M' Ave

I wish I had an actual answer for you guys, but I can only guess. Someone had one good idea about the RFID accountability system, but I don't believe that's true. That program hasn't evolved beyond the planning stage yet. The actual tagging of turn-out coats and such hasn't gotten passed the drawing board. That antenna array might have something to do with a high-rise repeater and recording system. That's my best guess. On a side note...why again the blue light fascination? The color of the lights on the rigs have ZERO impact on on any part of our operations. None. They don't get us through traffic faster, they don't keep us safer and they don't let us do our job any better. Ya gotta shift your focus to something about a rig that has some sort of impact. Anything.

That appliance you speak of is indeed a manifold. It looks to be one of the ones we use that for hose testing. Every company doesn't have their own, but there are a few floating around each division. It gets dropped off when it's your company's turn for hose testing. That manifold allows us to test multiple lengths at once. Since we are out of service during hose testing, we try to make it as quick a process as possible. As for the Battalion.....that's not too uncommon. A lot of firehouses were not built with today's apparatus in mind, nor did they originally have a battalion. So...we adapt and squeeze in! Happens a lot. Often, the chief can't get in until his aide pulls the rig out. The chief closes the apparatus door and hops in. Excellent photos guys. Nice job.

I'm sure they'll bang out a couple of classes of 300 right off the bat, but what will they do after that. Space the classes out, or continue to run them with fewer candidates per class?

You are being discriminated against. In fact, anyone who tries hard and puts in effort is being discriminated against. That being said, don't let this nonsense steer you wrong. Study hard, take the test and wait....hopefully not too long. We need a lot of people and will hire deep into the next list, I'm sure of it. Feel free to fire away any questions.

No, no you haven't. You simply haven't been around long enough to have "seen this and seen that". I gotta tell you, Ike (I Know Everything) your boldness doesn't instill confidence. Be very wary of the person who says they've seen it and done it all....'cause they're in for a wake up call one day. You need to get real. I promise that if you walk into a firehouse in New Rochelle, Yonkers, The Bronx, ect. ect. where each individual Company responds to more emergencies in a year than your department (more importantly, you yourself) you'll have a difficult time finding anyone, regardless of time as a fireman, who will tell you they've seen it and done it all. Better yet, keep it close to home. Go to the senior guy in Harry Howard or Rescue 40 and tell them that, even though you've been around long enough for a cup of coffee, you've seen it, thought of it and done it already. That's surely not going to go over well. Humility and common sense will keep you alive and learning in our profession. We have a great thing going. Who's better than us? We get to fight fire, help people on a daily basis and it's exciting. You never know what's going to be the end result of that run that just came in. You will never achieve a "know everything" status. That's just not attainable in our field and the smartest person out there learns something everyday in every situation and they also know when they're qualified to perform certain tastk.

Wrong. You know who has the right to say a teen can't drive? A non-teen who is in a position of authority, or in a position to make an experience influenced determination. Lets all say this together, "driving isn't a right". it may seem silly now, but I assure you that you'll look back in ten years and see that you don't really have the qualifications at 18....or a bit older for that matter. If you lack experienced drivers, then you have other problems and they can't be solved by letting unqualified people operate. To answer another poster above, yes you could conceivably go your entire career without being a chauffeur. You could certainly be promoted before you become chauffeur qualified. I don't think this is the best case scenario, but it's not terrible. If you have a good chauffeur, an officer shouldn't need to concern themselves with driving or rig placement.

I don't even think we should get this far. At 18-20 something, you don't even have enough experience to be a good firefighter. All you can hope to be is a good student, trainee, probie or whatever you want to call it. Apparatus operations is another step. Why don't we learn to skate before we learn to play hockey. In NYC the earliest you MIGHT hope to drive is about 26. Probably not at night and hopefully with the help of a more seasoned Chauffeur riding the backstep. Regular chauffeurs tend to be, at the very least, in their thirties. Now, age really doesn't have anything to do with this debate. It's about experience and in your teens and early 20's you simply don't have the time to have the experience. If someone that age can say they've been to "plenty of jobs", than that in itself demonstrates a complete lack of experience. Someone at any age might be able to drive the vehicle backwards forwards and sidways, but that doesn't mean that you've encountered enough real life situations to know about to react.

