nfd2004

"We probably should just throw in the towel and give the streets to the criminals". The cops don't have a chance out there. Maybe we should do away with the cops entirely and see how well we can all function together on our own. If this keeps up, nobody in their right mind will even consider being a cop no matter what the pay or benefits are. Maybe we can just hire felons to monitor felons. Kind of like that saying; "the fox guarding the hen house". I also must add this too. Of my younger friends, NONE, have any interest in becoming a police officer today. It's just not worth it. If that becomes a trend and that should happen, we may be left with no other choice BUT to eliminate our police. "I JUST HOPE THAT I'M NOT AROUND WHEN THAT HAPPENS"

Thank you x635 for posting this. I will surely pass it around. And thank you to the members of the FDNY. Many members of the FDNY are still paying the price as well as their families. It was a day we will never forget. There are still people suffering from that tragic day. As one famous song writer put it, "Where were you when the world stopped turning". So much suffering day after day. Year after year as so many will never forget.

This actually brings back memories to me of my home town, Bridgeport, Ct. They were always trying to meet some numbers game too. As a result of this policy, many of my personnel friends who were well qualified to become Bridgeport Firefighters, "GAVE UP", and became firefighters elsewhere. Many were also promoted and are leaders in these outside fire departments today. How many others that I don't know, also gave up and did the same thing ? The results being: "Bridgeport's LOSS is another City's GAIN". Here is an article about the hiring of those "CONVICTED FELONS". One of the "STAR PLAYERS" had been involved in driving the Get Away Car during a DOUBLE HOMICIDE in that city. https://forums.firehouse.com/forum/firefighting/firefighters-forum/45714-more-trouble-for-bridgeport-ct-fire-dept

I think this leads up to many additional questions. A check of this town's total population shows in 2010 they had 4,247 people. 1) With a small community population such as this, "would there really be a need for this ladder truck" 2) What additional ladder trucks are available through a mutual aid system. 3) What types and sizes of buildings are in this town ? 4) How many members are certified to operate this piece of apparatus. More importantly how many are able to respond in a moments notice. Based on a picture that was sent to me of the 4th alarm fire today (11/21), this building appears to be a 1 1/2 story frame, perhaps 20 x 60 from what I can see. At the time this picture was taken, it is totally involved.

On a follow up to this story, just got word of a 4th Alarm going on in this town as I write this (Monday, 11/21/2016 at 0900 hours).

"LayTheLine", I must agree with you about a 12 story building. Most places do NOT have 43 personnel to handle such an incident. But also as well, MOST Places do NOT have 12 story buildings either. Most are 2 or 3 story as in the other examples presented. The city you described in your example is very similar to the description of Bridgeport, Ct. (8 Engines, 3 Ladders, 1 Rescue with four members on each). They DO have 12 story buildings. They also have a mutual aid plan which is set up for when something like that happens. That would bring in a response to cover the rest of the city from outside career departments. But for most places, it is the everyday 2 1/2 frame or 3 story brick building that this NFPA recommendation might be trying to explain. If a city doesn't have high rise buildings, there's no need to justify at least 43 firefighters on duty. But for many places, there is a need to justify 15 firefighters. After that it becomes a mutual aid response. I could list at least a dozen in Connecticut alone that fit that description. Even within the "Fractured Fire Service of Norwich, Ct" there are 12 Firefighters on duty around the clock. That city has NO BUILDINGS OVER 7 stories. When everybody "IS" tied up at a fire, mutual aid kicks in. Not only to respond to the incident, BUT to cover the empty firehouses as well. Here's an interesting fact to consider though. Stretching a hose line up to a Third Floor with "2 Firefighters", vs "3 Firefighters". It has been proven that by just adding that one extra firefighter, that hose line can be stretched TWICE as fast. Thereby getting water on the fire quicker, preventing that fire from getting bigger. This NFPA Standard is NOT only talking about recommendations for 12 story buildings. It is also referring to the much smaller buildings and the type of response initially required to successfully complete the job without loosing the building or perhaps it's occupants. I think any firefighter who has pulled up to a 2 story building at 2 AM with less than 15 firefighters, and having reports of people still trapped inside will certainly understand the value of this on duty recommendation. And for the citizens in there trying to get every breathe of fresh air they can - before aid can reach them, "I think they might understand as well".

