Capejake72

Our dept. has 3 shifts of 6 and a very small "call division" of 8-10. Recalls occur fairly often about an average of 30 times a month but we can go days with none and have 6 another day.  These used to be by platoon a few decades ago when our call division was much larger, but now they are "all come" recalls. I track call payroll and FT recall attendance and on average we get 2.2 FT personnel per recall. We are paid a min. of 2 hrs OT for all recalls 0600-2300 and 3 hrs OT from 2300-0600 or anytime on holidays. Sadly only 3 of our career personnel live inside the city limits, so it does affect turnout and the speed at which the station is covered.  None of our call division personnel are EMS licensed, so that makes recalls a bit more difficult, as of course this is 75% of our work. Most are fully certified FF2 and driver operated certified annually, but alas, the call force is dwindling to the core group and there is very little outside interest to join.
 
I know that over the years recall attendance by career staff ebbs and flows. Younger guys tend to have other jobs off-duty, then there are guys with families that have childcare responsibilities during time off, those who get somewhat burned-out tend to not respond to routine recalls. On the plus side, we have one Lt. who lives in town who takes as much OT as possible come to most callbacks, and one or two other personnel who are pretty regular.  With structure fires being down, we get decent turnouts for most first alarms. My own personal situation is that I used to be 'Johnny on the spot" even though I lived about 15 min. away, but  as I've aged, I find getting back to sleep much more difficult and operating with less sleep much harder, thus I pass up more recalls at night than before even though I live closer. 
 
The one thing that seems to motivate career personnel  in our dept. is that your off-duty attendance of training and recalls can be a factor in promotions, as personnel who are "always" there tend to be favored when other things are on par between candidates. With a large percentage of our officers eligible to retire in the next 3 years this likely will result in some making a greater effort.  

I am not in Westchester County, however, where I am the following is the norm:
 
1) Most departments have minimal on-duty staff. Some have vollies to supplement but not all have vollies.
2) Every department has recalls. Members use either their personal cell phones to receive the request OR have a Minitor pager.
3) There is no requirement to come back for duty. Some members use recall as their 2nd job and come in a lot, others don't come in at all and may have their own business such as plumber or carpenter.
4) Many departments have no residency requirements and they work 24 on/ 24 off / 24 on / 5 days off. This leads to members living 45 minutes away in a different county and they are not even in a position for recall.
5) Most departments have a recall hierarchy. Example: If Group 1 is on-duty, then Group 2 may be the primary recall group. The first request goes to them. If no one calls in within 2 minutes, then Group 3 is the secondary recall group. They get paged out and if no one calls in within 2 minutes, then a recall for all groups is sent out. Usually these requests go out for a certain number of members. Example: 3 needed for station coverage and the first 3 to call in get the coverage.
6) Structure fire calls go to full-department recalls immediately and then it's a "you all come." Anybody and everybody can respond.
7) One disadvantage to the whole system is that there may be 2 or 3 calls for station coverage during the day and people are quick to jump on that. They get their hours in and then they turn off their phone/pager at night. Recalls for manpower after midnight and this includes structure fires will usually get very minimal recall. There was a nursing home fire (contained to one room) at 3 AM and a 2nd Alarm was struck. Only 2 off-duty members came in to help out. This department did not have vollies. Mutual Aid was used almost exclusively.
8) My only complaint is that many of the department members don't want more people hired because that would cut into their recalls. The more people on-duty, the less need for recalls. But then they cherry-pick their calls and you may have 10 off-duty members show up for a 2 pm fire and only 2 members show up to a 2 am fire. Unfortunately it's all about them and their bottom line. There seems to be less and less commitment to coming in when "the poop is hitting the fan." As for me, if a 2nd Alarm is struck, I feel a moral obligation to get up and respond no matter what time of day or night. It's the system that's been set up and some effort should be given in responding "for the good of the community." They seem to want it both ways, "If it's convenient for me and I'm short on funds I'll go. If it's not convenient then I won't go." In my area it's only a matter of time before the public becomes dissatisfied with the response to some pretty serious calls and manpower per shift will have to be increased. 
9) Departments in my area are staffed with anywhere from 3 on-duty to 12-on duty. The smaller departments will recall 3 for coverage once units are committed (car fire, MVA, etc.). The larger departments won't recall until available manpower falls below a certain number, 6 as an example.
10) Vollies only used for full-department recalls, not for station coverage and not to fill open shifts. 

