helicopper

Factoring in the time to muster a crew and respond from Valhalla vs. on-duty crews responding from any of the SOTF jurisdictions, I'd say the response time concern is a wash. Even if the crews are assembled, I'd say the response time from Valhalla or White Plains is going to be within a few minutes. But, hey, this is just my opinion.

There's always the Taconic, there's always a police escort of a task force going somewhere else in the county, and there is always the pack mule option...

It would probably be a more cost efficient solution to contract with the Special Operations Task Force rather than create a whole new department. It already covers a chunk of the geography and probably 50-60% of the County population. Population = call volume, too so it is already responding to the majority of the work. Yes, this will probably be the road flare in the gas can!

Can you imagine how confusing it would be at the airport if you had to have a surveyor come out to determine if the crime or accident occurred in Rye Brook, Harrison, or North Castle? The same is true of the Kensico plaza and bike paths too. It would be far simpler and more efficient at every level to have a County PD and elminate most of the 42 little jobs - except for the four big cities. Imagine regionalized communications dispatching the closest car to a crime in progress and every other car in the area knowing about it and being get into the area to look for suspects? Now we have to wait for a dispatcher to process the job, dispatch a car, the car to get there, broadcast confirmation of the crime and a description, the dispatcher to reguritate all that via the hotline and for all the other dispatchers to radio the info to cops that could have been in the right place had they known about it a few minutes sooner. As for OT, the County for years has kept our full-time numbers low and paid for additional coverage with OT because it's cheaper than another full-time employee with pension, benefits, etc. - at least according to the bean counters. Neither North Castle, Harrison, or Rye Brook has the numbers of cops necessary to cover the airport so they'd have to hire a substantial number - adding to the taxes of the taxpayers in those three towns - to cover a facility that serves far more than just those three towns. It is far more equitable to have that cost borne by the County as a whole. Then you have pistol permits, civil processes, and warrant/fugitive unit that are mandated by State Law to be performed by the "Sheriff" or in our case County PD. Who will do these jobs, every town/village/city? Come on, that would be horribly inefficient. There are proabably far better examples to support eliminating County government than the police.

But the County PD has a patrol division where all the officers who eventually get into the units you describe above first get their law enforcement experience. You can't have a rookie police officer graduate from the police academy and be immediately assigned to a specialized unit. The staff firefighters in this "special" department would need substantial experience and a means of keeping it. If they're only going to see a few responses a year, they're never going to keep up with changes in technology, tactics, and skills. Now, if you want to seriously discuss consolidation/regionalization or simply the sharing of existing resources - that's a good topic!!!! You wouldn't be the first person to say it - even in jest. The reality is that the County would realize very little profit by elminating our unit and selling off the helicopters. The old helicopter is not worth much - except to those who fly it - and the new helicopter was purchased in part with grant money so it may not even be permissible to sell it. If it did get sold, at least some of the money would have to reimburse the grant program that funded it initially. Beyond that you've got the salaries of existing employees and some fuel/maintenance savings. Not a tremendous windfall.

Gotcha.

I'm sure that this will be an interesting and lively discussion. One perspective - it isn't the County taxes that are making us the highest taxed in the nation. It is SCHOOL TAXES. If you were to eliminate County government (an impossibility but we'll just go with it) there would only be a decrease of about 18-24 percent on your taxes. THEN add all the new services formerly provided by the County that must now be provided by your local municipality. I'm guessing it won't be much of a decrease (if any). Now, you have parks with either no maintenance or they become town parks open only to town residents excluding all the prior users from neighboring communities. Social services still needs to be administered and it won't be by done by the state. Many local communities will need to add to their police forces because of the void left by the dissolution of the County PD. How will the airport, Kensico Dam, bike paths, and other "multi-jurisdictional" properties be policed? Who will administer police and fire training? This is currently provided by the County and while some will argue that it can be done better, who will do it for everyone? Many functions (including Social Services, services of the sheriff, health department, etc.) are mandated by State Law and delegated to the counties. If the County government is elminated, how do all these statutory obligations continue to be performed? All that said, don't misunderstand me. I'm absolutely certain that the County government could be run BETTER but to eliminate it doesn't seem like the answer to me.

Aren't all the utilities represented in the EOC during a major storm? Do we need a rep in the EOC and in 60-Control? What about all the communities not served by 60?

My biggest issue with the idea is the current state of the economy and County budget. With County agencies that have existing full-time mandates being forced to do more with less or simply do without, why take on the burden of a specialty department that would be idle the majority of the time. Thankfully, the need for such resources in Westchester is pretty limited and a large portion of the calls where such a response would be warranted occurs in areas covered by existing full-time resources. You already identified the need to properly staff and compensate the staff at 60-Control. Do you think that would happen with a new fire department on the payroll? How will the team maintain their skills? If they're strictly a specialty department, or even if they take over the Grasslands Fire Brigade, the call volume is such that they could go weeks without a real incident to operate at. To mandate cross training as a paramedic further exacerbates this problem; they'll never see the call volume to stay sharp with ALS skills so I wouldn't want them working on me or my loved ones or operating under extremely stressful conditions like a haz-mat or confined area job. And, I'm sure others will point out, that the departments already covered by career departments with these resources will be paying twice; once for their local and once for the County. With taxes skyrocketing already, this is simply not a viable plan. However, the consolidation or regionalization of departments may create the opportunity to accomplish many of the things you speak of - if people get past the 150 years of tradition impeding progress.

