helicopper

A lot of years ago I was at a fatal MVA in the dead of winter that required blood and bodily fluids to be washed down. The road could not be left the way it was so the FD was requested, they responded, washed the blood and other icky stuff away and DOT salted/sanded to prevent icing. This allowed us to all go home. As for who's responsibility it is, that's a good question. Ultimately, I guess the PD will have to facilitate it but that doesn't mean they're responsible for it. Whoever "owns" the road is probably responsible (ie DOT/DPW/Highway). After all, it's the building owner who has to clean off the sidewalk in front of their building in similar situations, right?

Just to clarify, my inquiry is not specifically about Bedford Hills. I would just like someone to substantiate the assertion that volunteer FD's "save" the taxpayers money. If someone were to conduct an across the board analysis including the insurance rates paid by residents of a volunteer district, would volunteer departments actually be cheaper? Are they more efficient? All this rhetoric is just like campaign promises... Short on substance!!! If a department needs a new building, fine. Just don't tell me they deserve it because they're volunteers. That's no reason to float a 6.5 million dollar bond.

I'd like to see some actual proof that this is the case. If a department can't fill out the initial response, what are they actually saving the taxpayer?

Sorry Seth, but that's BS. There is no reason to build a 6.5 million dollar BUILDING to house a handful of vehicles. Spend 3 Million on a modest building and invest the rest in training, FIREFIGHTING equipment and other necessities! That's a HUGE bond issue and one that given our current economy is likely to face opposition even from the Martha Stewarts and Lettermans of the world. They're only a small portion of the population. Gotta temper what would be nice with what do we need and what is responsible!!! Don't shoot yourselves in the foot with the "we're volunteers" thing because an argument could be made that you don't need much building because nobody's housed in it!!! You have a drill night, a meeting night, and other than that, the building is largely unoccupied. For that 6.5 million is needed???

To prevent future mishaps such as this, the MTA unveiled new signs today...

Blame the GPS. Blame the car. Blame the map. Blame the RR. Blame the train. Blame the car manufacturer. Blame the Town. Blame everyone but the guy driving the freakin' car!!! What a moron!!!

Very true but at least the Yankees were consistently lousy and didn't simply roll over and die during the last two weeks of the season blowing a lead!!! They never had a lead!!!!

I echo all that has been said already. Awesome job! It never ceases to amaze me how he gathers so much information on not only local stuff but regional and national stuff as well. Keep up the great work, Mike!

They rebuilt the bridge in MN in just over a year so if they really want to they can complete it faster.

ICS for Major and/or Complex Incidents (I-400) at the DES Training Center (4 Dana Road, Valhalla) on December 16-17 from 0830-1630. Completion of the I-300 course is a pre-requisite for this program. I_400_Westchester_Co_08.pdf Sign up via the link on the course announcement attached below. Do NOT call DES to register - they don't do it!

Intermediate ICS for Expanding Incidents (I-300) to be conducted at the DES Training Center (4 Dana Road, Valhalla) October 20, 22, 27, 29 and Saturday November 1. Everyone complains about no courses being available evenings or weekends so here's an opportunity for you. This will be the last 300 course in Westchester County this year so if you need it or want to take it, sign up for it! ICS300_08_Westchester_Co3.pdf Course announcement Registration info is on the announcement - do NOT call DES to register. They can't help you!

Here's the "hypothetical" scenario: a fire alarm is accidentally tripped by a child in a private residence. The alarm company dutifully notifies the FD and calls back the homeowner who confirms it was accidental and no emergency exists. This is conveyed to the dispatch center by the alarm company and by the first arriving PD unit (who was not parked in front of a hydrant). Despite this information, four pieces of apparatus and two chiefs responded all with lights and siren. Given the information at hand from both the homeowner and PD, why not respond "cold" to this call? I realize that the FD won't accept cancellations from anyone but why put everyone at risk by running hot unnecessarily? If the first due engine or chief responded hot I'd understand but to have the 3rd and 4th vehicles arriving even after the first due and chief seems like an unneccesary risk. We've discussed driving issues ad nauseum before but I felt compelled to ask why we still run lights and sirens to calls like this one and why won't the FD accept cancellations enroute or even before they're on the road?

Now we're talking about different scenarios. The situation that I started the thread about was a MANUAL activation of the fire alarm by a child (ooh, what's that red button do?), not a system activation by some other unknown cause and certainly not an inside smoke condition. OK, so you won't believe me when I say that there is no fire and to respond accordingly but when I say extrication is needed or its fully involved you will believe me. There's a double standard if I've ever heard one. So what will it take to actually get all of us on the same team for a change? Do we need to train together, work together, or what so that we will actually believe each other when we give an initial report? And for all these statements about the first due running hot and all others running cold, what country are we all talking about? I never see that - all I see are lights and all I hear are sirens! Time to start practicing what we all preach. Stay safe!