Here is the latest article. Try this. www.theday.com/local/20161110/fbi-or-government-making-inquiries-into-cmeec-npu-and-jewett-city-utilities

Here is an interesting newspaper article that was published on October 22, 2016. Although it may NOT be directly related to the "Fractured Fire Service of Norwich", it does involve at least two key players in that issue. One is the head of the Public Utilities Company with provides both gas and electric to the homes and businesses throughout the city. That leader is Mr John Bilda. Mr Bilda was Acting City Manager, as well as the head of this utility company at the time I made my first visit to city hall and discuss the serious issue involving our Fire Service within the city. I met with Mr Bilda sometime in February/March, 2015. I asked him to consider making some much needed changes that he would be able to accomplish. With ONLY four days left in that public office as Acting City Manager, Mr Bilda advised me that there would be NO CHANGES MADE WITHIN THE FIRE SERVICE OF NORWICH. He would return to his regular position as Director of the Norwich Public Utilities (NPU). What I didn't know was that he would invite his friend, Chief of the Yantic Volunteer FD, Chief Blanchard to a LAVISH WEEKEND RETREAT to the Kentucky Derby as one of his many invited guest. That weekend retreat would take place in April, 2015, very shortly after my meeting with the then Acting City Manager. The cost to invite EACH INDIVIDUAL at roughly $7,000 per person. It should be noted that this Fire Chief has seemed to be the most outspoken AGAINST those Norwich Career Firefighters. Very frequently referring to the cost of these career firefighters. But did those same taxpayers pay for his $7,000 weekend retreat through their public utility bills ?? Here is the story about this lavish weekend featuring one of the Star Players, NPU Director, former Acting City Manager Mr John Bilda, as well as in the 2015 trip, the Yantic Fire Chief Frank Blanchard. After you absorb this article, I will post an additional article that came out just November 11, 2016 shortly titled; "FBI or Government making inquiries into GMEEC, NPU, and Jewett City Utilities". But First, here is the First article in which many people in this area are NOT TO HAPPY ABOUT. This was published on October 22, 2016 with many others related later in front page headlines of TWO Local Newspapers. Sorry, I couldn't get the article shown. I'll try later. But I can assure you that the man at the spotlight of both these lavish trips as well as the individual who was a key player in the Fire Service issue may be in some hot water. Now it is reported that the FBI or other government organization is also involved.

This is repeated so many times over in America. Most taxpayers consider firefighters as just a burden on their tax dollars. That is UNTIL......... it's too late. For many, they pay for education, police, public works, but by far paying for firefighters seems to be the biggest problem. Sometimes, these firefighters don't even get the support from other firefighters, right within their own communities. Such is the case where in my own community, so often other firefighters will try to push for the cutting of manning. People will say, "but firefighters aren't fighting enough fires to make that manning necessary". I say to that, we all are paying for our military and I'm glad when we're NOT fighting a war. Most of us also pay insurance premiums on our homes, cars or apartments. Yet, we don't use that insurance policy unless needed. To the average taxpayer, a group of career firefighters is merely a burden on their pocketbook. But tonight if they are one of the unfortunate one's, they could very quickly change that attitude. They now call them THEIR HEROs. It happens quickly and without warning. It's happened before and it will happen again. Meantime firefighters are forced to take much more risk than is already required. But most took an oath to perform "the saving of lives and property". We are talking human lives and most firefighters will throw themselves into danger to do whatever is possible to get those human lives out of danger. To some, Firefighters are a Burden. To some, Firefighters are a Hero

THANK YOU for posting this. I think it is something that is very easy to follow, as well as how it presents it's very important points. I assure you I intend to share this with many others as well.