Prince George's County, MD is at Pierce for the final inspection of HAZMAT 816. Due to the size of the county, PGFD's HAZMAT Team includes three stations. Station 816 (Northview) is located somewhat centrally within the county and has the larger HAZMAT rig. A Breathing Air Unit, Decon Unit, and the Safety Officer also run out of that house. Station 812 (College Park) and Station 845 (Marlboro/Croom) have smaller HAZMAT Support Units (similar to a soda truck) to get things started until 816 arrives. The Technical Rescue Team is set up in a similar fashion for collapse, confined space, and high angle; with a large cache of centralized equipment and two satellite stations.

Photos are courtesy of PGFD Fire Chief Benjamin Barksdale on Twitter: https://twitter.com/BenBmbarksdale/status/864226221231616000/photo/1

We have a department policy on blue lights with an overview below:
 
- Must live in town (we accept members from neighboring towns but require they staff at the stations).
- Must have completed Driver/Operator certification and be checked off the drive our apparatus Code 3 (emergent).
- Must have a good driving record.
- Then requires Fire Chief approval.  He also has to approve the type of light installed (we don't allow anything more than a dash light) and the member has to purchase the light.
- Lights can be used to respond to the station for Code 3 (emergent) calls only and can only be used in the city limits.
- The Fire Chief may revoke any blue light permit if there are complaints.
 
For the record I think there are only three people on our department who have a blue light permit including myself.  I rarely use my light for response but being an officer I occasionally end up going direct to the scene (or come across an incident) and will use it then for visibility on-scene.  We are probably going to eventually phase out blue lights, more of a liability then benefit.

Big deal made one out of 3/4 in PVC 20 years ago to clean my plow trucks in my driveway with hot water from my home hot water heater

This is a great idea. It would be great for fire and other emergency vehicles.
 
 

Last Sunday,  I had the opportunity to look over and photograph this unique and impressive rig!
 
2016 Peterbilt 567  with a Century 50 Ton Rotator (can be remote controlled) and body, 10KW generator, and air compressor syste,m, amongst many other customizations.
 
This rig replaces a similar rig, a 2003 Peterbilt/Century, which will become a fully equipped spare. The spare is replacing the former spare, which will be kept in the USAR caches.
 
Thanks again to the crew at Station 56 and the HR56 guys!
 

 
 

Glens Towing of Elmsford just took delivery recently of this beast of a wrecker that can tow anything. Hope to get a connection some more photos of the working end soon. Glen's is located in Elmsford, NY and specializes in hauling large equipment. They recently began covering I-287 as the authorized provider of heavy wrecker services. (This truck's NYSTA radio identifier is 511-4)
 
Some of the specs include:
2008 Kenworth T800 Chassis
2016 B & B Industries Custom Wrecker
5 Axles
50 Ton, Integrated 3 Stage Boom
50,000 pound wheel lift
Can handle 80 Tons
Has the boom tubes of a 70-ton rotator (highly unique)
Side Jack Legs
 
Only two wreckers like this exist. Both of them belong to Glens Towing.
 