All this talk of, "well, you have to examine things on a case by case basis" stuff is getting a little out of hand. No one here has said that an 18 year old can't be a good driver and that drivers in their 20's, 30's, 40's ect, are perfect. Of course that's not the case. However, in many places, including the NY metro area, you can get a permit until you're 16. You can't get a full drivers license until you've turned 17 (18 without drivers ed.). So....we're going to be okay with someone with a WHOPPING 1 year of driving experience operating an emergency vehicle? We're starting to beat a dead horse here, but the facts just don't lend themselves to supporting drivers in their teens. The insurance industry tracks driving accidents and finds that men under 25 are the highest risk category across the board. At 18 you've barely had enough time to take FF1, FF2 and EVOC, ect. how can you be driving? How many responses have you actually been on? If you're 18, you just became legally able to fight fires. How many could you possibly been to? 2? Be real, how many times in your brief career have you been in a serious fire. These are all things that you need to train and learn about. Driving is a whole 'nother batch of things to worry about and plan for. You need to understand a lot about what's important at fires, ect to know what to do. How can you effectively do that when you know nothing. (At 18 you know nothing). I've been in the fire service for 11 years, not quite 5 in NYC and guess what.....I know just the SLIGHTEST bit more than nothing, which is effectively still nothing! The idea that a teenager can be trusted behind the wheel of a large fire apparatus or ambulance is ludicrous. There simply hasn't been the time to accumulate enough experience at any aspect of the fire service. Odds are, in fact, that a person who is 18 has never taken the first line down a charged hallway. They simply have too much to learn at that age and thinking of putting them behind the wheel and adding a whole slew of additional responsibilities is stupid and irresponsible of someone in a position of authority.

And how is "it"? This is an unfortunately typical statement for the fire service. The old, "100 Years of Tradition Unimpeded by Progress" line. I'm all for tradition. I like my smooth bore nozzles and leather helmets, but there are areas, such as fire apparatus operation, where the situation and conditions must be examined and strict rules established. I'm familiar with your department. It's a very regimented shop with specific and stringent rules and training requirements. Frustrating as it may be, it has allowed that dept. to earn and maintain a reputation as a top shelf operation. Without order there is chaos. Sadly, we seem to find a lot more chaos in our chosen profession.

I believe that the 10 code for a working fire in Westchester is 10-22. I don't know about Yonkers for MV or WP, but the county shows it as 10-22. 10-75 seems to have been adopted for whatever reason. Sounds better? I'm not really certain what the reason for the addition of that code was, or why that code was chosen. Does it, technically, have a different meaning than 10-22?

Unfortunately you don't need a CDL to drive fire/ems apparatus.

You cannot do things on an individual or department by department basis. There's too much grey area there. This is one case where a blanket regulation needs to be created. When you allow for too much "home rule" you create loop holes and exceptions. That's not a good scenario for a F.D.

I'm going to disagree with Texastom791 above. While there are exceptions to every rule....you can't write laws and regulations for exceptions. You have to blanket everyone. Now, I'm not claiming to be old and wise, but I'm old enough to realize how little you know and how shallow your depth of experience is when you're....say under 25 (give or take, of course). Operating an emergency vehicle is a tremendous responsibility and it's one that, i feel, is beyond the scope of the average teenager. It's no coincidence that your auto insurance rates drop dramatically when you turn 25, or that a rental car company won't let you one of their cars until you've cleared that age. People in under that age have a dramatically higher accident rate. This rate is even more pronounced for the ages 16-19. If you fall into that catagory, you shouldn't be operating an emergency vehicle. I'm sure that some enterprising and ambitious teens will not like this post, relax, it's not a dig. And while you might feel yourself capable today, you have to leave that in the hands of someone with greater knowledge and foresight. That person is not me, by the way . Relax, there's no rush. You've got plenty of time to drive. What do ya wanna drive for anyway? Hook up and look up? I don't know about you, but I'd rather have the nozzle!

