61MACKBR1

When will the citizens of Mount Vernon wake up and realize that their city is not properly protected. It is currently being protected by the BEST understaffed and under-equiped department in the couny. God only hopes that it does NOT take a major fire with serious injuries or fatailities to wake up the New Mayor and the rest of the Goverment Leaders in Mount Vernon to realize that something is not right. Great Idea Seth. Have Mayor Young go up White Plains and spend 2 days riding along with the WPFD and see how properly staffed and equiped they are. Again bring back Mount Vernon's Fire Department to the staffing and apparatus levels of the late 1960's, bring back Engine 1, Ladder 1, Foam 1 and have a Reserve Engine, Ladder and Rescue Truck in reserve.

Maybe (and only a speculation) it could be that Yonkers iis recruiting New Firefighters, not only for the natural retirement of existing firefighters, but as well, anticipating the future additions of a Ladder Company (76?) as it relates to a possible New Station 10 along Tuckahoe Road, down the hill from the New Ridge Hill Project AND, with the potential New Downtown Development Project and the anticipation for a New 6 Bay Fire Headquarters, it might well be that YFD would had 2 New Engine Companies (Maybe Engine 301 and 302?) that would run out of this New Headquarters Building, along with Tower Ladder 71, Rescue 1, Safety Battalion and the Mask Service Unit (These current companies and the potential additional of a 301 and 302 would fill all 6 proposed bays in the New Fire Headquarters). Does anyone within the YFD have any additional updates?

Does anyone know if Yonkers FD will be rolling out the "Refurbed" Old Mack CF Engine 306 (then Spare 317), for tomorrow's St. Patrick's Day Parade? If so, has Yonkers assigned a "Number" to this rig (aka: Engine 301?), and will their wonderful old ALF Mid-Mount Rig, join it at the parade (and has YFD assigned a "Number" to the ladder as well [like maybe "Truck Co. # 1"?)

Thanks Chief Dunn

Thanks Oswegowind. I understand the thought process on the Ladder Company Numbering Sequence, but isn't Engine 314 a "Front Line" piece of appartus running out of Station 14 and Engine 302 is a Spare? (Not sure if Yonkers still has Spare 301 and 302 since they were recently sold at auction - I believe that Yonkers current spares are 305, 315. 316 and 317, but since you are a dispatcher for YFD, you would know better - Can you fill us in on this?) PS - Do you know what rig Yonkers is currently using for their FOAM UNIT (Didn't they also sell that Old Sutphen Rig they were using as the Foam Unit and were going to bid for a New Foam Unit?) Thanks !

This latest list is not correct at all. In Yonkers, the "latest 2/25/08 list" has Engine 314 has a "Spare Apparatus" and Engine 302 as a "Front Line" apparatus? Also the list has Banksville for Ladder 77, where Yonkers has Spare Tower Ladder 77 among its fleet (No mention of Yonkers in the Tower Ladder Listings, but Yonkers TL's are listed among the Ladder Companies). Finally, I believe Yonkers has a Spare Ladder 78 (as well as 76 and 79)

Hopefully someone in the Mayor's office will wake up and realize that Mount Vernon's current equipment staffing level is below minimum requirements and needs to be brought back up to the level of the 1960's and 1970's

If it ends up being true, that the City sold the Old R-1 (Ford Rescue), that surely doesn't make any sense. Like the others above have said. What does FDMV do when the front line R-1 goes out of service for maintenence and repairs? Use their Spare Engine 1? (Doesn't have the space to store all of the equipment that is used on R-1. Yonkers had the sense to keep the Old Single Axel Rescue Rig as a back up/reserve. Why not Mount Vernon? If the City of Mount Vernon was desparate for money, then why wouldn't they sell off FOAM 1 that is sitting and rusting behind Station 2 (What a waste of resouce. That Old Airport Rig would be a great addition to the FDMV fleet, given where it would have been located out of, down around the Oil City Area, and the location at Station 2). When will the City of Mount Vernon wake up and go back to the EQUIPMENT and MANPOWER LEVELS of the Mid to Late 1960's and 1970's. FDMV "Should Be": Station 1 Engine 6 Ladder 2 Station 2 Engine 5 Ladder 2 Rescue 1 Foam 1 Spare Rescue 1 Haz Mat Unit Station 3 Engine 1 Engine 3 Ladder 3 (Spare Ladder 1) Station 4 Engine 2 Engine 4 (Spare Engine 7) What does anyone within FDMV think about all of this?

Its one of those NEW American LaFrance Mini-Pumpers. Gives out 10 GPM

Not sure who had the 1st Snorkel Unit in Westchester County. It might have been Bedford Hills. I know that Scarsdale had one at one time, and of course, the Classic Mount Vernon FD Snorkel (Photos above). Does anyone know what FIre Districts in Westchester County had Snorkel Units and who still has them?