Perhaps an Update or Progress Report is due. Despite No Progress being made on the Fractured Fire Service in Norwich, there has been No shortage of the Career Fire Department calling for the closest volunteer departments, unlike their surrounding departments have done. Instead of calling for another OUTSIDE Department, the Fire Commanders in this case called for the closet and put their services to work. As you recall from many earlier post here, that has NOT always been the case when additional help was requested. In one case two volunteer departments were requested from 5 and 8 miles away, despite a firehouse with nine fulltime firefighters and a battalion chief only 1.8 miles up the road. But in the cases below that I am about to list, in ALL OF THESE INCIDENTS, the CLOSEST LOCAL VOLUNTEER FIRE DEPTS WERE REQUESTED. These were serious fires in which occurred from October 16, to Oct 30th. 1) October 16 - Former Newspaper Building at 66 Franklin St being converted into restaurant. Two story brick with fire in the cockloft. 2) October 23 - Large vacant mill building at 132 Franklin St with fire on the second floor 3) October 24 - Two and three story vacant former YMCA Building at 337 Main St. Fire on the second floor of former residents area 4) October 28 - Fire in an occupied 2 1/2 frame dwelling, making 11 occupants homeless 5) October 30 - Fire in a one story commercial car sales and service building In addition to the above, only a week or so before this, there was a fire in an occupied 4 story brick building at 321 Main St. I just don't have the exact date. In ALL of these fires, they required at least one hand line operating. In some cases multiple lines had to be stretched. The point is, in each one of these incidents a response was requested of the surrounding volunteer departments. This type of mutual aid plan shows the priorities of these departments. One department shows how important in is to call the closest department and quickest to respond. While others have a track record of calling much farther away departments regardless of how much more property burns or whose lives they might be affecting. Which department would you feel is doing the right thing for the people they serve. I would just like to pass on a recent newspaper article regarding some of the fires. The Norwich arson Task Force is back in action. They have an excellent track record as I know many of them personally, both fire and police. Most also bring years of experience with them. Our biggest problem here I see is NOT catching the arsonist BUT in getting rid of some fire commanders that should have been put out of business years ago. http://www.theday.com/policefirecourts/20161102/norwich-arson-task-force-is-back-in-action (I hope it works)

Downtown building recovering after Three Alarm Fire. http://www.theday.com/local/20161017/foundry-66-facility-in-norwich-recovering-after-saturday-fire After reading of this story, I wrote these comments. OUOTE: "I am very happy to read of the good news. This is the result of the local fire departments all working together. It proves to all of us how things CAN and Should be done". "Whether it's a fire in the response of the city's paid fire department on Franklin St, an apartment house fire in the Occum section, a hazardous materials leak on Otrabando Ave in Yantic, a serious building fire at the Uncas on the Thames Campus in the East Great Plains area, a serious car accident with a victim pinned in a car in the Laurel Hill area, or even the preplanning of a large converted mill in the Taftville area, "When all of the local fire departments work together, that's when everything works out the best". "Over the years, I was involved in many incidents in which about a dozen firefighters were able to save entire city blocks from burning down ONLY because of a group of volunteer firefighters responding to our call for help. Yet I have watched serious incidents go on as other fire trucks from farther away drove right by our firehouse". "I have taken a hard stand AGAINST this type of activity. It is my hope that positive changes can be made for ALL the citizens of Norwich". End of Quote. I told one individual on there who had commented earlier about the lack of cooperation - "I am fighting for you and everyone else". Also note that when I referred to incidents of the past in the quoted second paragraph, they were actual incidents in which the Norwich FD was NOT allowed to respond, even though they were staffed and much closer.

October 17, 2016 is the 50th Anniversary of the 23rd St Fire in New York City. Fifty years ago on October 17, 1966, TWELVE New York City Firefighters lost their life operating at a building fire at 23rd St and Broadway in Manhattan. It was the largest loss of firefighters until the World Trade Center Attack on 9/11/01. Here is a member of the FDNY who was there and talks about that tragic night. www.youtube.com/watch?v=agEYg2n2JsQ