I'd never heard of B&B Industries Wreckers before, but after looking through some of their builds, it is truly an amazing company that will build exactly what you want.
Here's their website if you want to take a look at some: http://www.billbottoms.com/ 
 

To add to my above post, as per teaching firefighters to shut off gas in the street. Did you just walk up to the firehouse one day and say I want to be a firefighter, then was invited in, given gear, told you were the OV and then told to get on the rig, we've got a run? No, of course not. Whether paid or volley, their is mandated training that you must pass. Then their is requalifying, maintaining of the equipment etc, etc. Not to mention the experience factor. Can't teach that. Well the same thing exists in Con Ed. Contrary to popular opinion, we're not just pilot light lighters or as a Mt Vernon PD Sgt once said to me, "you're nothing but a bunch of ditch diggers."  There is required training, requalifying and certain equipment to use and maintain. Every Con Ed gas truck has a CGI on it that costs $3500.00. It has to be calibrated monthly and every time the batteries are replaced. If you want to play Con Ed, you have to play by the rules and have to have the same equipment that Con Ed has. Who is going to pay for those CGIs you'll have to have. Who is going to calibrate them when required. The calibrating device is rather expensive too. Who is going to arrange and pay for the training and requalifying? Con Ed gas comes under Federal DOT guidelines. As I stated in my above post about the FD that shut off a bunch of gas main valves trying to secure a leak and in error (and it was the FDNY, not a volley company). If a Con Ed mechanic operates a valve in error whether it be a main valve or curb valve as per DOT guidelines, he is immediately taken off duty, taken for drug and alcohol testing and remains off duty until completion of the investigation even if he was directed  or ordered to do so.  It's a serious business, not a game.

First of all, I spent 42 years working for Con Ed in the Bronx and Westchester with the last 14 in Westchester as a supervisor in gas emergency until I retired last year. I responded to countless gas leak complaints both as a mechanic and as a supervisor. I am also a volunteer firefighter in Orange county. For me personally, the last thing I wanted to see is the fire dept on location when I arrived. They don't have the required equipment or training mandated by the PSC or the experience to investigate a leak. If it's on fire, I don't want anybody else than the fire dept but unfortunately the majority of firefighters lose interest quickly if it's not on fire. Then the paid depts. want to put the companies back in service asap and the volley companies in the day time Mon-Fri had what we call the paid firefighters responding, ie, the DPW members and their boss wants them back to work. So I would just prefer Con Ed to respond and if I need the services of the fire dept, I would request the FD.  At a damage that I responded to one time with the fire dept on location and blowing gas, the chief in charge told me they had shut off numerous valves to no good. I asked him how many valves and where they were. I got the deer in the headlights look back. I then went over and turned off the curb valve on the damaged service and secured the leak. They had turned off gas to numerouse homes and business, over 50. Restoration of gas is not simply turning the valves back on and is time consuming and costly.  A little info on responding. The New York State PSC mandates that all gas leak complaints must be responded to within 60 minutes. Con Ed has told the PSC that they will respond to 75% of the leak complaints within 30 minutes. That works well in the Bronx, Manhattan and Queens but can be difficult in Westchester. Con Ed will request the fire dept to respond if certain criterias of the leak complaint require it but the understanding is that it is to make safe by evacuating people in the area of the leak not to mitigate it.  The finest example of that was the damage in Scarsdale about 10 years ago where the contractor pulled the 1" high pressure service out of the regulator in the bsmt with ensuing high pressure gas filling up the house. The contractor called 911 and reported it but he did not evacuate his workers from the bldg. When the Scarsdale FD arrived, they evacuated the house where the damage was and the surrounding houses also. They opened windows in the house where the damage was to ventilate but being a cold day, the temperature dropped in the house and the thermostat called for heat and the house exploded but there were no injuries. Job well done. What would the outcome have been if they decided to look for valves? The curb valve was buried under construction material, main valves were further away in the intersections at the end of the street and can be and usually are difficult to open. In many older areas main valves can be much further apart than just in the immediate intersections and many are paved over. I was working the night of a gas main fire in Mamaroneck the night of a severe thunderstorm that took down a primary electric cable which grounded out on the ground burning a hole through a 4" steel medium pressure main that was four feet deep in the ground and igniting the gas. Such is the power of primary electric. Looking at our maps, I saw the location of the main valve but could not locate it, only a water valve. I had my construction crew start excavating in the area of where the main was (it was a one way feed down a dead end street) and had my two leak responders start searching for surrounding main valves to secure this leak and fire, a total of five more valves. While we were trying to locate theses valves, the water company responded to mark out the water main and services. After about 45 minutes, he came over to me and stated they did not have a water main any where near where the water valve box was. I had my crew open up that box to see if it was our gas main valve but it was filled with asphalt. I had my crew excavate that box down to the valve and it was our gas valve which we then shut to secure the leak and extinguish the fire. That took 2 1/2-3 hours to do from our time of arrival. Definitely unacceptable in my book and I spent the next hour apoligizing to the chief who was a genuine nice guy. It turned out the road had been repaved about 2 years prior. The contractor had damaged the gas valve box, did not report it and replaced it with a water valve box he had. You never know what you will find. Now back to the Scarsdale incident.  If I recall correctly, the FD said from the time of their arrival to the explosion was about 5 minutes. The first Con Ed responder, a supervisor, was able to locate and t/off the curb valve stemming the gas that was feeding the fire. As I stated earlier, the PCS does not want code 3 response and I personally did not want code 3 response having driven fire dept rigs code 3 and knowing the dangers. So my opinion and the way I understood the policy, the fire dept is to evacuate and make safe. 