You've got to love the old FDMV Snorkel 1 ! Yes, the truck, to what I have been told, was difficult to drive thru the narrow streets in Mount Vernon, but that Snorkel could sure shoot a blast of water from that tower. They don't make rigs like that anymore.

Does anyone have any recollection of the July 1966 Fire at Rye Playland that destroyed 3 Rides, Several Concession Stands and the fondly remembered "Magic Carpet Fun House"? Who was dispatched to that job (I would presume Rye, and probably Mamorneck and maybe Port Cheter)? [That Fun House was GREAT ! You could go in there and basically spend the whole day in it. I remember some School Trips to Playland where we all went into the Fun House. I also believe that the Original Bumper Car ride also perished in that fire. Any and all information from those who remembered the event and remembered the FUN HOUSE would be greatly apprecaited.]

If Special Operations were to be "Centrally" controlled by the Westchester County DES (rather than by individual municipalities, such as Yonkers), such Granted Equipment could be used and sharred amongst all of the Fire Districts in Westchester County, complimenting the current Training Efforts in Valhalla. But that goes back to the "Great Regionalization/County DES Control Debate" which has been debated on this site for quite a long time.

What an outstanding tribute to the late Chris Kiernan. Although I did not know Chris personally, from what I have been told by those who knew him and his family well, over the past 40 years or so, have said that he loved the Yonkers Fire Department, its rank n' file as well as Engine 306. He set the bar extremely high as it relates to the Management of Fire Supression Operations and Apparatus Design and Development, not only in Yonkers but throughout New York State, that will be difficult for anyone to come close to. He was instrumental in getting Rescue 1 back into service back in late 1990's and his determination to this cause became a reality in 2000. I would encourage everyone who knew Chris to purchase this model of the Rig that was one of his last goals and objectives while he was with us, protecting the City of Yonkers, in his memory and honor.

Oswegowind - I know that you are one of the dispatchers in Yonkers and certainly have access to direct information. This is the area of your expertise, to which I and many truely respect. Knowing that YFD only has 2 Tower Ladders as front line pieces (71 & 75) and the 2 Oldest Front Line Engine Companies are 308 & 309, logic indicates that these would be the ones that would be replaced. However, yes, one cannot be absolutely certain and you would know better. As far as Corporate Business Law is concerned, in the position that I currently hold, I believe (and I may be wrong) that I might know a little more about the Bankruptcy Laws and can shed more light on this matter. American LaFrance, filing for Chapter 11, is used as a "relief" from creditors as they attempt to restructure their organization. It does, however, affect "Greatly" their ability to fill out current In-House orders, to which the Yonkers Fire Department has equipment on order. Most municipalities who go to contract for Capital Equipment Expeditures, usually have performance clauses built in, as safe guards, in case such instances as this, happen. Most municipal bids also have language built in, to which, if the Bid Award Contractor defaults, the company who bid the next lowest "could" be awarded the bid OR they could go back out to bid (the latter would certainly slow down the process even more than it current has been slowed down). Also, American LaFrance filing Chapter 11 covers ALL American LaFrance facilities, not just their New Carolina Facility. Thus, the subject of the post was to inquire whether or not Yonkers had built in any contingency plans within the contract and whether or not they were now looking to an alternate supplier, given ALF's current situation. Not being Pessimistic, trying to be Optimistic, but being a "Realist" Also remember, "Assume" is an "Educated" Guess. Stay Safe and Well ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Pessimism doesn't get anyone anywhere! FYI, a number of corporations have filed chapter 11 and come back strong after re-organizing their focus and finances. Just assuming that the YFD will not get their apparatus is plain old ludicrous...doesn't ALF have more than 1 plant (?)...oh, and that is why there is a "play on words" using the word "assume"...Makes an a** out of u...in this case, not me! And I love how you guess the numbers that will be assigned new apparatus...argh! This post has been edited by Oswegowind: 24 minutes ago

I would now assume that Yonkers will not be getting their 2 New Tower Ladders (71 & 75) and Engines (308 & 309) anytime soon (if ever). Wonder if YFD has a contingency plan in place, to which they can find ALF in default of contract and re-award the contract to the next lowest bidder (whoever that was, maybe Smeal). Curious to see what Yonkers now has in mind to take a different course of action, to avoid any unnecessary additional delays?

One of probably the top 20 worst fires in Yonkers history. I would be very interested in knowing if anyone had a recolection of the responding units on each alarm for this fire as well as what outside Mutual Aid engines and trucks were asked to come in and cover Yonkers Stations. Does anyone have access to this historical data?

