wmd and 15 hours of haz mat

[DMA327 12]

78 Hours does seem alittle short for a Firefighter1 Course. The Recruit firefighting class upstate for the FF1 AND FF2 is about 320 hours i believe.

[RES20CUE 40]

320 is a bit high.

NY's career firefighter training is only 229.

120 for a FFI and II sounds a little more on target.

When I took my FFI and II course in VA, it was 178 hours and included EMS. New Yorks courses do not include EMS, that also must be taken outside.

[DMA327 12]

Yeah, it used to be 229 Hours but now its up to about 320 Hours

[emt301 4]

State law requires all new career firefighters in departments with 6 or more career members to receive a MINIMUM of the 229 hrs. DMA327 is correct in that the actual number of hours is now over 300 at the Westchester Academy, though a bit lower in Montour Falls where the academy does not include quite as many "specialty" classes such as FF Survival, FASTeam, Coned Utilities, etc.

[DMA327 12]

Very true. FAST Operations and classes with Con-Ed are not included in the Recruit Class at Montour Falls however they have added Firefighter Survival and I believe are looking to add more into other areas of the fire service.

Ah...The more the Better! :wink:

[RES20CUE 40]

Concur with the differences between Montour and Westchester.

The NYS Firefighting and Code Enforcement Personnel Standards and Education Commission set the minimum for carreer firefighters at 229 hours as stated.

This 229 minimum exceeds the requirements for both National Firefighter I and II. Career Firefighters, at the end of the academy, can take the FFI and II exams for national cert if they wish.

The actual total hours for the NYS FFI and II courses is 105 hours.

[Guest]

Hey just wanted to add in to the chat about the new NY FFI and FFII. I used to vollie in Ct and they are big in to training. The Ct FFI class is 120 hrs and the FFII is 168. Once you pass them you are able to send your paperwork in and get your National. I’m sure it’s been said before but it’s about time NY steps up there training. This is my first posting so don’t hang me out to dry.

LIVE FOR TRAINING AND TRAIN TO LIVE

[Guest alsfirefighter]

Joey,

With intelligent and well spoken posts like that, you won't be hung out to dry often. Well spoken.

[Alfons0x66 0]

I dont disagree with you Joey, but I would like to make one point. New York needs to step up there training, but they need to have everything in place before they switch over. You cannot make this jump without certified instructors to tache it. Right now, there are over 325 firefighters waiting to take FFI. Every month you can add 10 to that number. At that rate these numbers wont diminish until probably 2006. That means that there is a chance that people that joined in May of 2004, like my nephew, will probably wait at least a year to even get into a class. Thats a long time to tell a volunteer he cannot enter a building. Yes or no, tell me what you think. I want to know if im being one sided.

[Guest alsfirefighter]

Alfons,

Look at the bigger picture. NY did step up there training, and there were things in place to get guys certified to teach the new series. No one isn't telling anyone to wait a year. I find it hard to believe there are 325 FF's in Westchester waiting for FF I. As far as your Nephew, better to wait a bit for Firefighter I, then to take basic, with no live fire training and walk into a situation he's not ready for. And that is exactly what was happening. At least the state left Intermediate there for those with only basic to match the equivalent. The nature of how things pan out in this state often force the hand of those who make change. This curriculum should have been the one in place in 2000 instead some organizations and a few loud others upstate cried and moaned it was too long, etc. Its not perfect, but its alot better and its only been in place for a few months. Give it time and things will work themselves out for the better and to make a even better curriculum.