Several EMS units are assigned to all all-hands and higher fires. In addition to buses, EMS responds with at least one MERV to check the CO levels of members who operated at the job. That's not really rehab though, that's EMS. Rehab consists of the RAC unit. A RAC (Rehabilitation and Care) unit is assigned on the 10-75. They bring coolers filled with water, gatorade and cool towels. Guys grab what they need as their company is relieved. (A good junior guy will usually pick-up a round of water for everyone else )

NYC has exercised it's option to tack on to this order. They have ordered 21 additional RM aerials from Ferrara. While the "In Production" site doesn't show it, apparently they have completed 10 so far, half of the original order, with the rest to be completed before the winter. None are in service yet, but I've had the chance to poke around one of them. A lot of room in the back for the member. Good tool storage and some interesting inovations. They seem to be super heavy duty, more so than the current fleet. Time will tell, but they look and feel good on the surface.

I was a bit brief in my first response. It was a little late at nigh and I was sleepy...anyway... More than specific training on one type of passenger car, training on rail operations should be (at least to a basic level) something that is part of a fire departments regular training schedule. I doubt there are many, if any, departments that don't have a piece of active rail in their response area. Westchester is served by 2 branches of Metro-North and the Northeast Corridor which is owned by Metro-North for it's New Haven Line operations and is used by Amtrak, CSX and the Providence and Worchester Railroad on a regular basis. The Hudson Line also carries a fair amount of freight daily, along with Amtrak Empire Service. All told, Metro North accounts for more than 600 trains per day and if you tack on a few dozen Amtrak trains, some freight and maintenance moves, we're probably in the ballpark of 700 railroad movements per day. That's gotta bring the chances of accident to a higher level. Some of these trains are moving at speeds approaching 100mph. Just consider the potential damage from something that weights nearly 1,000,000 lbs. moving at that speed. Do we have the Haz-Mat resources available? Are we aware of how to determine what cargo is aboard a freight train? Everyone should have a loose familiarity with local rail operations. Sizing up a scene and determining what resources are needed and what's available will help to make the rest of the operation run a little smoother. After that, you can get into cargo mitigation, life-safety, lifting and anchor points, ect. ect.....and more stuff that's outta my scope of knowledge.

The safety systems on the M8 don't differ all that much from the M7a. Windows that are easily removed and areas to be cut by a saw are marked in the same manor. My point is, there isn't too much need for M8 specific training, but all FD's should have at least some formal contact with the MTA Fire Brigade and some preparedness training. I've been a couple of times to the Highbridge Yard in the Bronx.

Yeah...for year #3. I wonder if we can go for year #4? Sadly, I see that on the horizon and it'll be up to the Unions and the City Council to cobble together the money again. One of the Bronx engines that was on the chopping block was our neighboring company. They are no camp and had they been shuttered by this short sighted mayor, it would have put a lot of strain on the community, us and the other surrounding engines. This, I'm sure, is the story for every single one of those 20 companies and this victory is one for city residents and city firemen alike. These cuts would have lowered the average % of available units and led to longer response times and a dramatic increase in the loss of life and property. I can only hope we don't have to jump through these hoops again in 11 months......

The Eng. 3 and 4 with the Ferrara Ultra chassis is discontinued. There is a new "ultra" chassis.