Yonkers has "2" Tower Ladders on order with ALF? I knew that they were planning on replacing Tower Ladder 71 down at "The Big House" , with the current TL71 replacing the current Spare TL77 (Old Mack Baker 75), but I did not hear anything about replacing the current Tower Ladder 75 up at Station 12? Does anyone know anything more about this? I also read somewhere that Yonkers was also planning on replacing both the Foam Unit and Collapse Rig, with new units. Does anyone have an update on this as well?

Given some of the recent Multiple Alarm Fires in and around Westchester County, is there a Plan within the County DES, that clearly indicates what Municipal Fire Department covers or assists other cities, in cases of Multiple Alarm Fires that exhausts that cities firefighting capabilites? I read on here that at the recent Eastchester Multiple Alarm Fire, New Rochelle FD came in with 2 and 1 to assist with fighting the fire, and Mount Vernon FD came to Eastchester to cover stations with a 1 and 1. I also see that New Rochelle FD covers for Mount Vernon when FDMV has a Multiple Alarm Fires. Other than Greenburgh, who comes into Yonkers when they have a Multiple Alarm Fire, as part of the Mutual Aide Program and who does Yonkers FD help assist as part of the Countywide Mutual Aid Program? (Given that both New Rochelle and Mount Vernon as 2 of the 4 largest cities in our County, I would think that YFD would help cover, and given Yonkers close boarder to Eastchester, that YFD would also help our Eastchester as well). Does anyone know what the standard Mutual Aid Plans are for these cities?

Good Question. I would presume (and would think would be logical) that YFD Pagano, NRFD Kiernan, FDMV Everett, and the White Plains Commissioner of Public Safety would all be part of the study. Does anyone know who is on the panel?

Yes, there are "Paperpushers" within our County Government. But, with a Unified County Fire District, with lower taxpayer costs, and allot of better bargining for Grant Moneies coming from the County Government for County Programs (such as a Combined Fire District) then you will see less politics and more action.

Based upon the post copied below, maybe we are headed in the right direction. I still contend that a County Run, Fire Department, divided into either 2, 3 or 4 separate districts would be the answer. This way, all areas of the county would be properly staffed, equiped, and managed, and NOT left up to the political paperpushers within the City, Town, and Village Governments to control. Think about a County Run Fire District in Southern Westchester, that say for a would respond to a alarm of fire on Bronx River Road in Yonkers, near Midland Avenue, could have YFD Station 13 (313 & 73) respond along with Station 4 from FDMV (with, say Engine 1 and a Ladder Company Housed there), YFD Squad 11 and say Bronxville Engine 29. These stations would be in very close proximaty to the alarm, without having to have Apparatus from YFD Station 12 (Fortfield Ave) or Station 14 (North Central Park Ave) dispatched to come (Unless needed for a Multiple Alarm Fire). This would also save on the wear and tear of the Apparatus, resulting in longer life (and less cost for maintenence). I say lets do it. "The career chiefs did. they got a state grant and commissioned PACE Univ. to do a study....details to follow""

Some Great Ideas have come forward on this, that would certain solve a number of issues throughout the county (Mount Vernon, etc, etc). Now what would the next steps be? OR - Is this just a "Pie in the Sky" concept. Any input from anyone within the Westchester County Department of Emergency Services?

Yes, very similiar to Baltimore County, with those current communities, where there is either a Combined Paid and Volley or All Volley, being placed in with All Paid. But, as you indicated, the Unions would not approve such a concept, in today's day and age, where you would have a merger of any Paid Departments with either a Paid/Volley or all Volley. This is the direction that such a plan would need to take, in order to, say put an identical plan, that Baltimore County, MD. has here in Westchester County, NY. From a Financial, Practice and Standards, and Ensurance of Class of Firefighter equal throughout the county, such a plan, in my eyes, would make sense. But, again, the Unions would never go for it.

While I agree that some departments have higher standards than others (as it relates to hiring, promotions, etc), combining departments and having EVERYONE required to meet the "HIGHEST" Standards available, might make more sense. This way, there would be no questions regarding who had trained FAST teams, SOP Trained Personnel, etc. EVERY FIRE DISTRICT, say all run by the WCDES, would all have to have the same Trained Personnel Requirements, no matter if it was all CAREER manned, a Combination of CAREER and VOLLEY or ALL VOLLEY. "EVERYONE" would be required to meet the SAME highest standards. (This was, deserant individuals, such as the person in Mount Vernon, would have a Fair Shot at a Promotion) Again, maybe requiring everyone to meet the SAME STANDARDS would improve Westchester County's OVERALL Firefighting Capabilities, unified under 1 Level of Control, separated by different "Districts" could improve the quality of Fire Fighting for all citizens of Westchester County? It works extremely well in other COUNTIES throughout the Country (Los Angeles County, Gwinnett County GA, etc)