Down here in the South, most of my neighbors not only have fire pits, they have burn piles for their yard debris.  After Tropical Storm Hermine, clean up was easy as we just kept feeding his burn pile.
 
Took a little getting used to when you see a column of smoke rising behind the neighbors house.

So, so those that didn't see my Spy Shot previously posted, the Town Of Greenburgh Police Department Special Operations Division acquired this 2002 Mack MC/Saulsbury from NYD surplus (Formerly Truck 3 and Truck 5). The refurbishment, including engine and electrical overhaul, chassis work, paint, etc was done all in house by the Greenburgh Town Garage.
 
Here's a shot of it in service and finished, although equipment continues to be mounted:
 

Back in the early 70's, the ghetto area companies (Harlem;south Bronx; Bed-Sty;Brownsville,etc) had manning as follows: the engine companies had 6 firefighters and an officer- but the city tried an experiment with "Rapid water engines", which had a slurry tank on top of the booster tank that added a "friction-reducing additive" to water being pumped out the 1-3/4" line. If the RW system was in-service, the manning was reduced to 5 firefighters (money-saving idea). But the only way to know if the system was operational was the "green light" on the pump panel. The brothers would (at times) unscrew the light bulb so it didn't show green. Hence the Battalion chief would hire the 6th firefighter back until the "shops" checked out the system. We really did need that 6th man, as we would routinely have "fire out the windows" at least once every tour, and the SCBA's were not readily available. The ladder companies ("trucks" had the standard 5 firefighters and an officer, EXCEPT- in certain high activity areas we had "adaptive response trucks". From 1500 hrs- 2400 hrs the dispatchers would send one truck instead of the standard two trucks (on a pulled street box ), but the AR truck would have 7 firefighters. The 2 "extra firefighters would act as the 2nd due truck, searching the floor above. On a phone alarm the dispatchers would send 2 trucks anyway, so the idea was not kept for long. In 1975 when thousands of us were laid-off in the NYC fiscal crisis, all these "ideas" and pilot programs went away. There were also "TCU " trucks that were operational from afternoon to after midnight, and also second section engines . Crazy times, but it was the greatest time to be a firefighter in the greatest city and the greatest dept in the world. I remember many tours where the Bronx dispatcher would plead for any available company to "free up for a working fire". There were several times where the deputy chief would order us on the dept radio to leave our hose in the street as we were "taking up" and respond to another job. Sometimes I feel that I know how Lou Gehrig of the NY Yankees felt, when he said how blessed he was to be able to "be on the team".