Recently, I received an email stating that my message has been heard. Here is a part of that email: " The leaders of this city are now focused on some of the many problems you brought to light, and they are addressing these issues in a carefully constructed plan. This plan is not to eliminate or hurt anyone or organization but rather to address the fundamental issues that you have raised. I know you have probably heard all this before and waited in vain for results, and, for far too long they were not substantive enough to effect meaningful change". In addition he wrote: I write to you now, to ask that you give us the space we need to actually accomplish some things that we are in the wings of change. Your continued efforts are no longer necessary as they have heard you, seen it for themselves, and agree that things need to change. I am asking you to let us take it from here. Nothing says that if this fails like so many other efforts in the past that you are prohibited from doing the heavy lifting again. The ABOVE is a portion of that email I received from a high ranking city official who has been involved with this since DAY ONE starting in February, 2015. Since that time, he as well as other officials were sent over a dozen emails citing serious incidents that needed to be addressed regarding the fire service of Norwich, Ct. It is my intention to respect that wish and to refrain from sending any additional emails concerning this matter. I have sent my last email to city officials explaining to them, the next step is to seek legal counsel for the victim(s) suffering a loss due to the lack of any action on the city's part. Should that happen to a victim tomorrow, my heavy lifting will go into affect should those Norwich Firefighters NOT respond. Until the time that actual changes take place, the city and it's fire commanders are willing to continue rolling the dice. I have suggested that if these current fire commanders are NOT willing to accept this change, someone in city office needs to tell them, "It's time to pack your bags, we can find someone to replace you".

Reading some of the comments posted, it appears to me that the "citizens" are NOT too pleased with the fact that those records were NOT offered. This most recent newspaper article seems to have really hurt the Volunteer Depts. The members of the Five Volunteer departments owe it all to their leaders for representing them in this way. A few comments: 1) "What are they trying to hide" 2) "This is a disgrace" The talking has been going on for years. About 40 years as far as I can tell you. The numerous meetings with city officials, the Norwich Firefighter Union Officials, each of the many Volunteer Chiefs who have served - the hand shakes - the promises, ALL have been a COMPLETE waste of time. I think the simplest way to describe what is going on here is just go to the Stamford thread and every place you see the word "Stamford", just replace it with the word "Norwich". That would give the readers a pretty good picture of just what is going on here.

Here is the latest local newspaper story on "The Fractured Norwich, Ct Fire Service". Some say they REFUSE to turn over their members training records for the latest ISO (Insurance Services Office) report in an attempt to improve the city's rating from a grade of 4 out of a possible 10. As a department that takes city funded tax dollars, I say "those training records are public information and should be shown at request." Didn't the taxpayers pay for much of that required training as well ? I also feel that any fire department that trains its firefighters, should be very proud of their accomplishments. So why would you object to showing this. From the New London Day Newspaper, October 1, 2016. I hope the link works. You may need to click on "News", then "Local", to view it. http://www.theday.com/local/20161001/norwich-fire-depts-feud-complicates-effort-to-improve-city-insurance-rating

They "DO" look like "Clown Cars" and I know I wouldn't want to be the guy driving it. I have trouble getting out of a full size SUV, let alone this little midget. BUT, maybe for practical purposes, it's use will be very good getting around tight traffic spots of Manhattan, or as those scooters were sometimes used, for the parks and maybe a few housing projects. The plus side of it for the officers is that they are heated in the winter and air conditioned in the summer. New York City is the Proving Ground for anything new. Whether it be the police dept or the fire dept. As I look back on the years, at least as I remember, with few exceptions, it was NYC that changed from OPEN CAB fire apparatus to ENCLOSED CAB fire apparatus. After that we all just followed. Or from three quarter boots to bunker gear. NYC was the first place to have a designated fire company as a FAST Co, despite what others might like to take credit for. Which in the beginning was referred to as a FAT Company (Firefighter Assist Team). Whether the "Clown Cars" work for the NYPD is something that NYC will test for any other major city before they have to spend the money for themselves. All kidding aside, any police or fire chief, police officer or firefighter, that wants to learn from the most experienced department in the world, "they are very often willing to share the information they have to others who may need it. For those who live just outside the NYC area, you have a pretty good opportunity to learn from the most experienced. Just don't go in there and tell them how to do their job. I know on a few occasions, and ONLY A FEW, I had such a character with me. He ended up making a fool of himself and it just didn't go over too well. In this case, if your a Police Chief, let NYC do the work for you. If your department might have an interest in anything like this, give them a year trial and see how they work out. I know before the fire dept made any commitment on bunker gear, that's just what they did. A trail period of one year in some busy companies before they made the final decision to buy about 10,000 sets of bunker gear.