For a State Liquor Authority to get involved, the issue may have also been non-members drinking there. That would probably make it a bar and not a club in the eyes of the State (wasn't there an article about something like this in the Albany area posted here?) and make it an issue. To have 250 members but only 15 firefighters suggests to me that they lost sight of their primary focus and can use this as a wakeup call.

I wonder if any of the participants at this 4.5 hour parade are the same ones who complain about the duration of training and how much of an imposition it is to train for the job they are entrusted to perform? Smacks of hypocrisy to me... Hours and hours cleaning, polishing, waxing, etc. then a 4+ hour drive to a 4.5 hour parade plus "festivities" and then a 4.5 hour return drive. Gee, imagine if they spent that much time TRAINING. Interesting perspective Barry, what was Wildwood's ISO rating during this parade, a 1?

This isn't a slam against the fire service or anyone else associated with this particular call. In fact it isn't even about this particular call anymore, it's about the responsibilities of those who respond to the scene. The FD may respond with EMT's (even off-duty paramedics) but it is the responsibility of the paramedic assigned to the job (read on-duty) on the ALS unit/ambulance to make the decisions about treatment and transportation for a patient. There are plenty of clueless firemen but I also know plenty of clueless cops, EMT's and medics. Conversely, some of the smartest people I know also have those same titles. It just doesn't matter so don't get so defensive. FD may be a part of the EMS system and will likely be responsible for establishing an LZ but it won't be your certification on the line, it will be the EMT or medic with his/her name/number on the PCR. You want to make it better - have a meeting with your local EMS providers and discuss how you're going to handle medevac requests and adopt a policy for your area (i.e. FD/PD/other first responders put it on stand-by and EMS request a launch). Specify who is going to do what and how they're going to communicate these actions to each other. Failing that you're going to be back here with the same rant next time. You're not waiting for a "bus" to respond. You're waiting for the highest trained EMS provider with ultimate responsibility for the patient to arrive and decide. It shouldn't be a committee decision either. It should be the decision of the medic or EMT who is ultimately responsible for the patient's care - not just on the scene with the first responders but also during transportation. Education is the key! You're darn right! It almost always is. Excellent points, STAT! Thanks for that perspective! That's for sure! We are all on the same team and should really be able to work together better.

Is it just me or are steady red traffic signals optional these days? Did I miss the memo? I must see at least three such violations every day and not just the orange ones. I mean flagrant red lights with opposing traffic having green already. Is everyone else noticing this too?

You're probably right about the $$$$. That's why many jobs in Westchester went to all white - it simply cost too much to paint them funky color schemes. But, as nice as the white is I'm still partial to the black and white patrol car.

Link to complete article Do any agencies in this area have actual policies and procedures on when services will be suspended due to something like a hurricane or tropical storm? At what point does it become simply too dangerous to the responders?

I don't think it is hypocritical at all. The Governor wants people to VOLUNTEER. He's not enacting a billion dollar pork barrel for FASNY or any other special interest groups lobbying for their causes while at the same time cutting state programs and services. We've debated the cost/benefit/effectiveness/etc. of all kinds of "incentives" before so I'm not going to get into that again. As for a cabinet-level position dealing with the volunteer sector, I think it is a great idea.

I'd like to see the posts here the day after someone from the County issued such an order. As a fiercely territorial "home-rule" state (and reminded of it frequently), I'm surprised to see someone say that they expect the County to issue such a policy. This is not a regional evacuation order based on storm specific info or a public health order where the authority is vested with the State or County. This is an agency level policy decision and my personal opinion is that every agency should have an SOP now so pooremotionally based decisions aren't made during an emergency. FD's develop pre-plans for all manner of other emergencies, why not major storms? Barry, since you're the first to describe an actual policy let me ask a follow-up question... Does "hurricane" mean just that or would a tropical storm or Nor'easter also trigger the same actions? I see that regular thunder storms wouldn't qualify.

I'm sure it is only two seconds away - if you're sitting on the ramp with a full crew! But the time from tones to drive to the barn to get the rig to respond to the scene adds up VERY quickly.

Isn't it a religion down there? I remember passing a "stadium" and asking what college it was and being told it was just a high school...

No you're not, I was thinking the same thing.

I can certainly understand the team approach and the benefit of learning stuff from those that are best versed in their particular subject of expertise but there should be someone, a mentor, an FTO, an officer, that the probie can go to for guidance or clarification and who can monitor progress and insure that all the required subject matter is being covered. I think the program proposed by abaduck is a good one. The other thing that I'd say about the "field training" concept no matter how its handled is DOCUMENT DOCUMENT DOCUMENT! Make sure that the training that is covered is documented so everyone knows what has been covered and what doesn't need to be covered again or what still requires more emphasis to insure competency. Without oversight and documentation three different guys in the group may cover "A" and "B" thinking that C is being covered when in fact it hasn't been. Good topic!