Here ya go Brother, this link seems to be working:
 

"All hands" or signal 7-5 (not to be confused with 10-75 are most frequently used when referring to structural fires.  But not necessarily.  You can transmit a 10-75 for a fire or emergency.  Gas leaks, manhole fires, brush fires, and other incident can and do result in the transmission of a 10-75.  As for the all hands when 3 and 2 are being used you are using all hands.  A reported structural fire gets an assignment of 3 engines, 2 trucks, and a battalion chief.  If the chief uses 2 and 2 and holds the 3rd engine fast it's not an all hands.  The scenarios with using 2 and 2 on the highway box don't constitute an all hands.  
 
As for the SOC unit response
The transmission of a 10-75 results in the dispatch of the normally assigned rescue and squad if available.  If the fire/incident escalates to an all hands doubtful a rescue and squad will be assigned regardless.  If a chief advises he used all hands and is under control they will not receive the SOC units and other specialized units.  
 
I'm sure this is still confusing and I'm not sure I'm doing it justice but I'll use and example of a working fire to show the units assigned and timing.  
 
Phone call reporting a fire in a building.  
3 Engines, 2 Ladders, and 1 Battalion Chief are dispatched.  
 
First engine arrives and finds a working fire and transmits a 10-75.  
4th Engine is assigned, 3 truck(FAST), additional Battalion Chief, and the Deputy Chief is notified
 
Usually at the first progress report the chief notes what he is using.  This is usually when the all hands is transmitted with the status of the fire Doubtful, probably will hold, under control.  
 
In the outer boroughs the vast majority of "All Hands" are transmitted for fires.  

Yes, very impressive. But let's go back to the 1970s. The time is referred to as "The FDNY War Years". No other place in the world has seen more fires on a daily basis than the FDNY.
 
 I believe the busiest month for MULTIPLE ALARM FIRES was August, 1977 (according to a newsletter from the Fire Bell Club). During that time, the FDNY had a TOTAL of 100 Multiple Alarm Fires. The numbers of fires were staggering at the time.
 
 In addition, I recently had the honor of meeting the Captain of Engine 82 during the time when a famous book came out called "Report from Engine Co 82". According to this former captain, now retired chief, Engine Co 82 responded to 210 working building fires just in July, 1975. That's a rate of seven working fires every day of the month. In fact, it's more than the Entire City had for the previous month of August, 2016.
 
  This now retired FDNY Chief is 79 years old. Still loves the job but as he says "It was the Best and the Worst of times". Many civilians and firefighters were hurt and many lost their lives. In the South Bronx where Engine 82 was, along with many other large areas of the city, it looked much like a bomb had been dropped on it. All because so many buildings were burned out from the huge number of fires.
 
  I spent many days down there buffing and watching these guys work. What I saw was Unbelievable and I will never forget it. I once brought a few buddies down there with me. In only a few square miles we saw 11 working fires that day. Of course there were many more throughout the city as well. But after spending about 12-14 hours there it was time to leave. As we left the Bronx, one of the guys told me, "it was like they opened the gates and let us out".
 
  Today I have many friends who are retired members of the FDNY during that time. I still can't believe the amount of work these guys caught. I refer to them as "The Greatest Generation of Firefighters". You can check out www.nycfire.net in the history section for more details. The thread "My Younger Buff Years", is one of them.
 
  And here's a few pictures from another good friend who had permission to ride with a few Harlem companies back in the 1980s.  www.fdnysbravest.com

Clearly this guy has the ability to make his opinion seen, too bad the real story won't. He doesn't understand EMD protocols, just in case his daughter was seriously injured. He'd likely be very unhappy if a BLS bus was sent and she had a more significant injury. He doesn't understand that much of EMS costs are part of providing the necessary training and resources to be immediately available to respond? He just doesn't get that until people are there, no one can be sure the requisite level that's needed and after they arrive and determine the injury is BLS in nature it would be more money to wait for a BLS bus to come and transport her or maybe he should find fault with the school who called 911 for such a trivial injury? I'd hardly call the billing rates dictated to us by Medicare as some sort of evidence of collusion between the ambulance company and the insurance companies. Maybe he'd like for EMS to be municipally run, taxpayer funded and free to the users? 