JBE, you are 100% correct, but you put this very gently. Since the advent of the UTC system, response times have been printed as having been reduced. This is most certainly not the case. We all know that response times have increased. They achieved a better response time on paper by simply changing the time keeping rules. Time spent with a UCT operator is not counted and therefor the clock starts later, after the information is sent to FD/PD/EMS, ect. So off the bat, we have an increase in response times. What do we get for this added time? Nothing except a reduction in the quality and reliability of information. I WISH I had statistics, but we are responding to more erroneous calls for fire with no 10-7 available. All too often we respond to what turns out to be a 10-75 with little or no information. We get an address, cross-street and something that reads "Multidwell - A". That's it! So we have a run for fire or smoke in a multiple-dwelling. The city has made our job and yours (the dispatchers) harder and reduced the quality of service we can provide, simply to lower a number they can print in the paper. There should be a national standard for measuring response times. When does it start and when does it end. Response times are used as a weapon for cutbacks by city halls all over the country. They do this by duping the public. If they close the ladder on City Island, they say, "it's okay, a UNIT will be there in about 4 minutes. What if a person is hanging out of the 3rd floor window with heavy fire on the 2nd floor. What can the engine do? Nothing, except try to put the fire out without ventilation and forcible entry teams. Back to that person on the window sill; That poor soul has to wait 9:33 seconds for 61 truck from Co-op city. Hope they're not on a stuck elevator run...then you'll be waiting for...uh...good question, maybe 59 Truck off the Bruckner or 51 Truck on Eastchester Rd.? I'm sure I could continue this diatribe with the issue of how long it takes to get water on the fire, but I feel like I'm starting to beat the dead horse. Response time recording methods should be standardized and the clock should start when 911 is dialed and end when ALL units needed TO BEGIN fire suppression are on scene. Perhaps that's the first 1+1 or really 2+1 in the FDNY case.

SAFE Boats makes really nice craft. That's the 27', no? Same as the NYPD and Coast Guard. SAFE has been making fire boats as well in increasing size. (FDNY Marine 6 is a SAFE 56')

One of the best way's to get a raw cross-section of a department's efficiency is to look at how many Fr. there are per capita. If you have two departments who's apparatus are equally staffed, how many Fr. are there per resident. Why is the FDNY cheaper, yet well staffed? Because size allows for efficiency. This is yet another angle with which to examine consolidation. You use Ossining in your example. We can't examine this on a manpower level, because you don't know exactly how many people are available at any given moment and are ready to respond. Just for examples sake, take number of apparatus. If Ossining has 10 pieces of apparatus (give or take) that means there is one big red truck for every 3767 people. In New Rochelle, the population doubles and the ratio jumps to almost 9,000 residents per company. When you go to a larger model, FDNY in this case, you end up with an even higher ratio. There is one company for every 21,250 New Yorkers. Yet, response times run in the 4 minute area and there are always 28 Fr. and a chief on scene within 6-8 minutes, often less. Size and efficiency, the main reasons for lower costs. *cough**cough* consolidation.....for all.

Well they aren't, but everything is cyclical. Nicer parks should equal a more attractive municipality and this brings people, people who pay taxes. Also, most people will never need the fire department and it's not always at the forefront of their minds. This isn't right, because no one needs us until the REALLY need us, but it explains peoples attitudes.

While some combo and career departments could use merging, I think the easiest area to start is in the volunteer sector. You do not have collective bargaining agreements to worry about. Of course there are concerns. There are logistics to be worked out in each scenario, along with some regard for pride and history. As for the career side of things, that get sticky. You might have to deal with paying people more, or creating positions that will disappear with attrition. You can't ask people to take any sort of pay-cut, but if they hold a position that will not fit with a new command structure, then they receive a title in the new system that reflects the responsibility they had prior. Salaries will have to even in time.

I'm not looking to insult the drive or ability of the individual firefighters, not one bit, but Nassau and Suffolk are far from good examples of how to run a fire service. Again, this isn't a knock at firefighting ability or intention, but at structure and management. As for the examples you give, I have a question about each. In the Suffolk example, you state that several departments have mutual aid agreements in place during the day. Some of these agreements involve the dispatching of more than two departments to one agency's incident. This seems silly. So, we get more apparatus than needed rolling and from greater distances because one particular department can't provide manpower during weekdays? Why not merge, pair down the amount of equiptment, better spread it among firehouses and utilize the manpower you have to the fullest. As for the Nassau example, if they move the apparatus to one firehouse during the day (the time when traffic is at it's peak) why do they need all of the firehouses? Why not save money, sell the buildings and run out of that central firehouse all of the time. If response times are adequate during the day, then they'd surely be adequate at night when traffic is lighter. As for the latter example, sadly, I'm sure each company has it's own bar in it's firehouse and that's why they much maintain these sort-of sovereign companys. We need to get past these old school ideas of how the fire service should be.