Looking for Ahmad Rahami in a Blue Honda Civic with NJ plates D63EYB. Also Linden, NJ shooter in custody and found a suspicious package. Requesting Bomb Sq and K-9 Update: Ahmad Rahami is in custody in Linden, NJ after shooting police officer

A few guys telling me the NYPD has the suspect(s) in custody for the bombing. Perp(s) apprehended in the area of Belt Pkwy and VZ Bridge. As many as Five in custody. If that's true, great job by those in blue.

Not too much I can argue about that one. And oh yes, in our Blast from the Past, the news media DID report it to first be a "transformer explosion" when that bomb went off in the lower level of the parking garage at the WTC in 1993. Only to find out later that they gave us the wrong scoop. The other incidents you bring up as well. Just a little criminal mischief with nothing else behind it, I suppose. Excellent points brought up.

Excellent point Pete. Whether we must deal with Terrorism, mass shootings, or even just the everyday crime, trying to be PC is NOT the answer. Burying our heads in the sand and hoping our problems go away doesn't work. I think 23 people injured in this incident. That's 23 more than should have been hurt. We have allowed our civic leaders to destroy our own safety by allowing those out to hurt us the ability to hurt more. In the first World Trade center bombing of 1993, over 1,000 people were injured and I believe six people were killed. That was a bomb placed in a car in the below sub level parking garage of one of those WTC Tower Buildings. It was so powerful that it blew through FIVE levels of solid concrete in that garage. Our Leader then (President Clinton - the same one that lied about cheating on his wife on national television), had every opportunity to get Bin Laden then. But he didn't and instead the terrorist got stronger. Then in September, 2001, just eight years later, our country is attacked again. This time it is the Worst Attack ever on American soil. Bin Laden takes credit for accomplishing this. Perhaps this could have all been prevented had our leader then taken the proper steps to deal with it. So with this most recent event occurring in NYC, where do we go from here ? History does have a way of repeating itself. Will the mayor of NYC treat this as the former U.S. President treated the first WTC bombing ? I hope not and I hope he has learned not to repeat the mistakes of others. I don't have the answer on what to do or how to handle it. But that's not my job, "that's theirs" !!!

I had heard on a NYC radio station early the next morning that 21 people were confirmed dead from a deadly fire in a social club in the Bronx. I knew the area well as I had spent years earlier chasing fires in the South Bronx. I couldn't believe 21 people killed. a huge loss. As I followed the story that morning, the numbers kept increasing of those lost, until reaching the total number of 87 innocent people. Here is a news story as told by a local television station. www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dKoN5TTDHI

This is a 9/11 Story of TRUE Brotherhood within the fire service after the Tragic events of September 11, 2001. A story about an FDNY Rescue Company that lost all of it's members when they responded to the World Trade Center. A story about a FDNY Firefighter who dedicated himself to the children of those lost members, FDNY Firefighter Jo Jo Esposito. There's hundreds of stories of people helping people after the Worst Attack in the history of America. Here is that story of Jo Jo. http://www.ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/nyer-of-the-week/2016/09/3/nyer-of-the-week--jo-jo-esposito-stays-loyal-to-the-families-of-his-fallen-brothers.html

Now that the 15th Anniversary of the Attack on America has passed, for most us our lives will continue as it normally does. But for those who have lost their loved ones, everyday that passes, they don't forget. So as our daily lives go on, here is a video of someone who won't forget. She will NEVER FORGET. www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyLxuy4tPLs

As we so often here, "9/11 Never Forget". Here are two 9/11 first responders, both suffering from 9/11 linked cancer, who work towards making sure that does not happen. http://pix11.com/2016/09/10/two-ailing-first-responders-continue-teaching-children-about-911/