 
 
LA City FD covers about 4 million people over 471 square miles. They have a huge fleet including over 162 Engines, 42 trucks, 100 ambulances, and tons of support vehicles, including ARFF trucks and helicopters.  This truck (and it's spare)  responds to about 30-40 calls where the boom is placed into rescue service each year.  It's also on call to tow any disabled apparatus.  Additionally, it also provides support services, such as uprighting overturned vehicles and trucks or removing them from cliffs, etc. It's also a good tool for moving debris during large scale emergencies such as earthquakes and other USAR operations.

HR56 is staffed by a technician trained in its operation and a firefighter 24/7 out of station 56 if I recall. It is used extensively by not only LAFD but the surrounding agencies and has been made available to any SoCal department that needs it. 

Rotators were once a towing industry specialty, and now they are becoming an industry standard. As far as FD's, Los Angeles County FD and Washington DC also have a rotator in their fleet, but have been unable to duplicate LAFD's program. I'm actually surprised that they are not more commonplace in the fire service.
 
Stiloski's was one of the first in our area to have a rotator. John has and still owns several 60 and 75 tons.  Vincent Towing is another local company that has a 75 ton.
 
The rotator was also brought to fame by the TV Show "Wrecked: Life in the Crash Lane" which was aired on the SPEED Network in 2008-2009, which followed a large heavy truck towing and recovery company as they responded to wrecks along Chicago's numerous highways.
 
Jerr-Dan, a competitor to the industry leader, Miller Industries Century brand, had a rotator on display at FDIC. A friend of mine snapped a photo. He knows who he is and that I'm still upset he didn't bring it home for me LOL. I hope I will see in Harrisburg if I get to go.
 

Awesome. Awesome. Awesome. Did I mention awesome?
 
PHOTOS:
 

*SPY SHOTS*
New FDNY Fleet Services Wrecker
2016 Mack Granite/Century
 
Photos from: Pete's Towing and Auto Body
 

 

 
Photos from: Pete's Towing and Auto Body

Border areas will always be a problem. The river also has some unique safety issues both for responders and victims. Having multiple radios is not the best option for responding crew, having a dispatch center capable of patching different channels together is really the best option. Here in Stamford we have a couple of areas that are generally dual response with Greenwich. We have a permanent patch with Greenwich so both agencies can talk to each other. However if the incident does not include Greenwich on the initial another ground or tactical channel may be assigned. If so I can manually patch that channel into the Greenwich channel and their incoming units can talk to anyone on scene as if they were all on the same channel. Sadly we do not have that capability with 60 control, so instead Banksville (and I think also Pound Ridge) used to carry portables on our old high band system. I do not think either have our trunked radios now. On a statewide level we have stocks boxes available to deploy that will take portable radios provided on scene and patch them together through a hard wire connection. I know there is a state one available in Fairfield. I have been told there is one available somewhere in Stamford but I have never seen it and don't have a clue where it is or how to mobilize it.
 
So let dispatch be the resource they can be and give us the tools to do it right.
 
As for who is in charge, as we have moved kicking and screaming into ICS over the years we have to remember that when several agencies are assigned to the same incident, that it is still only one incident and as such there is a single IC. There may be various groups of regional resources and it makes perfect sense to have a local officer in charge of that group, but they are not the IC. That being said, we tend to fall back on the most common terminology and often don't think of what we are saying, so I can see a chief on one side of the river arriving on scene (shore) and assuming command, despite not really being anything more than a group leader for a region. With the radio troubles it is likely that the IC on the other side was unaware of this and was probably not all that offended.
 