Would calling in a contractor with a large excavator have worked? Use the bucket to scrape the hay off the roof to expose the stuff your saw can cut or just punch through the whole roof? Given how big and how long this fire was going, the response time of a contractor may not have been so bad... (just a thought from a non-fire guy with too active an imagination)

Would it be feasible to merge/consolidate Fairview with Arlington and Hyde Park to spread the cost over a larger tax base and reduce the overall operating expenses? What do these petition pushers propose for fire coverage if Fairview is eliminated? If Arlington and/or Hyde Park are to provide coverage, won't they be taxing the same people essentially the same amount?

Honest opinion, you're better off going directly to a trauma center (do not pass go, do not collect $200) unless there are compelling reasons not to (such as an unmanageable airway, cardiac arrest, etc.). The scenario becomes far more complicated if you go first to a local hospital. Now its an interfacility transport with all the attendant regulations, requirements, and BS. And even if my opinion were to the contrary, protocol is protocol. Trauma centers guarantee levels of service that are simply not avialable in community hospitals. Surgeons, C-T/MRI scanners, etc. ny10570 - I think you got 'em all! You asked the question. You got answers from past and present Empress employees plus others knowledgable on the subject and you want us to get back to you? Come on, really? Honestly, what's your problem with Empress transporting from Yonkers to the right place? Feel free to request the statistics from the Department of Health if you don't believe us but I'm at a loss for why the "numbers" are such an issue for you - unless you were just hired as VP of Marketing at one of the Yonkers hospitals...

For those of us not familar, what does this category allow for?

Candidates for a trauma center, burn center, or other specialty service should be transported to such a facility. None of the local hospitals within the City of Yonkers (or Bronxville) are trauma centers or have burn units requiring transportation out of the city for such services. Statistically I doubt the "majority" are transported out of the city; it is just the noteworthy cases going to trauma/burn centers that call attention to the process. This is not an Empress practice; it is compliance with NYS EMS protocols. Applicable excerpt from NYS Protocol (emphasis added)

Point of clarification - the post to which your refer does not state the County is giving people a shirt and sending them out to perform a rescue. The post in question challenges the overall capabilities of the team while acknowledging that there are trained and experienced individuals on it. This can (and I'm sure will be) debated for some time to come but let us not misinterpret things. Some legitimate questions about team (not individual member) qualifications and capabilities have been asked - why don't we seek the answers to either support the argument or put it to rest? There is no reason to engage in a negative exchange with a member who is skeptical; simply prove him wrong. If he is right, however, the statement about ignoring deficiencies (below) is a valid one.

I'm not going to say anything regarding any Westchester team or its capabilities, I'm just going to comment on the statement quoted above. Standards it sets for itself? Really? So somebody can establish standards that say two guys in a pick-up truck with a handful of 2x4's and bump caps that responds within 24 hours can be a technical rescue team? There has to be objective, realistic, and comprehensive standards for any kind of specialty team. NFPA or FEMA may set such standards and the bar should be set there, there should be no special considerations for anyone (paid or volunteer) because the rescue/haz-mat/tactical/etc. situation isn't going to discriminate. NIMS also requires resource typing and this can not work without universal standards for teams as well as other resources. Though the FEMA resource typing guide doesn't describe response time criteria for any of the resources, there absolutely should be some kind of standard for response times too. Before casting aspersions on the new Westchester County team, why don't we all wait and see what it is going to be able to do for us and then judge. As for making this a career vs. paid or jurisdiction A vs. jurisdiction B debate, such comments will not be tolerated. They are counter-productive and inflammatory. Please be respectful and remember it's OK to agree to disagree!

Why don't we chalk this up to a unique resolution to a very dangerous situation. From the perspective that the building was safely and effectively and evacuated and the suspect taken into custody with no injury to the child or police it was a success. I can certainly understand the concern about police using fire uniforms or equipment as urban camoflauge and if they were doing routine narcotics enforcement or regular surveillance I'd be the first to agree with you. Given the circumstances, it was the best they had so they went with it. Don't knock them for it. If you really want to raise the "safety" flag, why do so many EMS uniforms resemble tactical police uniforms?

The article only refers to the impact on the NYC 911 system. Has anyone reported on the impact to the rest of the state? Things are only going to get worse for all of us!

I think there's a difference between reading an IA and stopping at an accident scene/incident to gawk. Obviously there's a difference between the public and emergency responders/media/photographers/etc.

This is being done by the government here in the US in sensitive locations, around critical infrastructure, and even in lower Manhattan. There is no expectation of privacy on a public roadway (numerous court cases had established this). I understand your concern about tracking people but this is only at certain select locations. E-Zpass is more of a tracker than plate cameras will ever be but everyone installed that in their cars voluntarily.

What's the problem with it. Nassau and Suffolk are among the highest paid PD's on the east coast. It's just a statement of fact...

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/localnews/con...8dui.html?imw=Y In another recent thread I brought up the fact that despite all the hype, NY courts don't take DWI seriously. This sounds a little bit more proactive.

Don't know what the big deal is. They're not telling the guy he has to resign from the department, he just has to give up the civil service title of chief or take and pass a civil service exam for the position. Now the Village is going to circumvent civil service rules and testing requirements and call it an "officer-in-charge". Business as usual and NY politics at their finest. :angry:

Another perspective... (Come on, you had to know this is what I meant. )

Congratulations to all those promoted and good luck in your new positions.