As for what agencies responded and if they were really needed, just about every agency there is has a response plan. In the case of a river rescue (especially at night) that may include multiple agencies. Sometimes an agency calling for assistance is unaware of what the responding agency will actually send. Two local examples for me will follow.
 
1) Stamford Fire for a long time had a policy of sending their own RIT and Safety Officer on mutual aid fires. So one night New Canaan calls for a single Engine to help with in line pumping. They specifically needed this engine at a hydrant and gave directions to that hydrant. They got that engine, a second engine as the RIT and a Deputy Chief as a safety officer. To many this was overkill, and once it was determined that the RIT was not needed, New Canaan requested that Engine to relocate to their station for coverage. In the end the resources was not needed but was utilized in a better capacity. However Stamford still maintained the integrity of their SOG's and dispatched what they would normally send regardless of the specific request.
 
2) In Stamford our standard response to an MVC is 1 Engine, 1 Rescue & 1 Medic. Now on I95 the State Police gets on scene and tells their dispatcher they need EMS. They don't call us directly, they call Southwest C-Med who calls us. So all we really know is they want an ambulance. We still send all three, for a couple of reasons. First is for crew safety, the two big rigs can be blockers if nothing else. There is also the likelihood of needing additional manpower, since there are usually multiple patients, even when the injuries are minor. Third is that the State Police do not often give a good size up, and we have had EMS arrive and call for spill/leak control, extrication and even extinguishment, so now, no matter what the CSP asks for, they get EMS & FD. 
 
So if Rockland calls and says they have a River Rescue and want Westchester to come from their side, Westchester may just send a couple of boats, they may call for WCPD aviation, they will most likely do exactly what they would do if they were the primary agency getting the first call. That is not necessarily a bad thing.

We spend oodles of money to make sure every FF has proper structural firefighting gear.  Some departments go so far as to provide two sets to allow for cleaning, etc.
 
Why then, do we continue to wear the wrong or no PPE at all when fighting brush fires????

Am I the only one this bothers?  Isn't a couple hundred bucks worth the expense to properly protect our people?

I'm going to hopefully just have to say something once and this nonsense is going to end on this topic. It is not right that certain people here are bashing certain organizations that are involved in conducting fire/rescue on the Hudson River. Everybody tries their best with what they have, whether it be manpower and resource wise. Some departments should know what they have and use them wisely. Some should know whether to go out or call in and say the resource isn't available at this time and then get the right resources out there. But, everybody has a role in trying to get good communication going and honestly certain groups don't like to play in the same sandbox with others for certain reasons that more than likely are ridiculous. I didn't hear anybody complain almost a month ago when a fatal tug accident occurred and the initial response was conducted in such an exceptional manor. The first responders got there within minutes of the accident and were able to conduct a rescue attempt that was absolutely textbook. Care was given and the guys went back out there to keep the operation going. No one said anything then. But, that's not always the case and sometimes people need to realize that and get a grip and not put blame on other people. What needs to start happening is working together than trying to work apart. If everybody knows that there is an incident on the River, maybe have a specific Marine Radio Channel open, designated for that traffic. Marine Radio is open to all and all you need is that Marine Radio. You don't need to have to relay traffic from one department to another then. Just have it put out there that this is the standard when an incident occurs. And everybody, and I mean EVERYBODY, needs to be involved and know that. Trust me, no one is freelancing out on the River. 60 Control dispatches and units respond. And ultimately, no one can say anything if they haven't experienced it before or have been involved in the operations that occur on the Hudson River. It's just like the fireground, Stop Monday Morning Quaterbacking and stick to whatever you really know. There are guys putting themselves out there, on the line, and all some of you want to do is dog them...shame on you guys for that! We are all out here to do a service for our communities and to help save lives and property, remember the fundamentals sometimes guys!